A trans-Identified BDSM fan/gun nut is now a senior leader at Girlguiding

[Scraggythang]

Via Glinner’s sub stack. Sorry if this has already been posted!

grahamlinehan.substack.com/p/wtf-are-girlguiding-thinking

I can't be right that adults, including men, who can work with little children, aren't DBS checked by the organisation they're working for!!!

You can't possibly leave it up to them.

@Datun

I can't be right that adults, including men, who can work with little children, aren't DBS checked by the organisation they're working for!!!

You can't possibly leave it up to them.

The attitude seems to me to be “we’ve been doing this for over 100 years and nothing much bad has happened, so we can carry on doing what we like, even if it is woefully inadequate by any normal persons standards and expectations of an organisation”

We recently had an email saying that all volunteers need a disclosure and certain level of safeguarding training - but it was “unsustainable” for volunteers to check up on this, and the implication was essentially please can people take responsibility for them self in that regard?!

I thought that anyone working (voluntarily or paid) with children regularly had to have a dbs check. An occasional visitor who's accompanied at all times might not have one.

Are you saying they you know of people regularly volunteering for the GG who haven't had a DBS done?

Surely, it's just a central database, with a tick next to 'have I seen their DBS certificate?'

Given that without one, any convicted paedophile could be working for the girl guides, surely it's bloody basic???

David challenor could work for them (albeit after 20 years imprisonment).

@lovelyweathertoday

We recently had an email saying that all volunteers need a disclosure and certain level of safeguarding training - but it was “unsustainable” for volunteers to check up on this, and the implication was essentially please can people take responsibility for them self in that regard?!

I thought that anyone working (voluntarily or paid) with children regularly had to have a dbs check. An occasional visitor who's accompanied at all times might not have one.

Are you saying they you know of people regularly volunteering for the GG who haven't had a DBS done?

Yes, I know volunteers who haven’t had a disclosure as required by Girlguiding policy.

I’m not talking about occasional visitors or parents on a parent rota for example - that’s different, and I think totally acceptable for them not to have had a disclosure done.

I raised this issue much further up the tree and been made to shut up and not tell parents, as I feel that I really should.

@Datun

Surely, it's just a central database, with a tick next to 'have I seen their DBS certificate?'

Given that without one, any convicted paedophile could be working for the girl guides, surely it's bloody basic???

Well that’s what I thought. But I was wrong. There is a central record of it, but it seems that the fact that they don’t have one doesn’t automatically lead to anyone doing anything about it. Even if another volunteer explicitly asks or asks that the organisation can organise a disclosure for the volunteer who doesn’t have one.

@FindTheTruth

Putting aside all the matters this relates to for a second, posting a photo of yourself in a messy house with a gun in the UK, show a lack of awareness at best

I know a lot of people who shoot - literally dozens, I should think - and for some of them it's a big part of their lives (gamekeepers, for example).

I'm FB friends with a fair chunk of them, and they would never pose on FB or any other SM like that with a gun in their living room, including the Americans. You might, tops, get a shot of someone with shogun broken over their arm posing with their dog at the end of a morning's wildfowling or whatever.

Most gun owners are very discreet about it. Broadcasting the fact that you own so much as an aged shotgun is just not done.

So yeah, this sort of behaviour is totally inappropriate.

@Datun

Surely, it's just a central database, with a tick next to 'have I seen their DBS certificate?'

Given that without one, any convicted paedophile could be working for the girl guides, surely it's bloody basic???

Last time I did an enhanced DBS, a notification went straight to the organisation which had required it and I got a certificate separately IIRC?

Eurgh. I’d be withdrawing my child quick sharp. How utterly disgusting. A pp got it right about hiding in plain sight.
That article just got worse and worse. Why would they appoint such a person? It really does feel like we are being brainwashed as a society.

@RepentMotherfucker that’s correct.

They hold the information if you have a valid disclosure or have sent one off through them.

The issue is that they rely on volunteers to ask new volunteers to fill out the forms etc., and I’ve seen this not happen, and it not followed up. If a volunteer (eg commissioner) just fails to ask a new volunteer for a disclosure or reference, it seems that this isn’t necessarily identified and followed up, and their central system doesn’t flag this. I’m not entirely sure why the central system doesn’t flag it - it might be related to also relying on volunteers to correctly feed information in to this central system.

They put loads of responsibility on volunteers who may or may not have the skills/ training/ time/ inclination to actually fulfil all of those responsibilities.

There's a massive safeguarding loophole being exposed here. A safeguarding problem in a school could result in an Ofsted inspection - a safeguarding problem uncovered during an Ofsted can result in a school "failing" their Ofsted. Safeguarding is considered an absolute priority.
Yet the Guides who take children away on residentials and are evidently terribly keen on talking to children about sex and sexuality, hand out contraceptives and have dismantled their safeguarding principles so that a man self identifying as a woman is allowed to share spaces where women and girls undress, shower and sleep have no external scrutiny? Is this correct?
How is safety and safeguarding of children in the guides assessed? Does anyone know?.

Over in Ireland you cannot start helping with a Unit until you’ve your police check completed. As in, it is an offence to do so. (Check out the Irish Girl Guides policies & procedures - if you’re interested enough to look up the Catholic Guides of Ireland ones as well the bit about needing the Gardaí to check your record before you can start attending meetings will doubtless be there in giant letters too…)

If you live near the border in NI & you’ve an IGG Unit in a reasonable distance, not only is their Programme vastly better than Girlguiding’s is now, while they’re also all aboard the TWAW train, they do at least have some idea of safeguarding still, so it’s worth thinking of choosing IGG over Girlguiding. Or indeed CGI if you’re Catholic.

Oh, Girlguiding. “A safe girl only space.”

@MrsOvertonsWindow

There's a massive safeguarding loophole being exposed here. A safeguarding problem in a school could result in an Ofsted inspection - a safeguarding problem uncovered during an Ofsted can result in a school "failing" their Ofsted. Safeguarding is considered an absolute priority. Yet the Guides who take children away on residentials and are evidently terribly keen on talking to children about sex and sexuality, hand out contraceptives and have dismantled their safeguarding principles so that a man self identifying as a woman is allowed to share spaces where women and girls undress, shower and sleep have no external scrutiny? Is this correct? How is safety and safeguarding of children in the guides assessed? Does anyone know?.

I don’t think there’s external scrutiny like in schools. People can write to the Charity Commission but I don’t think it makes much difference.

They have a policy that says you need a disclosure and references sent off for (but not received back) within I think 2 months of starting volunteering or 4th time volunteering, whichever comes first. However, this doesn’t always happen, and you’re just relying on a volunteer (eg a district commissioner), who may have a low understanding of why this important, or lack of sufficient training or whatever (I don’t know the cause but I know the result) to ensure this happens and identify if it doesn’t happen. In our unit of 5 volunteers, I’ve seen this system fail with 2 of them in the last year. And I know it’s failed with others within that 5 previously. Work that out as a percentage - I sincerely hope it’s not replicated across the country but I also can’t believe that this is an isolated incident. It appears to be a systems issue, which is presumably why Girlguiding won’t address it in a manner that results in proper checks being carried out. If it was a one off, fix it. Instead, send an email out saying that we can’t deal with all this disclosure and safeguarding training stuff so can you please all deal with it yourself?

I’m a Brownie Leader. The safeguarding training I’ve had, and have to repeat on a regular basis, is far better than many other organisations I’ve been involved with.

I'm properly shocked, I've worked and volunteered with children in mostly educational settings and have always had to have the crb/dbs completed and returned before any volunteering or work started.

I thought that was just basic nowadays. I actually thought it was illegal in this country to work with children in any kind or organised club without a dbs. I am properly shocked.

You need to contact a

Oops so shocked I need an edit button!

@lovelyweathertoday

I'm properly shocked, I've worked and volunteered with children in mostly educational settings and have always had to have the crb/dbs completed and returned before any volunteering or work started.

I thought that was just basic nowadays. I actually thought it was illegal in this country to work with children in any kind or organised club without a dbs. I am properly shocked.

You need to contact a

Not illegal. Checked this when Girlguiding failed to do anything about me raising this as a problem. I agree really bad practice though.

Good to hear that you rate the safeguarding training capercaillie for the Brownies.

Thank you Eggybrains It had never really occurred to me that this organisation lacks external safeguarding scrutiny. However given the extent of the erosion of safeguarding it's beginning to look as if this is an organisation rather adrift from the principles of keeping children safe and it needs to be formally monitored and assessed.

When I say they didn’t do anything, they told me to shut up and not tell the parents

There's no point offering safeguarding training unless you actually monitor that staff understand it and implement it. There seems to be growing evidence that this isn't happening as it should.

Very worrying.

There seems to be a lot of telling adult volunteers in the Guides to shut up isn't there? Especially in relation to safeguarding.

Short interview from March.

twitter.com/the_statemedia/status/1463777324923559939?s=21

@Eggybrains

When I say they didn’t do anything, they told me to shut up and not tell the parents

I think you need a friendly investigative journalist to look into it.

@lovelyweathertoday

I'm properly shocked, I've worked and volunteered with children in mostly educational settings and have always had to have the crb/dbs completed and returned before any volunteering or work started.

I thought that was just basic nowadays. I actually thought it was illegal in this country to work with children in any kind or organised club without a dbs. I am properly shocked.

You need to contact a

I don't think illegal is the right word but it's certainly something they wouldn't get to, for example, hire halls or school premises etc without because whoever is hiring to them will have a policy that says they have to ensure that groups have safeguarding in place. And surely their trustees would be liable in some way?

If you were told that @Eggybrains would you speak to a journalist anonymously? I think if there's a bigger safeguarding picture at GG it would be big news.