Daniel Radcliffe again

[Needmoresleep]

Perhaps he feels that his profile needs a boost.

Dinner party from hell? Daniel Radcliffe, Tom Daley…..who else?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11961329/Harry-Potter-star-Daniel-Radcliffe-says-adult-worries-kids-transitioning-gender-condescending.html

To be honest - Matt Walsh was being a bit of a twat. Not for what he initially said about sex roles, male as protector is a role I can appreciate (though as with most stereotypes its female equivalent Mamma Bear exists too) But I just didn't believe what he said about his sons. Well ok I'm sure it's fine by him if his sonds don't like superheroes but I can't see him being too chuffed if they did an Az Hakeem and toted a case full of Barbie dolls around and spent their time happily dressing the dolls up. And I very much wonder what he would have done about it if they had.

Indeed. It would be interesting to hear whether he thought they were no longer "real boys" if they did this. Or if this was OK in his world of "gender roles". But if they aren't real boys, and sex is binary, are they now.. girls?

Much to unpick. It would certainly be an interesting debate were it ever to happen.

I'm pretty sure he has commented on the example of boys playing with dolls, and he said it was OK.

Now if they stuck with being very gender non-conforming, maybe he wouldn't be so happy.

I like that he cancelled Dan who cancelled JKR.

Matt is correct that people are going along with an evil ideology.

Matt is traditional, Conservative and Catholic. Blue was traditionally a femine colour due to association with the Virgin Mary. Matt would view blue being associated with boys as a modern idea. His gender role ideas are associated with boys providing for and protecting a large family on one income.

Of course it is true that as a child he was essentially exiled from most other children, educated mainly on set with the other child actors. He has said himself that he is not very gifted academically. Many other child actors who have made far less money and been less famous have not enjoyed very happy later lives.

The big problem, though, is that the part he was playing was of a powerful person who could manipulate reality, behave in a way which transcended gravity, for example. So he has rather less grasp on reality than if he had been playing a child in a ‘normal’ school setting, coping with the realities of, for example, working parents on low wages.

Peter Pan, really. Who never grew up.

Peter Pan, really. Who never grew up.

Peter pan wants to expand the number of lost boys by making them permanently pre pubesant... interesting

It's funny how he is always perceived as significantly younger than he is, rather than a middle aged man.

It be a height thing, being teased and taking the tesing seriously.

He and Prince Harry really are cut from the same cloth, aren’t they?

The sort of people who latch onto every trend a couple of years too late, and are only as intelligent as the last person they talked to.

I've just seen anorexia described as a 'craze' in this thread, comparable to 'trans'. It's really not.

Can you elaborate on why not?

Well for a start EDs have been around forever. Literally. Sure there seems to have been an uptick. But that could be down to more reporting.
It's a complex area linked with control and change and depression and anxiety as well as unhappiness about an individual's body. In fact it's rarely about losing weight.

I narrowly dodged getting entrenched in an ED in the 1980s and sadly my DD has one now - tho is doing well now.

I really take exception to such a complex set of behaviours (not just anorexia) being lumped into the same zone as a 'craze'

I deliberately didn't tag the culprit but wanted the throwaway thought interrogated

Plus there's been clinical agreement on EDs for a long time. Not so with the trans issue I would say.

@faffadoodledo all the best to you and your daughter. I don't know the original post and cba arsed to look for it, perhaps 'craze' was a poor choice of words. There does seem to be a similarity in some (probably not all) cases, with social contagion and other things.

@IcakethereforeIam very few similarities. EDs are rarely about body dysphoria. They begin as a means of exerting control and generally proceed that way. There is a lot of literature on it.
Craze is indeed a poor choice of word. To say the least.

@faffadoodledo I'm a master mistress of understatement

I get that it is not about losing weight and more about control - the two people I know closest to me who developed ED it has been more like OCD. For one, a teenager, it was prompted by veganism and online groups pushing a purity spiral. But OCD is closely related to Body Dysmorphic Disorder. I don’t see a clear line between this and trans though.

The line isn't that there are similarities in the conditions themselves. But that there is a clear pattern of social contagion in teenage girls with these conditions. As well as with with forms of self harm like cutting, the trend of claiming to have Dissociative Identity Disorder or the case of the town where most of the teenage girls 'got' Tourettes.

There is a well documented contagion element to eating disorders - this article is about bulimia: www.thecut.com/article/how-bulimia-became-a-medical-diagnosis.html and a slightly less accessible paper on anorexia citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/document?repid=rep1&type=pdf&doi=586288c2cdebc2f6fa8fbd8e8f3646782912fd60

Doesn't make it a craze. For an ED to happen the conditions to seed it have to be there in the first place. It won't just happen if someone gives it a go because their mate does.
The one I've observed at close quarters was quite unique. The behaviours which developed around it were too.
Calling it a craze and comparing it with a trans 'craze' is so very wrong

I have had EDs all my life and see a lot of parallels, there is a chapter in Hadley Freeman's Good Girls where several former GIDS clinicians make the same connections. Anorexia is mental illness with highest death rate, understanding there's a social contagion element doesn't (to me) diminish it's seriousness or the suffering caused.

Correction: all my life since my teens. The teen onset is one of the many parallels.

While I agree with you that the word 'craze' is inappropriate, there is a well documented element of social contagion with trans identifying girls, eating disorders, tics etc.

Because you don't feel it is personally relevant doesn't make it untrue. There is a huge amount of study on the phenomenon

I feel strongly that the term diminishes and dismisses the seriousness of the condition. There are parallels between many conditions. Doesn't mean they need to lumped together in the same dismissive way.
Using the word 'craze' makes it appear like it's something that is transitory and will disappear in a puff of smoke just as it might have arrived. It doesn't. And you will only be 'infected' with the contagion if the mental health conditions are right (or wrong).
MN has always been a supportive and understanding place for EDs. Not so much the trans issue. By lumping them together what does that say about attitudes towards EDs? Dismissive at best I'd say.

There is plenty of evidence that eating disorders are driven by social contagion. It doesn't mean every individual with an eating disorder developed it because of contagion but it does mean that an awful lot do. If you understand how very serious eating disorders are, then you also have to understand why it's so very, very important that we understand why so many of them occur as that's essential to be able to prevent that kind of occurrence.

As for the seeds having to be there. The seeds have to be there for girls to go trans too. Just because there is clearly contagion doesn't mean that there aren't other factors. Not every girl succumbs to social contagion. Understanding that the contagion exists and working out why some are more affected than others is important to help those affected now and to prevent it in the future. But pretending the link isn't there will hamper that.