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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How 'afraid' are we of men?

202 replies

ChipsForSupper · 29/08/2017 09:17

Most of us know, either sadly through experience or through knowledge acquired by observing the world around us, that men can be threatening towards women and most of us are also brought up trained to take precautions such as not going out alone at certain times or to certain places. I was just wondering how individual women feel about this and to what degree it affects each one of us.

Personally, on the surface of it, this rarely worries me and I am happy to go on remote country walks by myself, often walk home late at night etc. This is probably because I am older now, I live in a fairly untroubled neck of the woods and I am a "what are the odds?" type person among other reasons.

However, recently, I broke down very late at night in a quiet country layby. I told the rescue people on the phone that, although I was a woman on my own, I was not a priority because I knew the area well and felt quite safe. While waiting for the breakdown truck to arrive, I even had to get out and and venture into the bushes to have a wee and felt perfectly OK about it. Then, at one point, a saw a man walking up the road in the direction of my car. I felt instantly afraid - even though I knew he probably couldn't see me as the lights were out and was more than likely an innocent soul on his way home from a night out somewhere. Nevertheless, my heart was racing and I held my breath until after he'd gone. This reaction took me by surprise and made me realise that I am affected by this general 'fear' of men.

I've often heard friends say that they are afraid of the dark, or afraid of lonely places or afraid of breaking down etc. All of this happened to me and I was fine until a man came along. What we really mean is, we are afraid of men.

Anyway, I wondered how predominant everyone else feels this fear is in their day to day lives?

OP posts:
Datun · 01/09/2017 01:26

Yes, it's about power. And a gun toting woman would increase the possible threat.

But women are not pre-disposed to violence in the same way that men are.

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2017 06:54

"Well actually I would be scared of a woman - given the conditions I set out and that the woman was more powerful than me. That was my point."
Well, yes. It would be sensible to be scared of a woman with a gun....
Or, indeed, a man with a gun......

ChipsForSupper · 01/09/2017 08:46

Although I am not a quivering wreck at the sight of all men (I feel I have to keep having to say that! Smile ), I would not be as frightened of a woman who walked towards me with a gun on her belt as I would be of a man who walked towards me with a gun in his belt. As Datun says, it's about the predisposition of male violence. So all of the things we do, locking car doors, avoiding lonely places, taking cabs instead of walking are not because we fear the dark or lonely places or breaking down or bears or lions or tigers or large women with guns. It's because we fear male violence.

OP posts:
NoLoveofMine · 01/09/2017 09:24

In my opinion some bringing up cars, guns and so forth are missing the point of the specific threat of male violence against women and girls which we face for being female. There are far too many men (and boys) who target women and girls due to our sex in a way women quite clearly don't with boys and men (or other women). From street harassment to sexual assault to rape to murder, there are so many cases of all of these (with decreasing numbers along that scale but still a number of instances) when the victim is selected purely for being female. We are all aware of this from a young age in one way or another, sometimes something specific brings the awareness of this to us in a slightly more pronounced way which amplifies the fear of it but in various behaviours common to girls and women when in public (which boys and men for the most part wouldn't even think of) we show that the vast majority are aware of it even if many would say they feel no fear of men whatsoever. In my opinion this fear exists in one way or another with the vast majority of women and girls because we know at some level men and boys do target us for attacks of varying severity for no other reason than we're female - something we cannot change but marks us out as targets to some.

I personally find it chilling and utterly infuriating. So many lives ruined and taken because a boy/man was so filled with violent misogyny he saw the girl/woman targeted as so worthless, his to do with as he pleased, his disdain for all women shown in the attack. In my opinion every such attack is an attack on all females because the victims are only attacked for being female so it could be any one of us at any time.

BertrandRussell · 01/09/2017 10:18

It's classic whataboutery.

"Well, women are scary too- if they are homicidal and armed"

museumum · 01/09/2017 10:24

I feel more threatened by groups of men than individual men.
So a quiet night bus or last train I feel nervy but a lone dog walker in the woods when I'm running doesn't bother me.
I suspect this is because I'm quite physically confident (decade of martial arts, string and fit). I know a line attacker could hit me from behind or be armed but I'm far more afraid of a group of men showing off to each other and egging each other on.

EvansGreen · 01/09/2017 14:43

we are afraid of things that we don't know or can't predict, not men

treaclesoda · 01/09/2017 15:51

I'm on a bus right now and there are three boys who couldn't be more than 13 years old, they are tiny. But they are being so loud and obnoxious and so sure if themselves, that they are just taking over the whole space. Yet they haven't actually been aggression or offensive to the extent that there is anything to actually challenge them about. But it made me think of this thread, because in a couple of years those boys will be big, the size of adult men, and they'll probably be on the bus being similarly loud and women will be afraid of them.

treaclesoda · 01/09/2017 15:52

Gah. Autocorrect. I mean they haven't been aggressive.

Elendon · 01/09/2017 16:00

I was with a good female friends last night, couple of wines and a great curry, followed by a DVD.

The conversation came up about facebook posts by MRAs and my friend said that men are unpredictable (she is very wary of men, despite being the mother of two lovely sons whom she has raised well). I agreed. You cannot predict how strange men will behave towards you, nor can you predict how your partner will behave towards you. There is more to this but I really don't want to share.

rockshandy · 02/09/2017 00:10

I am very wary of men. I have been raped, sexually assaulted, and been in abusive relationships, so I do recognise that those experiences have a lot to do with it.

I now have this "persona" that I go into when I am in public. I have only really become fully aware of this recently, but I know I have been doing it for years. I show no emotion, I rarely make eye contact. I keep responses to questions short, and I am extremely sensitive to the environment around me at all times. It is almost a constant state of expectedness. My guard is very rarely down.

It sounds extreme, but in practice it is so instinctual now that really it has become my normal. I am not a quivering wreck. However, I would be lying if I said it didn't take a lot of energy.

Its not that I believe all men are a threat, its just that I know that the ones that are I don't stand a chance against.

I also agree with the poster up thread who said about the car hitting her and she didn't react to protect her child. I had a similar experience only this week, where I was harassed at the swimming pool when with my young daughter. Had I been on my own I would have caused a stink. I would have loudly called for assistance, and I would have made a complaint. In the situation, however, I put my child's needs before my own. I ignored the whole thing as much as possible and I got us out of there as quickly as possible, while keeping things as normal for her as I could.

Miffer · 02/09/2017 03:48

I a country road at night I would definitely be more scared of a man than a woman.

That said in situations where somebody is being aggressive either around me or toward me I am far more physically intimidated by women. I have thought about this before, at work it's not rare that people are aggressive towards me and I am definitely more instinctually fearful of women.

When I reflected on this I think it's for a few of reasons

  1. I am used to male aggression, I find it predictable. When it's around me rather than toward me I always feel like I have a good read on where it's going.

  2. Because of 1 I know that men use it as a "go to" move and 99% of the time showing them it's not fucking working shuts it down.

  3. Men trying to physically intimidate me makes me fucking furious as a first reaction now.

Gentlemanjohn · 04/09/2017 16:53

As a man I genuinely wouldn't be afraid of a woman, but I feel intimidated by anyone being physically close to me. I can't sit next to other people of either gender on public transport. Gives me the heebee jeebies.

Datun · 04/09/2017 19:30

Gentlemanjohn

Isn't that just a personal space thing?

Gentlemanjohn · 04/09/2017 19:47

I just hate people being in physical proximity to me - and being touched more than anything. I guess it is. It makes me anxious.

wintermeyer · 04/09/2017 20:43

In all fairness I'm more afraid of women than men.

AskBasil · 04/09/2017 21:14

Gentlemanjohn, you're derailing. We are talking about women's fear of male violence. Personal space is a different issue.

D'you want to explain why you're more afraid of women than men, wintermeyer?

ocelot41 · 07/09/2017 20:14

I am afraid of men. Experienced an attempted rape at knifepoint as a young woman and feel the fear regularly. It was over twenty years ago - never leaves you

NoLoveofMine · 07/09/2017 21:35

ocelot41 Flowers

Sorry to hear of your experience. I hope you've had support to deal with it but it enrages me so many women and girls suffer such attacks for being female, lives altered forever because of being picked out by men due to being women and girls.

ocelot41 · 07/09/2017 21:46

Thank you No Love

AskBasil · 08/09/2017 17:25

Sad This is why I get really annoyed when TRA's and their handmaids tell us that male violence is no big deal and women are being hysterical and transphobic by not wanting biological men in the same loos or changing rooms. Sorry that happened to you ocelot

Datun · 08/09/2017 18:45

Bloody hell ocelot41. That's dreadful. Flowers

And I agree with AskBasil. It's not about what are the chances?

It's about the number of women who have experienced violence at the hands of men, and simply don't want them in their space whilst they're vulnerable.

Especially, if they think they have the God given right to be there.

A man who enjoys violating women's boundaries would have to do virtually nothing to make that perfectly apparent.

ocelot41 · 08/09/2017 20:04

Thank you Datun. It was a man I thought was a friend, who I trusted and had fun with. That sudden turn about was a bit like ripping a mask off - it makes you feel that there is no one you can trust to be what they seem. It took my husband 8 years to persuade me to marry him but I try never to be alone with a man now, no matter how well I think I know him.

dangermouseisace · 08/09/2017 23:17

I'm afraid of men. Mainly due to being on the receiving end of violence from men and women, and men are definitely worst. I thought I was going to die, many times, at the hand of one man in particular. Numerous sexual assaults, one severe as a child, by men, sometimes trusted men (assault as child) doesn't help.

I see them as stronger than me (even if they don't look it) and unpredictable. Generally Not to be trusted (there are a few select exceptions for close friends ).

I'm trying not to let on with my fear to my young sons.

ocelot41 · 08/09/2017 23:20

That's interesting dangermouse. I am trying to raise DS to be very respectful of others' boundaries. Knocking on doors, stopping tickling the moment the other person says no, not making comments about others' bodies etc.

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