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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Your comments for Penny Mordaunt

165 replies

gendercritter · 04/07/2018 20:01

I just read on another thread that Justine is meeting with Penny Mordaunt soon.

In Justine's words: 'You should also know that I’m due to meet soon with Penny Mordaunt to discuss “any ideas you may have on the women and equalities agenda’' and I will of course reflect the strong opinion of many Mumsnetters wrt to this issue and ask her to do a webchat too.'

I thought this was worth highlighting so people can leave comments here for @justinemumsnet to mull over and raise with Penny. Perhaps, Justine, you could print them all off and hand them over to her when you see her.

Thank you.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
9
failingatlife · 12/10/2018 00:41

I would like to ask why is the application process for disability so onerous? Especially when she is happy for people to change their legal sex by filling in a form no proof required.

My DH has MS. We have just completed a detailed PIP form now a yearly event. MS is a progressive disease with no cure. Gender identity is someone's feelings.

VMisaMarshmallow · 12/10/2018 01:57

Lumpy - the UN found the UK were guilty of violating the convention on the rights of people with disabilities and nothing was done about it so yeah you’re spot on.

I’d be interested in how PM and all the rest pushing the self id act feel it benefits those with gender identity disorder? Those who transition are currently a protected group yet this act would erase that protection surely? Also if all it takes to change from a man to a woman is signing a form then it’s no longer a medical issue and the NHS will have zero obligation to provide mental health support and/or hormone treatment and surgery for anyone who want to transition physically. How does that meet the needs of the vulnerable group of those with gender identity disorder?

So women’s rights get entirely erased and the rights of actual transsexuals are harmed also. Who benefits from that? I would like PM to answer that question please. However inarticulately phrased at 2am in the morning.

R0wantrees · 12/10/2018 10:48

This thread evolved from the original one posted by Justine Roberts at the beginning of the Govt. Consultation.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/3297067-Mumsnet-moderation-response-to-yesterdays-feedback

As its in another place, 'Talk', there is a risk it gets lost.

There are many important comments, posts and concerns of MN members on the thread including additional questions and comments for Penny Mordant.

The thread which Justine is referring to in her comment & links to:
July 3rd 2018, OP Pratchet wrote:
"A woman is an adult female human
Of the sex whose reproductive role is to gestate and bear young.

Let's just say this while we still can. Because it's true, and however many people try to make us lie about it, or remain silent, it will always be true.

In times of universal deceit, speaking the truth is a revolutionary act.

It hurts MY feelings to see 'transwomen are women'. It damages MY mental health to see that, it makes ME feel erased and MY identity feel destroyed. I have a voice and I deserve that voice. WE deserve it.

I am Spartacus. A woman is an adult female human. Sex is binary, immutable and defined by reproductive role.

If you report me, or get me banned you shoot the messenger. Because this is true and will always be true. And this day, this day of a lie, I WILL say it.

#Spartacus"

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3295603-A-woman-is-an-adult-female-human

I miss Pratchet's posts

R0wantrees · 07/11/2018 08:08

Is Penny Mordant aware of the experiences and perspective of women who have had cause to need Refuge services due to male abuse and violence and also those who work on the frontline?
Does she agree that these are women who must be heard?

please consider the recent comment by shriek

Does she recognise the extreme dangers and ignorance of those who earnestly commit to picket any refuges which protect their women-only spaces?

thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3416047-The-overwhelming-majority-of-women-who-work-in-rape-crisis-centres-apparently-have-no-problem-with-male-bodies-in-female-spaces?pg=2

Is she able to recognise how theirs is a position influenced & justified by the lobby group Stonewall which has also failed to understand the basics of women's services?

Your comments for Penny Mordaunt
GatheringHerBrows · 07/11/2018 08:23

My question for Penny:

Why did the recent consultation into proposed changes to the GRA fail to consider the likely effects on women and girls?

(And on a side note - I love the women of MN, so many examples of cleaver, articulate, and justifiably angry women on this thread 💛💪🏻.)

GatheringHerBrows · 07/11/2018 08:24

^clever, not cleaver 😄😬

R0wantrees · 05/12/2018 23:02

I hope that Penny Mordant has been aware of the appalling intimidation & threats to Professor Rosa Freedman (& other female academics asking questions of the trans-ideology so promoted by Penny Mordant and Maria Miller MP?

James Kirkup on Rosa Freedman in The Spectator:

"MPs and ministers have – quite rightly – taken time and trouble to debate and address the wholly unacceptable abuse and discrimination that transgender people sadly face all too often. In that, they were doing their jobs, representing the interests of people who need someone to speak for them.

Will that happen in the case of Rosa Freedman? Will MPs do their job and ensure that she can do hers without urine on her door and calls in the night telling her she should be raped and killed? Don’t bet on it. After all, she’s only a woman, and who cares about them? Who speaks for them?

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/12/women-are-abused-in-the-name-of-trans-rights-but-do-mps-care/

Does Penny Mordant care, does she think that those influential organisations such as Stonewall, Mermaids, Press For Change, TELI, NUS. Pink News etc should be taking a more pro-active role in condemning such actions by trans-activists?

thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3443107-Shocking-bullying-of-gender-critical-law-professor-Rosa-Freedman

MsJeminaPuddleduck · 05/12/2018 23:08

I'm not sure my comments are repeatable at this time.

When I'm less cross at the Prof Freedman stuff I will try harder

R0wantrees · 05/12/2018 23:33

When I'm less cross at the Prof Freedman stuff I will try harder

Does Penny Mordant agree with Dr Beth Jones that girls and women in sport just 'need to try harder' to compete against males?
Or is Penny Mordant aware of the realities and implications for girls' & women's sport?

Might Penny Mordant please discuss this further with her colleagues, Parliamentary Under Secretary of State for Sport and Civil Society, Mims Davies MP and Secretary of State for Digital, Culture, Media and Sport, Jeremy Wright MP as well as those with devolved responsibilites?

(extract from transcript of Woman's Hour interview)

"BJ: I don't think just because we have mixed gendered hockey teams, for example, that would mean that women wouldn't play. It might mean actually, if women feel that they are in a mixed team, they may push themselves even more to achieve even more, to be on more of a comparative level to males. I don't think it necessarily means that women wouldn't be able to play ... at a competitive ...

JG: No, I mean they'd never be picked. I mean obviously it would be the duty of whoever picks the team to pick the best team and, to be brutal about it, that probably wouldn't feature any women.

BJ: But at the same time we don't know that, and it may, and that's what I'm saying, that you know, there is a bit of an argument academically that perhaps women kind of cap their capability, psychologically, because they're competing against other women, if they feel that they're then competing against other men, who - we take it in society that men perform better than women, then perhaps they would up their performance and be competing on more of that level. So we may see women picked for those teams." (continues)

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3442132-Nic-Williams-on-Womans-Hour-Tuesday-talking-about-sport-and-gender-identity?pg=15

R0wantrees · 30/12/2018 10:15

RE sport, I trust Penny Mordant MP is being briefed on the appalling treatment of sporting icon Martina Navratilova by Dr McKinnon?

Does Penny Mordant agree with Martina Navratilova that a male should not surely just declare they are a woman and then compete against girls and women in sport as that would not be fair?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3455445-Martina-Navratilova-states-the-obvious

Your comments for Penny Mordaunt
VickyEadie · 30/12/2018 13:37

A friend of mine wrote to her MP (Greening) and raised the sports issue. The response Mordaunt sent back to Greening's letter to her parrotted the usual 'it'll be dealt with by the sporting bodies' nonsense.

There seem to be a lot of naive, 'I'm not bothering to educate myself on this' assumptions by Mordaunt et al that 'nothing unfair, threatening or discriminatory to women could possibly happen'. As if they have no role at all to play in ensuring it fucking doesn't happen.

R0wantrees · 28/02/2019 13:30

Important thread running in response to OP Glinner's request:
"I'd like to collect some anecdotes about when and why you first became involved in the debate about gender ideology and activism. I've also asked on Twitter but thought this might be good for longer answers.

Please tell me your stories!"

It currently has 20 pages of serious, eloquent and informed responses.

Fairenuff Thu 28-Feb-19 11:24:16 wrote:
"All of these accounts are BIG news. Yet none of it is being reported in the media.

It's being driven by powerful men with a lot of influence at the top of many institutions. People don't believe the ideology but are too scared to go against it. It's sinister.

All it needs is someone to be brave enough to get it out there in mainstream so that we can all talk about it. Martina did this. Now is the time for all the men to come and back her up.

Women can't do it on their own because men hold the power. As long as this ideology does not affect men, there is no reason for them to take a risk on behalf of women.

It's just plain oppression. It's right out there for everyone to see but no-one will do anything about it."

When is Penny Mordant MP and the department of Women & Equalities going to listen to women who have recognised and experienced the harms of gender ideology and activism?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3518546-help-a-brother-out

R0wantrees · 13/03/2019 19:09

Current thread, OP JustineMumsnet (MNHQ) wrote, Mon 04-Mar-19
[EDITED BY MNHQ: Questions have now been collated and sent over - new questions may not be answered]

"Hello all,

We’re very pleased to announce a Q&A with Penny Mordaunt MP, Secretary of State for International Development and Minister for Women and Equalities.

Please post your questions on this thread by lunchtime on Wednesday March 6. We’ll send on a selection to the Minister and we will post up written answers from Penny on this thread this coming Friday (March 8), International Women’s Day.

In her role as Secretary of State for International Development, Penny Mordaunt oversees DFID’s work ending extreme poverty overseas, including programmes focused on girls’ education and women’s health. DFID has been in the news recently, facing calls for its budget to be spent partly on encouraging projects that would aid British business overseas, and for it to be folded into the Foreign Office instead of being a standalone department.

In her role as Minister for Women and Equalities, Penny is also responsible for work including gender pay gap reporting and possible changes to the law concerning gender recognition.

Penny campaigned for Brexit in the run-up to the 2016 EU referendum and is a Royal Naval Reservist. She has previously been Minister of State for Disabled People and Minister of State for the Armed Forces.

Please add your questions for Penny here by Wednesday lunchtime. And although it’s not a live webchat please stick to the spirit of our webchat guidelines and keep it civil.

If one topic is overwhelmingly dominating responses we might request that people don't continue to post what's effectively the same question or point. Rest assured we will ALWAYS make the recipient aware that it's an area of concern to multiple users and will encourage them to engage with those questions.

Thanks
Justine"

still awaiting response to MN questions
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/mumsnet_live_events/3523984-International-Women-s-Day-Q-A-with-Penny-Mordaunt-MP-Secretary-of-State-for-International-Development-NOW-CLOSED-TO-NEW-QUESTIONS

see also thread discussing Maria Miller MP's twitter comments (Chair of Women & Equalities APPG & previous Women & Equalities Minister)
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3531608-Maria-Miller-on-Twitter

R0wantrees · 15/05/2019 19:36

Is Penny Mordant MP (Minister for Women & Equalities) aware of the very significant meeting hosted today by Dr Lewis Moonie at The House of Lords?
A number of experienced professionals described serious Duty of Care & Safeguarding concerns about how children & vulnerable adults are being treated by gender identity affirmation models in health, education & social care.
If Penny Mordant is not aware, then why not?

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3586228-Important-Standing-For-Women-House-of-Lords-Meeting-today-First-Do-No-Harm-The-ethics-of-transgender-healthcare-hosted-Lord-Moonie-focus-on-the-Duty-of-Care

R0wantrees · 15/06/2019 11:51

Is Penny Mordant concerned by the false representation by BBC, Guardian & BBC reporters of the NSPCC position with regards upholding Safeguarding expectations for all adult ambassadors which has enabled the misapprehension that this was based on transphobia?

Will Penny Mordant please read Jame Kirkup's Spectator article which is an accurate summary & consider seriously the question posed at the end?

'Munroe Bergdorf, the NSPCC and the failure of the media'

(extract)
’ll end this miserable tale with a final exam question:

Fact 1: Munroe Bergdorf was sacked by a child safety charity because the charity said she undermined its child safety work. She has since been lionised and feted, treated as a victim of injustice.

Fact 2: Janice Turner sent a single tweet to ask the charity a question about Munroe Bergdorf’s appointment, an appointment the charity has now accepted was inappropriate and mistaken. Janice Turner has since been vilified, abused and defamed.

Question: what are the differences between Munroe Bergdorf and Janice Turner that might explain the different ways in which they have been treated?"
blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/06/munroe-bergdorfs-sacking-and-the-failure-of-the-media/

Does Penny Mordant agree that the villification of an award-winning female journalist is unacceptable?

Janice Turner in The Times today raises deeply serious questions which Penny Mordant as a senior cabinet minister should be aware of.
Is Penny Mordant aware & if not why not?

'Children won’t find role models in Playboy
The NSPCC was right to axe Munroe Bergdorf as an ambassador, not for being trans but for not respecting the rules'
concludes:

Women may end up as collateral, but then what’s new? This dismantling of safeguards by extreme trans activists is building a reluctant mass movement. Women are forming new organisations, mustering legal challenges, lobbying politicians. These are not modern Mary Whitehouses but Labour members, Greens, lesbians; progressive, humane women — including trans women — who marched against Section 28, who’d defend to the death rights of trans people to live and work free from harassment and discrimination.

don’t want this fight, just as I don’t want to write about it, given the hideous abuse, and the risk to careers and even physical safety it engenders. They’d rather be running book clubs or the PTA or walking their dogs. But fight they must. Because their inner sirens are screaming.

A guide leader wonders why male-bodied trans teenagers are now allowed to sleep in girls’ tents without parents being told, and is sacked. The NSPCC tells a concerned parent: “Should the child or adult identity as female then they are female and there are no safeguarding concerns.” Note “are” female. Thus sex, a protected characteristic under the Equality Act, is erased, and with it all thought for girls. There is no hope of compromise, perhaps “third spaces” where privacy and identity can be balanced: nothing less than total capitulation will do.

But women see what is happening. We know what battering down our boundaries with insults and threats can allow in. Not, to be clear, from trans people, but potential abusive chancers looking for open doors. Peter Bright, a left-wing US tech writer, argued endlessly with feminists on Twitter about gender self-ID. As a proud trans ally, he decried “TERF [trans-exclusionary radical feminist] fear-mongering about public restrooms” as “fact free drivel”, asking “Is that a great disaster? That a girl sees a penis?” Following an FBI sting in which he believed he was grooming a mother into allowing him to have sex with her children, Bright has confessed to discussing “engaging in sexual activity with minors”.

I read every official report into Jimmy Savile’s abuse in hospitals. What struck me was how he easily bought off the men: gave the porters TVs, took sherry with the consultants. He intimidated the young women. The only people who ever barred his way were older nurses. They could not be fooled. Nor are we now. We will not be bullied into surrendering our safeguards and seeing our liberation in porn."

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/children-won-t-find-role-models-in-playboy-ztfjq0t7t?shareToken=a80ba7e9bcd3850e593572a530746785

threads:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3605120-Munroe-Childline-s-first-LGBT-campaigner

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3611125-AIBU-to-say-that-if-you-work-in-child-protection-you-shouldnt-post-pictures-of-yourself-wanking-at-work-in-fetish-gear

NSPCC statement by CEO Peter Wanless
www.nspcc.org.uk/what-we-do/news-opinion/munroe-bergdorf

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3609218-Hi-from-Safe-Schools-Alliance-UK

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3611447-Potential-Systemic-Safeguarding-failures-in-NSPCC-Childline-illustrated-by-appointment-ending-of-relationship-with-Munroe-Bergdorf-Thread-2

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