Breastfeeding is now chestfeeding, Brighton’s trans-friendly midwives are told

[Mulletsaremisunderstood]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/breastfeeding-is-now-chestfeeding-brightons-trans-friendly-midwives-are-told-pwlvmcnc7

Hope this link works as I am a subscriber to the times and logged in.

More nonsense being peddled as 'progressive' . When will the madness end!!?

@334bu

Midwife derivation mid wif = with woman. So a midwife can be male or female.

I think that would be why the term may come under attack though. It’s not the mid, it’s the wif. Perhaps midbirther will be the next suggestion.

As for the term chestfeeding for artificially lactating transwomen, wouldn’t they want it to be breastfeeding but exclusively for the,? This is all about erasing women after all.

@DNHandTNS "Why can't there be breastfeeding groups for bio women and also separate ones for transmen? It makes sense because both groups have different needs, completely different problems."

The problem is not trans men in these circumstances. Breastfeeding groups do not (tend to) care about gender identity at this stage; the physical experience is what is discussed (mastitis!).

The problems begin with trans women wanting to be in these spaces and then talking about how to emulate/simulate breastfeeding, and presenting any challenge to this narrative, however sympathetic, as 'transphobic' and 'hateful'.

When a man presents himself as oppressed for not experiencing extreme pain after breastfeeding, a week or so after delivery... one does rather lose patience.

^^ Quite

Share token for morning readers

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/426b5ba2-6aed-11eb-bc24-b1bb9cd3bc5f?shareToken=d8d80d8aca81eb72fe66eff8cf508440

Thank you for the share token McDuffy!

There are two threads on AIBU about this for anyone interested.

Thank you for the share... I’d heard of chest feeding 🙄. There is no milk in the chest cavity.... but:

Human milk - makes it sound like it’s farmed.
Birth workers (midwives will probably all become these soon)
Co-parent - this is ok eg lesbian relationships
Second biological parent - to replace father. Not ok.

Why can't there be breastfeeding groups for bio women and also separate ones for transmen? It makes sense because both groups have different needs, completely different problems.

Because transmen would be welcome at groups, biologically the advice would be relevant, and although they may benefit from extra emotional support for different reasons to others, there wouldn't be enough in an area to make meaningful support groups. However, in that scenario you'd hope others in the group would use preferred pronouns, and the additional unique support could hopefully be sought online or through other avenues. As long as they didn't expect the entire language to be changed for everyone, just for them.

Transwomen on the other hand, aka men won't benefit from support groups, because the advice won't be relevant. General feeding groups, maybe, but as a formula feeder BFing groups would also be irrelevant, for example, and someone going in and asking for the nature of the group to be changed in case they were offended would not be welcomed. Not comparing FF and chestfeeding btw, the later is not in the best interest of the baby, and there's a lot of ??? around it.

I'd think it must be torturous to be a transman, having periods and all that entails- while taking male hormones. I can't imagine how confusing it must be, like a war in the body maybe.

I think actually that most transmen who take testosterone will find their periods stop. It's the ones who don't take it and the non-binary female people who seem to be particularly likely to language police. Especially non-binary female people who make no changes other than being called they/them as they have nothing to show how super special and different they are other than that they have forced everyone to adopt different terminology for them.

over 2500 comments in the Times already. This is really getting people angry. Exactly what's needed

I would want people providing me with medical care to acknowledge that I have breasts and not to skirt around using correct anatomical terms for the parts my female body. (If I may say "skirt around" or is it "trousersuit around" now?)

These days I feel like my identity as a cis-gendered woman (aka a person of the female sex) is being invalidated and erased. It really stresses me out that our culture is adopting trans-positive yet deeply misogynistic language which will make it impossible to discuss the experience of living in a female body and by extension to address the mountain of discrimination that is rooted in our bodies rather than our gender.

I don’t understand why institutions like the Brighton NHS trust, for-profit companies, research organisations, celebrities etc are so quick to appease the trans community at the expense of cis-gendered women. Is it just straight up endemic misogyny?

@334bu

Midwife derivation mid wif = with woman. So a midwife can be male or female.

Except that it is no longer just women giving birth it seems .

@DaisiesandButtercups

Thank you for the share token McDuffy!

There are two threads on AIBU about this for anyone interested.

One of them moved to here already....guess 2 isn’t allowed!

And now it has gone!

The vote was 99% YANBU.

Apparently too many posts violated the talk guidelines

The one left in AIBU doesn’t have voting unfortunately.

It is not interesting how many threads there are about women’s rights & issues being affected by TRA are being started on AIBU And not by FWR regulars since the great multi thread discussion of the other week

Is interesting! Arghhhh

It must be informative for those who aren’t FWR regulars.

I have been quite at what some non FWR posters say on the AIBU threads as they speak more freely being unused to the moderation standards on this topic. Not that I think that what they are saying is wrong for the most part just direct, clear and to the point.

The problems begin with trans women wanting to be in these spaces and then talking about how to emulate/simulate breastfeeding, and presenting any challenge to this narrative, however sympathetic, as 'transphobic' and 'hateful'.

Let me get this right. Transwomen e.g. m>f are invited to make full use of womanly 'things' and simulate 'breastfeeding' but women who have given birth are to deny their own identity and are forced to say that they're 'chest feeding' their baby human milk.

This topic is fundamental to Mums, so why would MN remove the thread?

The fact that three threads were started is indicative of how fundamental the topic is.

Mumsnet HQ should add a poll to the remaining thread in AIBU.

The comment about that hospital not using the word ‘Mother’ is just so upsetting. It undermines and diminishes the significant change women go through when they become a mother. Like the change during puberty to becoming an adolescent, women change physically and mentally once they become a mother (this change is called matrescence) - it has a term but it’s not so well known).

I personally found this change massive, traumatic, difficult, heartbreaking and then wonderful but it’s a process that a women goes through as they leave their pre baby life behind and become a mother, also known as the birth of the mother. Is this really being taken away from us or in fact, worse, not acknowledged by some now? What a dreadful step backwards and I worry about maternal mental health. Knowing this was a process that new mothers went through was what helped me come to peace with the way I was feeling and my new identity after birth but I think I’d feel so alone if that was taken away from me.

Chestfeeding - absolutely fucking ridiculous. Makes my blood boil, all of it.

Women give birth, women have breasts, women breast feed.

Any other phrases are just meaningless wokery.

Are they going to start calling breast cancer chest cancer?

Seriously, why wouldn't they?

Men get it, so..

(If I may say "skirt around" or is it "trousersuit around" now?)

😂

Fucking priceless!