Joan of Arc was trans????

[Greenandcabbagelooking]

It's Schools Diversity Week this week. There has been no mention of any kind of diversity other than LGBTQIA+. Heavy on the T. We've been reminded every day for weeks about this.

Today's update says Joan of Arc was trans because she didn't dress like a woman. There's even a discussion on the pronouns she (sorry, he/they) would have used. Silly me, I though Joan was just a woman who was fed up with the limitations her sex imposed on her. Clearly short hair + trousers = man.

I'm all for showing young people a diverse range of role models, but transing people who lived several hundred years ago is not all that helpful.

Nobody on here was discussing whether JOA was trans or not. We were discussing the enormous overreach of the institution that proposed it...
Any discussion on whether she may or may not be trans is pure speculation and grossly inappropriate.

She cross dressed because it was a rape deterrent to do so. It's fucking disgusting.

I quoted a speculative question of yours Imasoulman.

Any discussion on whether she may or may not be trans is pure speculation and grossly inappropriate.

Quite.

Not to mention misogyny of the highest order...

@GoingGently

Nobody on here was discussing whether JOA was trans or not. We were discussing the enormous overreach of the institution that proposed it... Any discussion on whether she may or may not be trans is pure speculation and grossly inappropriate.

Which institution would that be? The OP has confirmed it's not Schools Diversity Week.

"Schools Diversity Week" isn't an organisation. It's a initiative run by the Just Like Us charity. The OP has clearly said that this content was in her school bulletin, so has come from the SLT at her school or been approved by them. Other posters have said that the actual origin is likely from the Just Like Us resources, which are behind a schools sign up page so not accessible for the general public. The OP has also said that she doesn't want to share screenshots, for obvious reasons.

I get that you think this has all been invented by the OP, but you need to report posts that you think are malicious to MNHQ rather than passive aggressively troll hunt on the thread.

Which institution would that be? The OP has confirmed it's not Schools Diversity Week.

I don’t think OP has confirmed that?

OP said It's Schools Diversity Week this week.

Schools Diversity Week is run by the Just Like Us charity, so I would think that’s the likely source?

@Greenandcabbagelooking, have you thought of getting involved in the Safe Schools Alliance?

And isn't teaching rubbish like that against the DoE guidelines?

If you don’t think OP is in good faith, dadjoke, you can scroll on by, or report. Or you could join in the discussion of who might believe Jeanne d’Arc was a trans man and why they would. All great options, and no under the radar troll hunting necessary.

@Ekofish it's 100% not on the Just Like Us charity website, and OP has made it clear it applies to a specific school, while implying that it's something much bigger than that in the first post, thus not being willing to provide a link. It appears to be conjuring outrage out of almost nothing.

@Sophoclesthefox we have literally no idea whether Joan of Arc was a trans man - for a start there wasn't really any language to describe such a thing. Her devotion to dressing in men's clothing continued after she was captured, and she really stuck to that, but that says nothing about her form of gender non-conformity. I don't see there is any issue with speculating, though, any more than speculating about historical figures' sexuality. Unless you think it's too soon?

Are you going to start speculating over whether living women are really women if they don't wear dresses too?

Speculate away.

She wasn’t a transman because

• there are no records of her having dysphoria around her gender

• she referred to herself as a maid

• she believed that she was fulfilling a prophecy that could only be fulfilled by a woman

• she dressed in men’s clothes in order to be able to fight, and strongly rejected anyone telling her that they “made her a man”.

So yes, we do have a very strong idea that she was not a trans man, and it is belittling, patronising and ahistorical to suggest that any gender non comforting woman in history is trans.

@Inthetropics

Haven't read previous messages as i'm on my lunch break and have very little time on my hands now BUT...

I'm a lesbian and married to my very sexy and extremely butch wife who is 90% of the time seen as trans by other people. She is not trans at all, she just like to dress in what society has decided are men's clothes. She believes people should be able to dress and act how they want and is very and i mean VERY apalled by the fact some people just assume she is trans.

Your wife is right of course. Women and men should be able to dress how they like. Dressing in clothes that are conventionally perceived of as men's clothes does not make her trans. I understand that quite a few lesbians did this as far back as the 1920s (maybe before even?) and they too were not in doubt that they were women. And that is 100 years ago!

I have encountered transmen (both very young, early 20s at most) who insist "I am a transman because I don't want to wear lipstick." In which case, I too am trans and just never realized!

@DadJoke

it's 100% not on the Just Like Us charity website

No it’s not on the website, it’s most likely in the resource pack that you have to sign up to receive.

Have you signed up to receive the resource pack? That would settle the matter then, wouldn’t it?

@OldCrone

Do you not think its possible that the voice of God could have been her way or trying to rationalise or process relentless dysphoria?

And there you go again.

What do you mean by 'relentless dysphoria'? What makes you think she felt like that?

You're just speculating to fit your belief that there is such a thing as 'being trans' beyond just hating the stereotypes imposed on you because of your sex and/or hating the sexual characteristics of your body.

@Imasoulman Throughout history women have had their abilities, interests and freedoms constrained by gender stereotypes. It happened to me with my parents not wanting me to go to university, not study engineering and believing the best career I could aim for was being the Boss’s secretary. I rejected that as did many others and the result of feminists campaigning is that, in the West at least, women are freer to be themselves than ever before. But now we have a new movement that labels any women rejecting sexist crap, demeaning expectations otherwise know as ‘female gender identity’ as really men. Can’t you see how misogynistic this is? And how backwards? It labels women breaking out of gendered expectations as being ‘not really women’. We’re back to Victorian times.

@Imasoulman And as much clothing is unisex - which would have shocked our Victorian forefathers - and modern women would seem very bold in comparison to Victorian feminine stereotypes, then we’re all transmen now.

This is an absolute insult to her name. She was captured by the British and they kept giving her male clothing and saying she brought it in herself magically into her prison. This meant she was a witch and as a result burnt her at the stake- don't rewrite history!

Actually reminds me of the Victorian notion of hysteria....if they are not conforming there must be something WRONG with them... then it was hysteria, now it's dysphoria.... same old same old

@Inthetropics for you and your wife, that sounds horrible

[quote Ekofisk]@DadJoke

it's 100% not on the Just Like Us charity website

No it’s not on the website, it’s most likely in the resource pack that you have to sign up to receive.

Have you signed up to receive the resource pack? That would settle the matter then, wouldn’t it?[/quote]
9 pages of reactionary scaremongering over a great initiative - Schools Diversity Week - and no evidence the OP is even referencing anything from the initiative!

Wrong on all counts, but thanks for playing.

@AssassinatedBeauty

Wrong on all counts, but thanks for playing.

@DadJoke as before. If you think the OP is suspect or malicious then report the post. Stop troll hunting on the thread itself.

🤦‍♀️ Give me strength.