Is the Trans shooter in Nashville Male or Female?

[Tradeup]

The murderer who came in and killed 3 children and 3 adults is trans and called Audrey, I am confused as to their biological sex.

Weird. Presumably the victim wouldn’t be expected to pretend in court that the man who raped her was a tree?

My father was a police officer.

There’s a tenuous claim to expertise. 🙄

Would you consult someone about a health condition on the basis that their father was a doctor? Thought not.

Do you think it right that if a woman is testifying in court about being raped, and the man who raped her currently identifies as a woman, she should be required and reminded throughout to refer to her rapist using she / her pronouns?

If that’s the case then Forbes are also saying there have only been 172 mass shootings in the U.S., so it can’t have been referring to all of them since 1966. There have been over 130 so far this year. Something weird about that stat.

@Ciswomansson
If your name is Tree, I will use that to refer to you or address you. Your name is your choice. Your sex is not and nobody anointed you Lord of English Grammar.

Might be a difference in how a mass shooting event is defined?

I haven't checked the data on this context, but I did look for this about something else and found that some statistics define a mass killing event as being one where at least four people die, others use different rules such as including people who were harmed but did not die in the victim counts.

School shootings are any cases where a gun is used on school premises, even if the bullet doesn't hurt anyone, so the data on these will cover a large number of cases, some not serious in terms of victims, others very much so.

From the Violence Project website, on methodology:

Some sources define a mass shooting as any incident in which three or more victims were shot and killed, not including the perpetrator, while others use a threshold of four or more killed. Other sources define a mass shooting as any incident in which four or more people were shot or injured, which greatly increases the incident count. Some sources include domestic violence, gang conflict, drug trade disputes, or robberies in their numbers. At The Violence Project, we focus on mass public shootings, defined by the Congressional Research Service as follows:

“a multiple homicide incident in which four or more victims are murdered with firearms—not including the offender(s)—within one event, and at least some of the murders occurred in a public location or locations in close geographical proximity (e.g., a workplace, school, restaurant, or other public settings), and the murders are not attributable to any other underlying criminal activity or commonplace circumstance (armed robbery, criminal competition, insurance fraud, argument, or romantic triangle).”

That is pretty restrictive. No wonder they think there have been less than 200 in the past 57 years. I wouldn’t want to draw too many conclusions about shooter characteristics from data which excludes incidents like the Michigan State University shooting because only 3 students actually died and those critically injured recovered.

Anyone think it was a false flag?

Unfortunately that’s how it is. To acknowledge that the person who committed the rape is male is considered hate speech. TIMs’ feelings matter more than accurate reporting and record keeping and certainly more than women’s safety. Usually violent crimes committed by TIMs disappear into a memory hole within a week. Take Nikki Secondino’s murder of his father, for example. There’s been nothing about it since a few days after it happened, and only the Conservative papers would even say the he was a natal male. The same thing happened with Dana Carver.

American is headed for a national divorce. These two political groups are so far apart in their world view they aren't able to tolerate each other.

That would make reporting of crimes in the media confusing. It could be misleading to the audience, unless there is a clear policy of saying something like, "trans identified biological male / female"

It could mess up crime statistics. Crimes need to go down by biological sex. You can also have the category of gender identity if you want, but that can't replace accurately recording someone's biological sex.

I'm open to using preferred pronouns in some cases, but it's a courtesy. In the case of a rapist in court they simply don't deserve politeness in that situation.

The parents are going to get blamed for this aren’t they? And AH is going to be seen as a victim who was prevented from being who they truly were and left with no other option than to shoot up a school.

Nobody in the world thinks that this was a false flag.

Except for morons and Alex Jones supporters … though I am not sure why I need to separate these people into two different groups.

It will start with Christians deserving it, then TERFS and so on, it will spread internationally.

I see a teen boy in Canada featured on the Twitter feed of Jordan Peterson was attacked.

The same thing happened with Dana Carver.

Dana Rivers (formerly David Warfield) is the MTF trans murderer of the lesbian couple Charlotte Reed and Patricia Wright and their 19 year old son Benny.

https://afterellen.com/trans-activist-dana-rivers-found-guilty-of-murdering-lesbian-couple-and-their-son/

Dana Carvey is Garth in Wayne's World, are you thinking of his name?

Apparently the press secretary in Arizona resigned.

www.azcentral.com/story/news/politics/arizona/2023/03/29/arizona-gov-hobbs-spokesperson-josselyn-berry-resigns-after-tweet/70060504007/

No 1 rule of doing communications and PR for organisations, don't become the story!

No. Just you.

@TitterYeeNot

You think the children and adults murdered never actually existed and somehow nobody has confirmed they didn't exist, and instead a whole community is lying by sharing their made up memories of the made up victims? Catch yourself on 🙄

I think this person is implying something worse.

I think it’s @MNHQ haven’t deleted the conspiracy theorist type post.

Speculating that the murder of children and staff at a school was a ‘false flag operation’ cannot possibly be ‘in the spirit’ of anything.

The untouchable caste is quite telling. It reveals the political blind spot enormously. The Republicans say it can't be guns, the Democrats say it can't be because of online extremist grooming.

Reality check: these incidents don't happen because of singular reasons. They happen because of multiple failings.

It will be a combination of factors; eg online grooming, lack of appropriate mental health support, availability of guns because ridicilously easy, parents being rigid in their faith and being homophobic, a traumatic incident that acts as a trigger.

If you take one of these factors away, the incident may well not have happened - that places the head burying on both the left and right as very much part of the problem - its not an either / or. Its a failure of society as a whole to spot the crisis in an individual.

Ultimately the individual remains to blame, but safeguarding is about providing that safety net to protect innocent parties. There is a failure of safe guarding thats occurred, almost certainly on multiple fronts.

Would this incident have happened in the UK? Well its much more unlikely, because someone under psychiatric care couldn't easily stockpile seven guns. Even where this goes wrong, there's a different response. There was a recent case where there was a spree killing involving a man who was recently given his gun licence back - and our society is now looking at this decision closely precisely because there is a clear line of responsibility in a failure of safeguarding. This means that there is a mechanism to make changes to stop it happening again. This wouldn't happen in the US.

Equally, if its found to have a connection to online grooming / extremist trans activism, I do think the UK not being so split along political lines (certainly compared to even 12 months ago), we'd be more willing as a society to review and look at safeguarding failures. Certainly its starting to be taken seriously in schools by the government and I think we will start to see change before the next GE and even then I think we've passed the point where parents will allow roll back now. The momentum is there and we aren't confined by this religious stand off.

What really concerns me at this point, is the escalation in the openess in encouraging violence by trans extremists. We have always said on MN that the reaction of the narcassitic elements of the movement to being told no, would be this escalation, because that follows the pattern of male violence. And within that, its the continued lack of silence by people in authority to have a zero tolerance attitude to that. And thats STILL not happening. And thats where both the UK and US are going to remain vulnerable to potential incidents being legitimised.

I still think we are due another significant tragedy before the penny starts to drop about the extremist element which needs reining in and safeguarded against. Its there, as clear as day, if people were paying the attention they should rather than putting on their political blinkers are going 'well its not our fault, its the fault of x'.

And one of the most telling features of the trans activist movement is this constant culture of blame deflection - we've seen it with Mermaids in the UK quite magnificently, but they certainly are not the only ones guilty of that. This incident is being framed in the same way.

ALL movements that want to be respected and taken seriously, need to keep their own houses in order and know when to clear house of their own nutty elements for their own benefit. Transactivism really isn't prepared to do any level of self reflection because its so entrenched in its own sense of victimhood. Thats deeply deeply unhealthy.

For me I think the underlying issue then becomes about comorbid issues - why are autistic people drawn to the ideology, does the ideology work to make them part of society or to alienate them further, if they are alienated further what impact does it have on their mental health which might already be poor, if their mental health is poor are trans ideological beliefs which frame counselling to address unlying issues actively causing increased disengagment with appropriate care, do these transactivism extremists online prey on these vulnerabilities and groom kids and young adults in a way thats dangerous to the rest of society?

Thats certainly not saying that trans people = bad. Thats saying that the culture online surrounding transactivism is utterly toxic and its leaking into real world consequences. That is saying that absoluetely needs to be tackled head on. In many ways for the best interests of those vulnerable people who are trans identifying.

Instead we have this fucking dreadful narrative of the far right / christain right v poor little trans people who are totally victimised and innocent. Its so fucked in the head.

The police have stated that they will be making the manifesto of the shooter public. I fully expect more justifying of the murder of innocent kids as a result.

I grew up understanding its never as simple as 'bad v good' because of what I saw first hand as a 14 year old. People don't do bad things for no reason at all. There is always a massive backstory you have to unpick, piece by piece. But ultimately you don't solve the problem without both sides coming to a conclusion that they need to come together and work together in condeming violent behaviour - and THEN working back from that point on dismantling the multiple driving forces behind it. The ongoing Republican v Democratic clash on this, prevents any level of sanity prevailing. And that means we are doomed to a cycle of repeat and escalation until a tipping point is eventually hit. Fuck knows where that lies, if its not with the murder of six people including three kids.

This is a great post. I agree with absolutely every word.

Hmm. I think in this case the killer was more along the lines of an MK Ultra operative.

I could see a government rationalising that killing a few people now will save millions in the future if it will grease the wheels of support for stricter gun legislation.

The confusing trans aspect was also useful as this area is getting out of hand.