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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Bunburying into Autumn (Bunbury 6)

999 replies

DianasLasso · 09/09/2020 13:08

Bit like blackberrying, with added derailment, sealioning and general JAQ-ing off. I'll copy and paste the opening post of the last thread.

The useful Bunbury Guide to Spotting Community Disruptors is constantly evolving.

The best research and advice is not to engage with community disruptors and trolls. As ever, if you suspect troll activity, report it to MNHQ.

Remember there are people out there who would like to silence us by fair means or foul.

This is a continuation of the Public Service Announcement thread:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3944572-Bunburys-guide-to-community-disruptors-part-5?pg=40

If and when you see threads plopped into FWR, especially a curious repeat of well worn topics, maybe check for poster history before engaging. AS is your friend.

There are a number of posts/posters/threads that are reproduced on Twitter or Facebook to foment controversy using screen shots & flagging to either MNHQ to have threads or posters deleted.. Sometimes, it’s used to approach commissioning editors with ideas for articles. It’s a tiresome tactic that we always have community disruptor posters who themselves post the comments that they then highlight elsewhere as purported evidence of racism, religious intolerance, anti-men sentiments, or transphobia.

Some helpful links can be found in the ‘Break it Down for me’ and ‘It never happens’ threads but in essence FermatsTheorem recommended “that in the absence of a block/hide poster button, I suggest the following strategy (given that you're talking to the lurkers).

Do not name check the sealion. Instead, respond to a depersonalised paraphrase:

"It is sometimes erroneously suggested that blah. Blah is wrong for the following reasons (short and pithy). If you need more information re. debunking blah, here's a link."

Then (this next step is important to combat derailment) go back up thread to the last useful contribution to the discussion, make sure you do name check that contributor, and pick up the discussion from that point.”

Go well Witches gin

OP posts:
Thread gallery
16
fatblackcatspaw · 17/11/2020 15:28

the last post was 'confused' trans teen why the hell would they be on mumsnet? don't understand the moderation principles here I'd have pulled that poster AND the thread...

HecatesCats · 17/11/2020 16:03

On the flip side, having FWR arguments posted on the AMA thread could end up being a bit of an own goal

DeaconBoo · 17/11/2020 16:43

Look, I'll be honest, that AMA screamed made-up to me because of the particular style and all the usual points were dropped in with no actual in-depth discussion of them. Plus some casual mentions of things that would be incredibly distressing. However the poster has posted a previous username which checks out over the past few years. And a related OP a while ago in the same style which raised a few hmm-faces at the time.
So I will take it at face value.

CaraDuneRedux · 17/11/2020 19:13

It is indicative of a certain form of magical thinking to avoid having to think through the consequences of one's actions (or the actions one is supporting uncritically). For instance, OP has ignored questions on phalloplasty (an operation with a 90% failure rate, which, as far as I can tell, removes pretty much all of the patient's sexual functioning, even in the rare cases when it "works"). OP isn't facing up to the brutality of elective mastectomies. OP isn't facing up to the fact that after a few years on testosterone, her child will face an increased risk of uterine cancer and may even have to have an elective hysterectomy. Her child may suffer severe and painful vaginal atrophy.

The only thing that can make this worthwhile is to keep wheeling out the (fake) suicide stats, together with her own experience of her child's suicidal ideation (which is indeed terrible, and a parent's worst nightmare - my DSis went through this with my DNephew when he was a teen). But rather than say "okay, what psychiatric treatment/counselling does my child need to help with the suicidal ideation", the OP seems to be fixating on transition as the magic cure-all, when evidence that it is is scant (and in fact, there is some evidence from longitudinal studies to suggest that 10 years after transition, rates of suicidal ideation are the same as they were before transition).

It must be an absolutely horrific situation to be in, but I do wish OP could be a bit more open to alternative points of view, because they might actually help her and her child.

Gncq · 17/11/2020 19:59

If the thread is true, the OP has clearly been on the phone to Mermaids. It looks like it's been written by Mermaids.

nauticant · 17/11/2020 20:04

I read it as having a framework consistent with Mermaids philosophy with a layer of FWR sensibility on top to avoid it being immediately off-putting.

I hear what you're saying DeaconBoo but I'm skeptical of anything that makes my "hmmm" bell start ringing.

HecatesCats · 17/11/2020 20:09

with a layer of FWR sensibility on top to avoid it being immediately off-putting

Agree. Public service broadcasting.

EyesOpening · 19/11/2020 00:09

The weekend seems to start earlier and earlier although technically it is Thursday now, I guess

Wrongsideofhistorymyarse · 19/11/2020 08:35

My sibling is in deep denial about the effect of testosterone and a double mastectomy on the health of my niece. So that part rings true.

The rest of it? Smacks of educating those nasty feminists with Mermaids' talking points. Gah.

TyroTerf · 19/11/2020 09:36

I reckon that's a side effect of an OP who doesn't use GC-specific jargon. It works both ways; describe your sexed-body issues to the Other Side in that lingo and you get incredibly short shrift, as we've seen many a time.

I found it constructive, though I can appreciate why not everyone did.

littlbrowndog · 19/11/2020 13:19

I don’t know what the op wants from the thread 🤷‍♀️

fatblackcatspaw · 19/11/2020 13:23

I think its very instructive that certain people not only want to invade women's spaces IRL but also digital spaces.. is nothing allowed to be for women ever again?

YetAnotherSpartacus · 19/11/2020 14:11

Little - I think she wants validation.

HecatesCats · 19/11/2020 15:43

Probably Spartacus. Maybe finding it useful to set out arguments to help cement convictions? 🤷🏼‍♀️

littlbrowndog · 19/11/2020 16:18

Yeah Spartacus

HecatesCats · 20/11/2020 08:47

Team 'twat' have popped up this morning on a particular AMA thread Hmm

Delphinium20 · 20/11/2020 19:18

Poof! a safeguarding children post was removed as I was reading it. I do understand the concerns with identifying details and MN mods were correct to protect child victims privacy. But I wish the information on the predator's behavior could have been saved somehow in a generalized way...it was the exact issues raised with safeguarding under, "nothing to worry about here." when yes, there are things to worry about.

persistentwoman · 20/11/2020 19:29

That was a shame Delphinium20 The advice from posters was mainly spot on.

Delphinium20 · 20/11/2020 20:53

@persistentwoman exactly. If there's a crime, report it. If a child is at risk, report it.

BlackWaveComing · 21/11/2020 22:18

Ugh.

In general, but also specifically, one droneingly male poster who has to have his say on every.bloody.thread.

HecatesCats · 21/11/2020 22:21

Attempting to derail a thread which contains a call to action to fight against an obvious injustice is a bizarre tactic. I will be digging again.

persistentwoman · 21/11/2020 22:26

It's such an odd "hobby" - repeatedly posting hatred of women on a feminist board. Still - it's keeping an important intervention well placed on the board and every time I look the allotment flourishes a little more.

Escapeplanning · 21/11/2020 23:24

It's intended to stop women posting. Really compulsive behaviour.

ErrolTheDragon · 21/11/2020 23:25

Sometimes I have to remind myself that feminism is about centring women not straw men.

Escapeplanning · 22/11/2020 18:57

The lolling! Imbecilic.