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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Prostitution / Pornography/ Surrogacy.

238 replies

Cismyfatarse1 · 29/12/2018 19:34

Help!

DS who is ridiculously clever, 18 and knows everything has been, along with DD (16) (Alsoclever but prepared to admit to not knowing everything) arguing amicably with me on and off all day.

Both of them were arguing that women should be free to choose to be prostitutes / porn stars / rent out their wombs.

I disagreed vehemently because we can't have laws that allow exploitation of the most vulnerable. Plus, these (particularly the first two) make women commodities for men.

Any clear arguments I can use? Links? Sources.

DS - who is gay - didn't see that if prostitution was so desirable a job, then men would do it. He also didn't see that consent is not really consent if you are vulnerable or being groomed / exploited. His life has been quite comfy. DD - no real life experience, didn't get that, as women, we are often seen as vessels for carrying / entering and that a penis in your mouth / cunt / bum is very different from just being physically close with someone who you don't fancy.

Both of them insisted that porn is watched by lots of women and that porn star is a desirable job for some and that porn stars are safe.

I gave it my all but really do want them to SEE!! Their generation, they argue, is not uptight about sex so selling it is no big deal.

Thoughts?

OP posts:
MargueritaPink · 30/12/2018 20:23

Kudos to torn, critequal, rufus for keeping going.

Tomdix · 30/12/2018 20:24

It is ironic that the countries where women “choose” to go to sell their bodies are often those that make the greater claim for female emancipation and equality of opportunity.

R0wantrees · 30/12/2018 20:32

twitter.com/SPACEintl/status/1079413817010982912

Prostitution / Pornography/ Surrogacy.
thornyhousewife · 30/12/2018 20:33

Rowan - ah that makes sense.

#livingtheirbestlife

thornyhousewife · 30/12/2018 20:34

And thanks for the event link - I'd like to go to this.

MNHQ
HebeMumsnet · 30/12/2018 20:38

Thanks for the reports on this, folks. We've escorted PJ to the door (again). We've deleted a few posts that we felt were a bit creepy, too.

R0wantrees · 30/12/2018 20:43

There were some excellent speakers and resources at the first 'CEASE' conference in November.

from website
"CEASE UK stands for the Centre to End All Sexual Exploitation.

That is our aim: to see an end to everything from CSE, sex trafficking and prostitution to the vast global pornography and sexual entertainment industries that legitimise the abuse.

We will seek to achieve our aims through:

Lobbying: campaigning to end laws and policies that facilitate sexual exploitation.

  1. Collaboration: unifying the movement so that diverse charities, organisations and individuals can come together in mutual support.
3.Education: raising awareness of the links between all forms of sexual exploitation and to fight it through programs of outreach, education and engagement with the media. In standing against sexual exploitation, we stand for equality, justice and human dignity."

links and newsletter here:
ceaseuk.org/blog/

thenightsky · 30/12/2018 20:49

OP. Suggest your DS and DD watch 'Doing Money'. Its on BBC iplayer. Based on a true story. Awful and made me cry.

thenightsky · 30/12/2018 20:57

Melanippe Wow at that invisible men link Sad

R0wantrees · 30/12/2018 20:58

recent news from Israel:
"The Knesset is set to pass a landmark law against prostitution making hiring sex workers a crime, rather than the work itself, after a committee authorized it for a second and third reading.

The new law will make Israel the 10th country to institute what is called the “Nordic Model” of combating human trafficking and prostitution. The law is scheduled to a final vote next week, at the last minute before the Knesset breaks for the early election.

There are currently 14,000 people involved in sex work in Israel, including 3,000 minors, according to the Welfare Ministry, and 76% would leave sex work if they could. The average lifespan of a prostitute in Israel is 46 years.

When the law goes into effect, a first-time offender will be fined NIS 2,000 for hiring or attempting to hire a prostitute and NIS 4,000 for further offenses. It also allows for pressing charges and fining the offender up to NIS 75,300. It offers the Justice Ministry the option of instituting other punishments, such as “John Schools,” meant to educate those who paid for sex.

The law does not only make frequenting prostitutes a criminal offense, it seeks to help people leave sex work and find other careers. It budgets NIS 90 million over the next three years for the rehabilitation of prostitutes.

Knesset Subcommittee to Combat Trafficking of Women and Prostitution head, Aliza Lavie (Yesh Atid), said the bill includes “budgets for rehabilitation, accompanying research, and help in finding employment are inseparable parts of implementing the law. With every day that passes [without the new law], more women are hurt.” (continues)
www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Israel-to-become-10th-country-to-criminalize-hiring-prostitutes-575393

thenightsky · 30/12/2018 21:15

That's good news. I think 2,000 NIS is about £900 isn't it? Hit em hard.

Melanippe · 30/12/2018 21:20

thenightsky it horrifies me. I'm so sorry if it upset you though.

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 30/12/2018 21:21

That is good news r0wan

thenightsky · 30/12/2018 21:25

Melanippe No, no … it didn't upset me. I never mind having my eyes opened Smile

Melanippe · 30/12/2018 21:28

Phew!

DoctorTwo · 30/12/2018 21:34

Blimey @LegendaryPJ, you're making us men sound really cuntish when the vast majority of us are not. @TornFromTheInside and @1critEqual are providing a counter balance.

You revolting shit.

That's not nice.

Perhaps not. Accurate though.

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 30/12/2018 21:38

Oh my god is his name torn

Christ that's embarrassing...ive been calling him tom the entire fucking thread!!

Blush
Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 30/12/2018 21:40

Actually i think there may have been a tom on here

But i think he left

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 30/12/2018 21:41

Nope tomdix is still here...

Fuuuuuck...i give up

LangCleg · 30/12/2018 22:14

Christ that's embarrassing...ive been calling him tom the entire fucking thread!!

I did that for ages! Sorry, torn!

(Always worth remembering that these types of thread attract chaps that prefer to get their sexual services in other ways than actually paying a woman. Don't provide such services for free on messageboards is my best advice.)

TornFromTheInside · 30/12/2018 22:47

It's the damn font - Torn and Tom are barely distinguishable. Half the time I would read Tom and Torn anyway, so wouldn't be aware!

Rufusthebewilderedreindeer · 30/12/2018 22:50

Yeah...what torn says

(Now ive got my glasses on)

MargueritaPink · 31/12/2018 00:19

I'm saving the thread for the next time this inevitably comes up. There were good contributions from many posters which I can recycle.

MagicMix · 31/12/2018 01:02

Confused.

Why would you talk to clients about your "sexual choices," and give them a false illusion that everything was completely of your own free will, when that wasn't the case?

Ignoring the fact that this pond scum assumed the poster was talking about prostitution when she wasn't... how could anyone be so monumentally deluded by their obsesion with their own dick as to think that coerced, desperate, trafficked, drug-addicted or abused prostitutes actually announce this to the john rather than pretending everything is fine?? Holy hell some people are beyond redemption.

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