Anyone here not hate trans people?

[supermamabear]

Just asking as I’m new to MN and appalled at the threads in here D:

Well they weren't the best dance group on Top Of The Pops but they did their best.

*It would be a great shame not to focus scrutiny on those who are most responsible for driving the lobbying which affects children and women.

They will almost all be male not female.*

I could not agree more! Ruth, Susie and Maria are all flying monkeys. Who is controlling them?

though I will remember the names of EVERYBODY who’s supported the erasure of safeguarding and fully intend to spend the next fifty years reminding them

Not a derail ... just a reply to earlier post.

Evening Glitter. That wasn't a case of hate or transphobia. So one wasn't provided. So MN is still not full of transphobia. No one here hates trans people.

So one wasn't provided

Ok then

oh yes, I agree that the people behind all this are male

but equally I feel that clever educated people, expecting us to believe in their soul based religion and throwing insults around when we decline need to be held to account

basically I'd like those capable of it to have a common sense epiphany, and then suffer an attendant attack of shame and embarrassment

Has some lovely friends who have done this some pre op some post.
None claim to have swapped sex, but a lot of the post op claim it was not as they thought, the pain, the not healing properly, the things they have to do to even have a half normal life. Several have no love life at all and feel cheated.

So little to say OP? How very disappointing.

Maybe not, nevernot, but that doesn't mean you hate any man wearing a dress, does it? You might give him a sideways glance, and you might not trust him because you don't understand him, but hate? Nah!

I don't hate anyone. I just don't believe in 'gender identity', fluffy feelz or that humans can change sex.

I certainly do not hate trans people! I think everyone has the right to live however they want to live, call themselves whatever they want and I will respect that etc... I also think that provision should be made for safe spaces for trans people because they are also at high risk of violence from cis men. I also think that genuine transsexual people and people with gender dysphoria who have chosen to live as the gender that fits how they feel should be treated as that sex.

I am very against self ID however. I think that to protect women, trans women and trans men, there needs to be actual evidence that someone genuinely is trans before they are allowed into female only spaces.
I also think it needs to be acknowledged that whether male or female, people with vaginas face a certain type of oppression and people who have penises have some privileges... that life experiences of women with vaginas and trans women cannot be assumed to be one and the same.. sometimes people with vaginas need to discuss the specific oppression which faces them.
I also worry that if biological sex is ignored, instead of sexism disappearing all that will happen is that there will be no language to discuss it.. just like when people say 'I dont see colour' it doesn't actually help, because other people do and racism still exists. I think people with vaginas who identify as men will still be discriminated against as women and will still face misogyny. I worry that all discussion about this seems to just get shut down.
and apparently saying that means that you 'hate trans people'

Which is absolute bullshit.

expecting us to believe in their soul based religion and throwing insults around when we decline

Quite. I'm an atheist. I don't believe in a gendered soul any more than in one that's going to the heaven of any particular deity.

I will not be told I now live in a theocracy.

Well that's what I mean... if we cant use the word woman to describe that, what are we supposed to use, how do we talk about that oppression? And if we use another word wont it just be the same, wont whatever we use get taken off of us? And when you look at it like that it really does seem like an infringement on rights and a silencing. For me woman is a description given to me by society not an identity...

And surely you should get to define what woman means to you personally? That's what a lot of trans activists say so why does that not apply to people born with vaginas... why do they have to accept a different identity? When Alison Moyet said that she didnt want to be called cis there was an outcry!

I don't hate them. I feel very sorry for them. They want what they can't have,impossible situation. Will never be happy.
If you are a woman and want to be a man. You can't. You simply can't. And even if you have all the operations etc. You still aren't there. Not accepted. Minority.
I feel pity and sadness.

And I hate with a passion that this is all the rage right now, with our youngsters and teenagers. So wrong. That's what gets my goat.

But hate? No.

Ribbons you're on a feminist board, it's perfectly acceptable to use the word 'woman' in the correct context ie to describe adult human females. No need to add any prefixes either.

It's a shame that we are pitted against each other in this way... and why? Trans women and trans men are not in danger from cis women... we are all in danger of Male violence... and yet this vitriol seems to be aimed at women.. why? Women arent scared of trans women they are scared of men and rightly bloody so when you look at the statistics... arent trans women scared of men too... arent trans men... then why is all this rhetoric aimed at women and mumsnet and radfems and lesbians? Are we the threat? Surely we should all be United in anything that makes safe spaces safer... and that includes not allowing predatory men to self ID as women to gain access to vulnerable women and transwomen.

Ribbons please stop using the word 'cis' in connection to women, a lot of posters find it offensive and it can be reported.

Ribbons Stop fucking saying cis!! FFS, how many times do you have to be told, it’s nit used on here and is actually a banded word!

Stop saying it? ribbons only said it once I think and only used that word once when told to stop saying people with vaginas - so she did and used something else?
For the record I don't like the c word much but either but the above "stop doing that!" was a bit baffling

risk of violence from cis men

Asked not to use prefixes

not in danger from cis women

Repeatedly using the expression ‘people with vaginas or women with vaginas’, even after being asked not to.

The word you’re trying so hard to dance around is WOMAN. Nothing else neede.

Me. DS1 (DD1? ) is trans.

“Women arent scared of trans women they are scared of men and rightly bloody so when you look at the statistics... arent trans women scared of men too... arent trans men... then why is all this rhetoric aimed at women and mumsnet and radfems and lesbians? Are we the threat? Surely we should all be United in anything that makes safe spaces safer... and that includes not allowing predatory men to self ID as women to gain access to vulnerable women and Transwomen “

Amen to that. Unfortunately the TRA lobby does not recognise the potential for self id to enable predatory self id’d trans/women, and would shout you down, label you transphobic and report you to police, employer and Twitter for hate speech for saying so.