Starting on 28 October Judicial Review of prison guidelines on transgender - and launch of new web site Keep Prisons Single Sex

[stumbledin]

Thanks to recent contributors to the thread started over a year ago about a woman assaulted by a trans person allowed into a women's prison www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3733987-Judicial-review-for-woman-prisoner-alleging-sexual-assault-by-trans-rapist-in-prison there is news that the court case will start this week.

Fairplay for women have info about this on their twitter account pbs.twimg.com/media/ElKU7HjWMAAcN48?format=jpg&name=900x900

Also worth following a new group Keep Prisons Single Sex who are launching their web site soon twitter.com/NoXYinXXprisons

And others are also posting on this.

A strong desire to live as women do and be treated as a woman is a pretty good indicator that a person has a female psychology, is it not?

Again, evidence please. Otherwise this is just more bullshit trope.

@MiladyRenata

A strong desire to live as women do and be treated as a woman is a pretty good indicator that a person has a female psychology, is it not?

Remind us how you think women live and how they're treated

@MiladyRenata

A strong desire to live as women do and be treated as a woman is a pretty good indicator that a person has a female psychology, is it not?

Or is the pampering and female privilege that you are referring to?

And how exactly do you think like a female when you have no idea about female opressed and have indicated that it doesn’t exist?

*female oppression

You are deflecting from my point.

If you believe that the difference between men and women is purely biological/chromosomal, rather than due to psychology or behaviour, how do you justify the significantly more lenient treatment women in prison receive in the first place?

If, on the other hand, you agree with me that a person with a female typical psychology needs to be treated much more gently and respectfully in prison to assist in her rehabilitation, would this not also apply to trans women?

Oh God, not again.

Oh God, not again.

Please note that I am NOT asking for trans women to be held in the same prison accommodation as other women.

I'm just asking for equivalent treatment, and an equivalent level of care and respect.

Why are you asking women? It's nothing to do with women how male prisoners ie male convicted criminals are dealt with in the prison estate. Take your arguments to the men.

Only if they get the same privileges women receive.

And again it is completely tone deaf to post on a thread about a woman being attacked in prison by a tranwoman stating that transwomen ‘think like women’.

Right.... so again no understanding at all about female socialisation. The fact that females in prison have an extremely high rate of having experienced sexual violence and other violence perpetrated by males and likely suffer trauma disorders due to this.

What do you know of what it is to be a woman in prison Milady? How is it that you speak with such authority on this? We know that many women have a terrible time in the prison system. The questions are relevant because you've explained that you envy women because you perceive them as 'passive' and 'pampered and privileged' and you're applying the same logic to prison. Hence transwomen should be placed in the women's estate, regardless of their crime, because they'll have an easier time of it.

@MiladyRenata

Only if they get the same privileges women receive.

Do you honestly think that even female prisoners are privileged as well and the rest of us?

Again, what part of female prisoner’s abuse history do you not understand?

Go campaign to men to get the treatment you feel transwomen deserve. It really should not be up to women to campaign for this. We are busy trying to fight for women’s safety in female prisons.

So men who commit violent and sexual crimes of the sort committed exclusively by men have a female psychology because they don’t want to be treated like other men who have committed these crimes?

Go campaign to men to get the treatment you feel transwomen deserve.

So often it comes back to this. Campaign for separate spaces for transwomen. The women's estate is for females.

I want to thank the women taking this case forward also. The constant bumping to the top of the thread may also be a reminder that there is still some gardening to be done.

I still haven't seen an argument explaining why a trans woman should be treated more harshly in prison than any other woman, simply because of her chromosomes.

Some useful stats on women in prison from the prison reform trust:

•	Across the UK, around 12,000 women are imprisoned each year.
•	Although women are less than 5% of those in prison, they account for over 19% of self harm incidents, an indication of the traumatic impact of imprisonment on many.
•	Women entering prison are more likely to have been imprisoned for non-violent offences.
•	Women in prison are highly likely to be victims as well as offenders. Over half the women in prison report having suffered domestic violence with 53% of women reporting having experienced emotional, physical or sexual abuse as a child.
•	Many of them have dependent children - an estimated 17,240 children are separated from their mothers by imprisonment every year.

www.prisonreformtrust.org.uk/WhatWeDo/Projectsresearch/Women