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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly

271 replies

RoyalCorgi · 05/12/2022 09:49

Talking about why she left the Guardian!

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001fvx6

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AmaryllisNightAndDay · 06/12/2022 15:44

And thanks so much @nauticant for the transcript Flowers

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 06/12/2022 16:22

When did parents become so desperate for their children's approval that it prevents them doing their jobs and acting on their consciences properly?

When their children started expressing their disapproval by cutting themselves... or by taking anabolic steroids and other wrong-sex hormones and getting their tits or genitals hacked off... or by threatening suicide.

It's not that parents are rejecting their trans children, it's that children are deciding they are trans and rejecting their parents. Because telling your child it's a bad idea to self-sterilise is like, you know, so transphobic and so cis-normative.

The suicide narrative - give me what I want or else! - has a lot to answer for. So does the "parents who don't affirm are just ignorant transphobes" narrative. Both of which are peddled by - tadaa! - Mermaids, in what is not at all a coincidence.

If people have been "trained" by Mermaids then even if they reject the ideology they're still hearing the threat about what their own children will do to themselves if they express their views.

Sazzasez · 06/12/2022 17:02

LaughingPriest · 06/12/2022 09:21

I think, reading the moronic commentary on this, my new vote for "most egregiously idiotic take" is now "how can you say a specific newspaper censored you when you are talking about it elsewhere?"

It's even replaced "bet you have a gender-neutral toilet at home" at the no. 1 spot.

Saying "reducing to" when you mean "describing one aspect as" has been pushed to 3rd place.

What it means is simply “I regret you haven’t been totally silenced.”

nauticant · 06/12/2022 17:05

"You might have a point if there's no way anyone can hear it. As soon as anyone hears it, your point is immediately invalid."

WarriorN · 06/12/2022 17:33

Guardian is really trending on twitter, 61k tweets. Mostly about Hadley.

Explosive stuff

ArabellaScott · 06/12/2022 17:39

WarriorN · 06/12/2022 17:33

Guardian is really trending on twitter, 61k tweets. Mostly about Hadley.

Explosive stuff

Excellent. I wonder what the audience was for WH?

Abhannmor · 06/12/2022 17:39

If you want to get a line on the Beebs politics - listen to them interviewing a trade unionist.

ArabellaScott · 06/12/2022 17:40

nauticant · 06/12/2022 17:05

"You might have a point if there's no way anyone can hear it. As soon as anyone hears it, your point is immediately invalid."

If a woman speaks in a forest and there's no trans activist there to silence her, did she even really say anything?

guinnessguzzler · 06/12/2022 18:34

😂😂😂

Thanks so much for the transcript @nauticant and bloody well done Hadley. I am finally ready to give up on the Guardian for good and I hope she does them for constructive dismissal, the fuckers.

Farmageddon · 06/12/2022 18:49

WarriorN · 06/12/2022 17:33

Guardian is really trending on twitter, 61k tweets. Mostly about Hadley.

Explosive stuff

Could you post some screenshots for those of us not on twitter?

I tried searching #guardian but didn't get anything really. I'm also useless at twitter generally, sorry.

napody · 06/12/2022 19:17

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 06/12/2022 16:22

When did parents become so desperate for their children's approval that it prevents them doing their jobs and acting on their consciences properly?

When their children started expressing their disapproval by cutting themselves... or by taking anabolic steroids and other wrong-sex hormones and getting their tits or genitals hacked off... or by threatening suicide.

It's not that parents are rejecting their trans children, it's that children are deciding they are trans and rejecting their parents. Because telling your child it's a bad idea to self-sterilise is like, you know, so transphobic and so cis-normative.

The suicide narrative - give me what I want or else! - has a lot to answer for. So does the "parents who don't affirm are just ignorant transphobes" narrative. Both of which are peddled by - tadaa! - Mermaids, in what is not at all a coincidence.

If people have been "trained" by Mermaids then even if they reject the ideology they're still hearing the threat about what their own children will do to themselves if they express their views.

Well said. Parents are scared.
I think that's a good bet on Caitlin Morans behaviour- it is either that or she's just a lightweight. I love her stuff too :(

nettie434 · 06/12/2022 19:55

I just don't think Caitlin Moran is that bothered about other women. She was involved in one dispute a while ago when she was asked about the absence of black women in Lena Dunham's show Girls:

'Caitlin Moran’s dismissive comments on the experience of black women provides another example of our media’s inability to recognise that white is not universal. Moran said that she “ literally couldn’t give shit about” about the lack of black women in the Brooklyn-based TV show Girls.'
www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/caitlin-moran-s-comments-are-just-one-example-too-often-our-media-sees-only-shades-of-white-8224880.html

She also described herself aged 13 as 'I am, by and large, boundlessly positive. I have all the joyful ebullience of a [offensive R word for a person with a cognitive disability].

thefword.org.uk/2011/06/caitlin_moran_ableism/

I don't know if it's because she herself was fortunate to have her talent recognised at an early age and she is oblivious to the experience of being passed over but her feminism seems to be about the individual and not the collective.

PronounsBaby · 06/12/2022 20:02

ArabellaScott · 06/12/2022 17:40

If a woman speaks in a forest and there's no trans activist there to silence her, did she even really say anything?

😂stop it, I'm trying to get the baby to sleep!

WarriorN · 06/12/2022 20:11

@Farmageddon some of the more recent stuff is about Mone and some about the Guardians of the galaxy (when I click images) but the top hits I get are Hadley. Unless that's an algorithmic thing. Honing to check another account

Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
PronounsBaby · 06/12/2022 20:12

Couple screenshots, a lot of the tweets are actually about Michelle Mone...

Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
WarriorN · 06/12/2022 20:14

Ah no crap it's an algorithmic thing. Another v dull twitter account I have has mostly football and the local area.

It's how Twitter becomes an echo chamber

WinterTrees · 06/12/2022 20:17

Good to see the comments under the WH instagram post about this interview. Almost entirely positive when I looked, except for the one which seems to have been pushed to the top by the replies challenging it.

www.instagram.com/p/ClyeJt_MtEH/

Birdsweepsin · 06/12/2022 22:12

Aw bless

Hadley Freeman on Woman's Hour shortly
ScribblingPixie · 06/12/2022 23:17

I didn't think she meant that, @AmaryllisNightAndDay I thought she literally meant that colleagues said they couldn't support her at work or write about gender ideology because they had teenagers who would think they were transphobic. Maybe I misunderstood.

AmaryllisNightAndDay · 07/12/2022 09:06

@ScribblingPixie Yes you're probably right. Dividing the family and maybe alienating your won children because you want to follow up a story is a very big decision. Especially if your own family are likely to get flak about it and they don't even agree with you.

ValerieDoonican · 08/12/2022 09:35

ArabellaScott · 06/12/2022 17:40

If a woman speaks in a forest and there's no trans activist there to silence her, did she even really say anything?

Brilliant 😅

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