"Lesbians a look at women in changing rooms too"

[ExtraPlinky]

This is the latest TRA response -
Some variation of "it's ok for men to share intimate spaces with women because lesbians and female predators exist too."

And shockingly I'm seeing women posting this usually then joined by the NotAllMenMan saying NotAllMen.

@LittleSnakes

Their point makes no sense. Because women haven’t been going on about keeping lesbians out of women’s spaces. So are they now trying to tell us that we’ve somehow missed this and should also be asking to not have lesbians in our spaces? Or are they saying that because there’s predatory lesbians around (which there aren’t) that we should also let predatory trans women in? Every argument shows even more how they aren’t women. Because if they were women then they would get it.

This 💯!

@ExtraPlinky

At some point they will alienate all the lesbians and the only "lesbians" left will be straight girls and men.

I'm pretty alienated! Trust me on this!

It's not just that I don't want men looking at me - I don't want to cop an eyeful of random penis when I'm getting changed/ drying my hair, even if it is identifying as a lady penis.

I've been thinking about the whole thing about not wanting to be naked even in front of men I feel safe around - and TBH, I don't want to be naked in front of women I know either - if I'm going to be naked, I would prefer it was in front of female strangers or medical professionals. But in analysing my feelings, they are different - male family is the not wanting to be naked in front of people I know feeling. Stranger males is fear. Stranger females I sell to myself as they'll never see me again so it doesn't matter - but there is no element of fear or wariness that there is with males.

It is odd as its not about (with me) feeling that someone is looking at you sexually- or even (again for me) a fear that the man would attack you- I wouldn't want to get changed in front of men who i knew/knew weren't predators/knew were gay etc- i think its something to do with the otherness of their bodies- ie my body is different from theirs and this feels wrong

@RedChapter

I don't usually comment on here, mainly because my experience of being a lesbian is just normal. Living a good life with my wife, but this crap enrages and saddens me. Never felt threatened in the company of women. Lesbians and any other women aren't the problem.

Absolutely. In nearly 50 years I've not known if there was a lesbian in the changing room because women.

I'd certainly know if there was a man in there though. No matter how well he think he passes.

@Runningupthecurtains

It's not just that I don't want men looking at me - I don't want to cop an eyeful of random penis when I'm getting changed/ drying my hair, even if it is identifying as a lady penis.

Exactly this.

I mean it’s just never even once crossed my mind to wonder whether any of the women in a changing room or toilets or whatever are lesbians. I’ve also never been alone walking at night and had another woman near me and wondered if she might be a lesbian waiting to attack me. Because we’re all just women, regardless of sexuality. It seems absolutely absurd that I wouldn’t even have to write that down like it wasn’t obvious.

Why are they trying to make lesbians the issue? What’s going on there?

Why are they trying to make lesbians the issue? What’s going on there?

Presumably if they can frame lesbians as predators (they're not) then they think they have a valid argument to let the men in too. (They haven't.) The risks to women from men are high, particularly those men that want to force themselves into women's spaces knowing they are not wanted and will never be welcome. It takes a certain kind of man to do that really doesn't it. And not the sort of male I want near me or my daughter's in changing areas etc.

It’s just bonkers.

It's also an extremely revealing form of bonkers.

Lesbians don't get erections.

It's all such a myth, changing rooms are not hotbeds of lust for women.
I can't imagine many women think of sexy time while trying to get their knickers on without dropping their towel.

Lesbians in a female are changing room are supposed to ne there. Males are not.

I've never even considered that a woman might be a lesbian in a changing room. I wouldn't particularly give a shit if a lesbian 'looked' at me anyway ina gym changing room anyway.

I've never been sexaully assaulted by a lesbian, or raped by a lesbian. I've never had a lesbian make an inappropriate sexual comment towards me (outside of a gay club and then only once). I've experienced all of those things from males and continue to do so.

Neither have I ever seen an obviously sexually aroused woman sitting in a changing room leering at other women and touching herself. Whereas other women have experienced that from males in female changing spaces.

My best friend is a lesbian. I've stayed overnight in her house many, many times. We've shared a bed. I've slept in her house when she has had other lesbian friends there. I've been out socially with her and her lesbian friends. Not one of them has ever made me feel uncomfortable, unsafe, made an inappropriate advance or remark. The same can't be said for male friends or their friends.

There is literally zero comparison between a woman who is sexualy and romantically attracted to other women and men and its disgusting that some people try to force one.

I go swimming multiple times per week, and have done for many years. I wonder if I should feel vaguely disappointed I've never encountered one of these dangerous predatory lesbians that are so endemic? It sounds so much more exciting than an occasional question about how the lockers work, or lending someone your shampoo.

At the age of 50 I have been sexually harassed by a Lesbian ONCE in my whole life.

Whereas I have been sexually harassed/hounded/groped/shouted at by men about a thousand times

There is no issue in society with predatory lesbians, and I don't know a single woman who objects to lesbians in changing rooms

Lesbians are women and one of us, easy

Aggressive (biological) men (whatever gender they claim to be) who think their rights are more important than woman's rights are not as welcome in my changing room

I have also played rugby and there were some lesbians in the team, never gave the changing rooms a second thought. It was fine. OTOH, thinking about unwanted attention/uncomfortable interaction from my mid teens (group photo with my family and my brother's friend's family...his sleazy parent put an arm round my ribs with thumb on my boob, in a way that could have been easily "accidental" but wasn't) to present day early 40s (arriving at the vet clinic where I work at 1am to check on an inpatient, got a shouted request for oral sex from a drunk across the street) via being whistled at, hissed at, spat at, called a frigid bitch, followed, arse grabbed, crotch grabbed, persistent requests for attention/a kiss when clear I wasn't interested, grabbed from behind and dry humped in a club, groped by a uni classmate when a bunch of us were asleep on a friend's student flat floor, having my thigh touched and held by my first boss.... they were all male. All of them. From the boy of about 12 who grabbed my crotch in the park after I'd been running with my uni student friend, to my boss in his 60s when I was early 20s; from the groping in Coppers in Dublin to being hissed at in Madrid and arse slapped in Naples and sworn at for not responding to the shouted offer of sex on the street of a small rural Welsh town, from the family friend in our house to the classmate on the student flat floor to the complete strangers in the clubs, on the streets and in the park...they have all been male. Every single one. Not a lesbian among them. Oh, and I've had "fucking dyke" snarled at me a couple of times, presumably as I did not drop to my knees and give the men who wolf whistled at me a blowjob on the spot, but I've never had a lesbian call me a fucking straight fucking breeder bitch or anything like that.

I think TRAs are so eager to project that lesbians will be sexual predators as well because they need to detract from the fact it is MEN who do this, regardless of their gender identity feelings. Anything to hide the fact it is MEN who are responsible for sexual violence and it being MEN women are afraid of.

As soon as you concede that sex is the reason certain people of one sex want to exclude members of the other sex, then it destroys their arguments of mixed sex.

They then usually turn to 'you can't tell sex anyway' to 'sex is complex' to 'sex can be changed' as sex clearly exists and is relevant.

I have got changed many times in front of women I knew were lesbians without any incident at all. I once got changed in front of my gay male friend and he later made comments that proved that he still objectified me with his male gaze despite him not being sexually attracted to me.

It is sex not sexuality that is the dividing line of appropriate behaviour.

@FOJN

I have no idea how many lesbians I've shared a changing room with or how many of them (if any) might have looked at me but I do know not one of them has ever behaved inappropriately towards me.

This

Also as a bisexual woman I can categorically state I don't gawp at other women in these spaces or in any spaces.

Rape and sexual assault are not about attraction. Surely it's as simple as that.

Urgh

So sick of the racist and homphobic crap like this.

The constant insinuation that black women and butch lesbians cloud the definition of women so much that its a logical step to allow men to have it too.

No

I am not worried about lesbians in the changing room. Even if the extremely rare incidence of lesbians being sexually violent actually happened, I'd still far sooner take ny chances fighting back against another woman than of I had to try and fight off man.

Lesbians can't hurt me or my dds with an erect penis.

Lesbians are women and have every right to be changing with women.

Not remotely the same thing at all

@ExtraPlinky

This is the latest TRA response - Some variation of "it's ok for men to share intimate spaces with women because lesbians and female predators exist too."

And shockingly I'm seeing women posting this usually then joined by the NotAllMenMan saying NotAllMen.

maybe so but they dont jack off all over the cubicles or install hidden cameras.

Isn't this like the poster (of 'sweet' fame) who tried to convince us and twitter that women masturbate in public places 'all' the time just like males do?

By public places they meant the office, any public or office toilet etc.

There were some women actually agreeing with her. I mean really? Well.... ok. I had to hand express breast milk into toilet paper in a work toilet between meetings because I was literally exploding with milk and had another 90 minutes til I could use the pump (in another toilet). Maybe some women think that this is a sexual thing?

Ffs. Sexual assault and rape is primarily about power. Not attraction. I've just read on the news about a man who raped a 99 year old woman he was supposed to be caring for.

There's no power imbalance between lesbians and whichever women they happen to be changing with.

Isn't this obvious to most people?!

Of course it's pure projection. They objectify women and don't care if they're making them uncomfortable, in fact it's often the point, so therefore women do the same. And if lesbians are doing it, it s'not fair!.

Nah.

Until men started to maintain they are women, I have to say, I never truly grasped the sheer depth of their ignorance about us.

It's made me see them quite a lot differently, to be honest. They honestly have absolutely no clue about what it's like to live as a woman. But more importantly, they don't give a fuck about acquiring that knowledge either.

(Namalt, obvs).

Men, yeah, not surprised they think this (namalt obvs as well! ).

But when women say this crap? I despair!