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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions
DodoPatrol · 12/04/2023 08:41

Seriously, this child doesn’t understand why they can’t ‘decide to be a girl’? Has nobody mentioned the actual differences between the sexes? The reproductive role? The huge overlap in mental ability and personality? The much wider gap in physical ability, post puberty? The impossibility of switching anything but superficial aspects of appearance? (OK , you might need shorter words for an 11 year old, and possibly also for Daniel.)

Daniel is an actor, talking to a child. Both think ‘you are who you believe you are’ is a useful, even vital mantra for their life. Hey ho.

bellinisurge · 12/04/2023 08:44

"please keep talking about me". When he watches his partner having a baby, maybe he'll learn some biological reality.

CountZacular · 12/04/2023 08:48

Daley added: 'I don't understand why I can't just decide that I'm a girl. If it's a big decision to decide I'm a girl, it's a big decision to decide I'm a boy.'

This child is 11. Surely their parents would have told them when they can’t just decide they are a girl/ aged 25/ different race/ a dog/ born into an incredibly wealthy family/ a child prodigy.

We learn, from guidance of our parents and other adults around us that the circumstances of our birth, our genetics and our heritage are unchangeable. There would be no kindness is telling a child they could just decide to be any of those things as it’s not physically possible.

It’s so galling to hear a feckless adult nod along to fantasy rather than show real kindness and be honestly with children. Especially when we know what the consequences are.

Ingenieur · 12/04/2023 08:49

@Louiseandsophie

Might go to school dressed as a boy or a girl

I think a lot of the issue around "dressing like a girl" are that it reinforces the stereotypes that we're trying to move away from.

I always liked the way Izzard phrased it before he went off the deep end: They're not women's clothes, they're my clothes!

Fukuraptor · 12/04/2023 08:58

I'm so disappointed (but not surprised) that even when children show him that they are making these decisions based upon stereotypes and don't understand the difference between accepting reality and rejecting it in favour of a fantasy, that he cannot see they are too young.

Why don't we let children get tattoos, Daniel? They know who they are.

quiteathome · 12/04/2023 08:59

When my DD was small around 3 or 4 she asked me when she was going to grow a willy. I said you won't because you are a girl. She also like pretending to be Spiderman. If she did that these days a stupid parent would probably assume she was trans. Instead of a girl who has a brother and likes superheroes.

PuttingDownRoots · 12/04/2023 09:02

When Daniel was 12, was he in charge of his own film contract or was a parent dealing with the lawyers etc?

SisterWendyBuckett · 12/04/2023 09:11

We are all born the sex we are. Nothing can change that.

To encourage and enable children to believe that they are born in the wrong sex because they don't conform to gender stereotypes is appalling.

It might sound wonderfully progressive and child-centred but the reality is they will feel compelled to begin an experimental, brutal medical regimen against their biological reality.

It's lazy and dangerous thinking. It's taking an ideological stand in the face of science and facts. It's betraying children and young people and subjecting them to physical harm.

How about encouraging true freedom of thought and freedom of expression Daniel? So that every child is able
to feel of value and worth within the immutable reality of their own bodies.

Rightsraptor · 12/04/2023 09:18

I wonder if Radcliffe being an actor has anything to do with his views. After all, he did persuade us all he was a wizard and he clearly is not. I read a critique by an actor of those of us who say 'acting is pretending to be something you are not'. He said it's finding that character within yourself, we all have the murderer, the charmer, the fool deep within us and an actor has to find that and bring it out.

I'm not sure what point I am making really, apart from Radcliffe, as an actor since childhood, has a skewed view of reality. As we can see.

BonfireLady · 12/04/2023 09:21

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 07:54

I don't care. I say let kids be kids. If they want to play with trucks and dress in overalls all their childhood life let them, if they want to play with Barbie's etc and dress as princesses all their childhood lives, let them....if they're happy. If other people complain, naysay etc, then it's their problem. If they outwardly express their discuss to the parent or child, they it's their problem, they're the negative and need to let it go. Barbie child and overall child might go to school dressed as a boy or a girl.. as long as they're happy and learning and have stability, friends and are able to push negativity away and accept opinions as they are.. opinions, but still carry on as they were, then fair enough. I don't think a parent should decide their child's gender. I think they should embrace who their child is, not push them in any direction and accept who they turn out to be as long as the child is happy and surrounded by happiness. I used to paint a beard in my face and dress as a 'male' burglar for god's sake, I'd help my dad change plugs and saw through wood etc... I was happy, they didn't push or decide and I'm a happy woman with two DC and a husband I adore, plenty of friends and no regrets.. my parents didn't dictate nor choose who I was. I was just a happy little child. End.

I don't think a parent should decide their child's gender

May I ask what you mean by gender in this comment?

I didn't like dresses until I was in my 20s, I climbed trees and built Lego, I did play with Barbie/Sindy dolls but mostly when my brother was there too with his Action Man and the giant tank... My parents let us both be kids and supported our choices without stereotyping, but at the same time they were aware that I was biologically a girl and my brother was a boy. Our choices of toys and clothing would have had no impact on this biological knowledge for them.

However, if we follow the logic that Daniel is supporting.. and if I'd been told at school in RHSE/story time that I could be a different "gender" to match how I felt (the clothes I wore, the toys I played with), I could well imagine that being attractive to me. Particularly during my awkward teenage phase where I never felt attractive as a girl. And in this context "gender" is now more important than biological sex for many children, hence them requesting hormones of the opposite sex in the belief that it will fix their problems.

FrancescaContini · 12/04/2023 09:22

PuttingDownRoots · 12/04/2023 09:02

When Daniel was 12, was he in charge of his own film contract or was a parent dealing with the lawyers etc?

Hm. Interesting question. I wonder.

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 09:23

123ZYX · 12/04/2023 08:24

Are you suggesting that liking things not stereotypically matching their sex makes a child trans?

Surely to "let kids be kids" means saying "you're a boy who likes Barbies, that's fine, like whatever you like" instead of "you're a male who likes Barbies, so you must a a girl in the wrong body".?

I mean, do whatever, like whatever, just enjoy your life.. I have a DS and DD, they played with trucks and Barbie's, both dressed in pink and blue... Sometimes DS would dress as a princess, DD would be a Builder... Stereotypes, stereotyped roles, colours... I didn't care.. they're very much 'stereotypical' boy and girl now... I just let them be kids.. they were and are happy and do what they like to do...

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 09:27

BonfireLady · 12/04/2023 09:21

I don't think a parent should decide their child's gender

May I ask what you mean by gender in this comment?

I didn't like dresses until I was in my 20s, I climbed trees and built Lego, I did play with Barbie/Sindy dolls but mostly when my brother was there too with his Action Man and the giant tank... My parents let us both be kids and supported our choices without stereotyping, but at the same time they were aware that I was biologically a girl and my brother was a boy. Our choices of toys and clothing would have had no impact on this biological knowledge for them.

However, if we follow the logic that Daniel is supporting.. and if I'd been told at school in RHSE/story time that I could be a different "gender" to match how I felt (the clothes I wore, the toys I played with), I could well imagine that being attractive to me. Particularly during my awkward teenage phase where I never felt attractive as a girl. And in this context "gender" is now more important than biological sex for many children, hence them requesting hormones of the opposite sex in the belief that it will fix their problems.

I mean biological gender.

Slothtoes · 12/04/2023 09:28

I’ve become extremely suspicious of the motives of adults who argue for the [insert your own adjective here] ‘liberation of children’

Just the glaring entitlement to be pronouncing on an issue Radcliffe clearly knows fuck all about. The glaring lack of critical thinking. The incautious wish to adultify and venerate every young child who says the magic word ‘trans’.

What is Daniel Radcliffe, (or the adults who have persuaded him this is a good idea), getting out of him trying to be a figurehead for transitioning of young kids?

JulieHoney · 12/04/2023 09:29

When you mean sex, just say sex, @Louiseandsophie

FrancescaContini · 12/04/2023 09:31

I didn’t realise Daniel’s wife /partner is due to give birth sometime soon. I’ll be really interested to see if using car seats and stair gates / cutting up chewy food / not letting toddlers run around near ponds and rivers or play with matches / going to school in the correct uniform etc will all be seen as “condescending” in his eyes because, y’know, kids can make their own decisions.

Or whether DR will regret everything he’s ever said about children once the full responsibility and sheer terror of parenting lands on him.

FrancescaContini · 12/04/2023 09:32

@Louiseandsophie There is no “biological gender”.

Ofcourseshecan · 12/04/2023 09:33

123ZYX · 12/04/2023 08:24

Are you suggesting that liking things not stereotypically matching their sex makes a child trans?

Surely to "let kids be kids" means saying "you're a boy who likes Barbies, that's fine, like whatever you like" instead of "you're a male who likes Barbies, so you must a a girl in the wrong body".?

No, LouiseandSophie is a woman who liked ‘boy’ things when she was young (so did I), and her parents accepted that and let her grow up unharmed by sex stereotyping! So did mine. Thank god.

Slothtoes · 12/04/2023 09:34

CuriouslyDifferent that sounds really difficult Flowers

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 09:35

JulieHoney · 12/04/2023 09:29

When you mean sex, just say sex, @Louiseandsophie

Why, 'Born a certain sex' means exactly the same as 'Born a certain gender' does it not? Born a boy biologically, born a girl biologically, biology determines a girl or boy... The sex I was born is female, I am of the female sex. Enough?

Animalsoffartingwood · 12/04/2023 09:35

FrancescaContini · 12/04/2023 09:31

I didn’t realise Daniel’s wife /partner is due to give birth sometime soon. I’ll be really interested to see if using car seats and stair gates / cutting up chewy food / not letting toddlers run around near ponds and rivers or play with matches / going to school in the correct uniform etc will all be seen as “condescending” in his eyes because, y’know, kids can make their own decisions.

Or whether DR will regret everything he’s ever said about children once the full responsibility and sheer terror of parenting lands on him.

Don't be silly. Daniel knows what a woman really is. It's the baby carrying device he will be getting to do all the parent grunt work.

OldCrone · 12/04/2023 09:36

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 09:27

I mean biological gender.

By biological gender do you mean sex?

Parents can't decide their children's sex. Sex is based on biology and can’t be changed.

Datun · 12/04/2023 09:38

He was told at the round table by 11-year-old trans girl, Daley: 'I learned out of the cradle that I was a boy: "I should like blue, I should like sports, I should be manly, I should like superheroes".'

As Radcliffe nodded, she continued: 'And I never associated myself with those things and we are told that we are not old enough to know this yet. I am only 11-years-old, how do I know I'm a girl?

The lack of comprehension is so frustrating.

Radcliffe is an adult who has decided to have a public opinion about all this. You'd think the least he could do is find out why women like J. K. Rowling are gender critical. And what it actually means.

Louiseandsophie

Yes, of course children can play with whatever they like, girls can play with trucks and boys can play with dolls. They're just toys. Blue and pink are just colours. And in fact, pink used to signify masculinity, as it's close to red (also considered masculine).

The point is, none of this changes a child's sex. And these children are being raised to believe that if a girl likes boys' toys, she's probably a boy.

It's utterly sexist.

See the boy in the article, maintaining that because they are supposed to like blue, and don't, they are actually a girl.

It's dangerous claptrap.

KimWexlersPonyTail · 12/04/2023 09:39

I do wonder if DR has chosen trans as his cause to have some sort of relevancy. He got the HP gig based on his looks, I don't think he will ge bothering the Academy Awards anytime soon. Theres a really weird interview he did with Graham Norton when DR recites the periodic tables, like a child trying to entertain the older relatives. Its totally cringey and I felt embarrassed for him.

Louiseandsophie · 12/04/2023 09:42

OldCrone · 12/04/2023 09:36

By biological gender do you mean sex?

Parents can't decide their children's sex. Sex is based on biology and can’t be changed.

Yes, when a midwife tells you the gender of your baby, the sex of your baby... Used to be as simple as that.. born a boy, might grow up to feel you were born in the wrong body, now you can change sex, change gender... But you're born what you're born. I just want people to be happy jeez.

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