Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

How 'afraid' are we of men?

202 replies

ChipsForSupper · 29/08/2017 09:17

Most of us know, either sadly through experience or through knowledge acquired by observing the world around us, that men can be threatening towards women and most of us are also brought up trained to take precautions such as not going out alone at certain times or to certain places. I was just wondering how individual women feel about this and to what degree it affects each one of us.

Personally, on the surface of it, this rarely worries me and I am happy to go on remote country walks by myself, often walk home late at night etc. This is probably because I am older now, I live in a fairly untroubled neck of the woods and I am a "what are the odds?" type person among other reasons.

However, recently, I broke down very late at night in a quiet country layby. I told the rescue people on the phone that, although I was a woman on my own, I was not a priority because I knew the area well and felt quite safe. While waiting for the breakdown truck to arrive, I even had to get out and and venture into the bushes to have a wee and felt perfectly OK about it. Then, at one point, a saw a man walking up the road in the direction of my car. I felt instantly afraid - even though I knew he probably couldn't see me as the lights were out and was more than likely an innocent soul on his way home from a night out somewhere. Nevertheless, my heart was racing and I held my breath until after he'd gone. This reaction took me by surprise and made me realise that I am affected by this general 'fear' of men.

I've often heard friends say that they are afraid of the dark, or afraid of lonely places or afraid of breaking down etc. All of this happened to me and I was fine until a man came along. What we really mean is, we are afraid of men.

Anyway, I wondered how predominant everyone else feels this fear is in their day to day lives?

OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 30/08/2017 13:24

The comparison with dogs doesn't work for me. My default position there is not wariness either.

RebelRogue · 30/08/2017 13:25

Forgot to add. Where the comparison stops is that safety advice is the same for men and women,and aimed at both.

Elendon · 30/08/2017 14:31

I'm always wary of dogs I don't know, but if I know their owners well then I'm not. I would never in this case press upon my child who was wary to 'love' the dog. Nor have I met owners who would insist upon it. (Well behaved dogs get wary anyway, especially around children).

I certainly wouldn't expect my children to be left alone with a stranger and their dog. Who would?

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 30/08/2017 17:10

I certainly wouldn't expect my children to be left alone with a stranger and their dog. Who would?

Has anyone suggested that? I would not have left my son with a stranger , man or woman, with or without a dog. I don't however have a default position that all dogs are dangerous until proven otherwise.

Datun · 30/08/2017 18:52

Lass. You do make me laugh sometimes.

I love your conviction, (even when I disagree with it.)

cushioncovers · 30/08/2017 19:08

Yes, I am afraid. Even around perfectly nice and gentle men I have my guard up, partly from my own experiences in the past, partly because of what happens in society generally. The rate of male to female violence is fear inducing. I hate feeling like this, I try not to let it run my life but it does have a big impact unfortunately.

This

OlennasWimple · 30/08/2017 20:52

Vestal I'd like to know the statistics in detail, though ... of mothers and women without children walking through dark alleys (overall numbers don't mean anything if mothers never walk home with a baby at night) and how many are raped by strange males. Perhaps it'd be worth it to carry a baby doll around, then

Just to be clear, the situation I was talking about was not in the UK. It wasn't a dark alleyway, it was a relatively main street but in an incredibly dangerous area with significant gang and other organised crime activity. Drive by shootings are common there, as are knife fights, assaults, rapes and almost every other type of serious crime you can think of. The security guard said that there was a long way round to get to where she needed to be, or the "as the crow flies" route which would take her through this area. As she had a pram with her, though, he was confident that she would be safe.

Lurkedforever1 · 30/08/2017 21:06

Being more fearful with dd hasn't ever really been about the logistics of defence/escape for me. But the fear of what could happen to her, mentally or physically if someone attacked me.

The ott fear of dogs and how you can never trust them always confuses me, as the people I've heard express it never feel the same about men. Despite the fact that men are statistically more likely to harm you, and dogs don't hide dangerous behaviour or get away with it because they are believed by a court over the victim.

RebelRogue · 30/08/2017 22:48

What's with all the analogies anyways?
Comparing men to cars,dogs etc. ,which strangely enough are either passive (a car won't randomly run you over all by itself) or operates on animal instinct). Female bodies to possessions that can be locked away,replaced,insured (not on this thread but in general).

AskBasil · 31/08/2017 00:55

"I am hardly going to be afraid of teenage boys Hmm"

Do you not remember the Austrian tourist who was raped by teenage boys in London and left for dead in a canal? The ringleader was 14. She wasn't afraid of them either, because she thought they were just kids.

I have a low-level fear of men because I know that I do not have the physical resource to defend myself against their violence.

TBH i probably wouldn't be able to defend myself against a woman who attacked me either, but a) the chances of a woman attacking me are so slim compared to that of a man doing so and b) I'd have a better chance of defending myself because most women simply do not have the same physical strength, size, mass,etc of men.

YNK · 31/08/2017 01:16

I'm not that scared in these situations, however, I'm not likely to allow a man to get in any position of power in my home. I'm ok with short term visitors since I have 2 very loyal dogs!

Most attacks happen to women in their own homes by someone they know and trust.

The most vulnerable are the old, the very young and the disabled.
I tick 2 of those boxes.

YNK · 31/08/2017 01:18

Now that I think about it I'm usually accompanied by my big dog when I'm out alone.

Titanz · 31/08/2017 01:23

No I'm not afraid. I am however afraid for my partner when he goes out as men are more likely to be attacked.

It's weird because I've been sexually assaulted many times during my life - however I was younger and normalised it to a point where it was expected, it was sort of a local culture thing where it was expected. Now i know different, but I'm still not afraid of men.

The last time I was afraid of a man was when a man who was drugged up entered our A&E and he instantly not liking me, saying he was going to eat my face, and tried to attack me. I had a justifiable reason then though.

KickAssAngel · 31/08/2017 02:36

Let's face it, 1 in 4 women are sexually assaulted at some point in their lives.

If we witnessed/survived a car accident we'd be afraid of/wary of cars & noisy traffic.
If we'd witnessed or been attacked/threatened by a dog we'd be scared of dogs.

We all know that seeing/experiencing/knowing about scary things makes us scared, and that that fear can stay with us for the rest of our lives, no matter how illogical it is. So, yes, of course large numbers of women are afraid of men, or cautious etc. I know that NAMALT but that isn't really relevant, is it?

I know that NADogsALT, but my neighbour's aggressive dog has made me scared of dogs, and no-one tries to tell me to get over it. I get sympathy. So I expect the same support and understanding for a fear of men.

GardenGeek · 31/08/2017 02:47

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Bloodybridget · 31/08/2017 07:21

Now I'm in my 60s, and for the past couple of decades, I've experienced far less harassment from men, and in general I don't think I change my behaviour much to feel safer. But I'm rarely out alone late at night, my street feels pretty safe (for me, not necessarily for a young person of either sex). When I was young I used to walk in the countryside on my own with no anxiety, and now I think I would be a bit nervous, maybe.

annandale · 31/08/2017 07:39

Yes I have a general fear of men. I don't feel good about it as I have never known any man be violent towards me. Too much Crimewatch?

Flossy if you are not afraid why would you sit in a locked car until rescued? I have to say i am afraid of breaking down on the motorway as I believe it's dangerous to sit in your car on the hard shoulder and i feel vulnerable being a visible lone woman outside my car. I go running alone but now only in well populated areas; I was up a lane a couple of years ago with no escape route or people/houses around and a man walking towards me; I felt stupid and ashamed of being so afraid but I was. I think my fear has got worse as I have got older, I'm not ill and am relatively fit and strong but I know I am weaker at 50 than I was at 30.

bambambini · 31/08/2017 09:23

Not daily - no and i go for long country walks on my own and walk back home at night late.

Had a few individual cases where i was scared. One walking on a track on holiday. Had a guy walking behind me fast. Came to a fork and he picked the one i had picked. I was terrified and adrenaline soaring. Thought if he was going to attack me he'd have to do it face on so i turned, stopped and faced him ( pretending i was staring back st something). He just walked past and i felt a bit stupid but very relieved.

NoLoveofMine · 31/08/2017 10:06

There have been some comments along the lines of "when I was young I was sexually assaulted/harassed, but not now". It's probably not meant to but this makes me feel almost as if it's being dismissed that girls and young women go through street harassment, are objectified and treated as such regularly by boys and men known and unknown to them, it's just one of those things you go through as a female so should deal with it. Also, age doesn't change male violence being a risk, as cases such as these show: www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/man-admits-rape-of-woman-aged-81-in-balham-a3488436.html
www.getwestlondon.co.uk/news/local-news/guilty-serial-sex-predator-who-8494510

I also think some girls and women would say they aren't fearful of men but actually automatically do things which show that at some level they are, in how we act, routes we take, little things we do for safety, times we'd cross the road to avoid certain situations, there are all sorts of things along the lines of these: www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/05/07/what-women-have-to-do-to-be-careful_n_7072080.html

I have wariness rather than constant "fear" but I am very aware of being a target for some purely due to being female. I find it enraging that this alone makes us targets for a certain kind of male violence and that so many women and girls have had lives ruined or even taken for no other reason than that they were female. I'm lucky I live in a nice area which I love but this awareness is, I feel, difficult to rid yourself of when you have it.

GardenGeek and KickAssAngel I think you've both put it very well and far better than I'm managing.

NoLoveofMine · 31/08/2017 10:09

I also only mentioned area because I mean I'm lucky I feel relatively safe where I live, as I've posted on this thread earlier male violence against women and girls can and does happen in every kind of area. I'm enraged the two schoolgirls assaulted in separate incidents by men in Richmond upon Thames earlier this year received so little coverage (though not surprising as these incidents aren't as rare as many think), especially as the second attacker was never caught.

SomeOtherFuckers · 31/08/2017 11:24

Never thought I was. Then I went to a festival this weekend and wouldn't go to sleep unless my mates were either sat in front of the tent door or someone was between me and it. The dislocated voices were what did it

AskBasil · 31/08/2017 11:28

I think there's a huge pressure to deny any fear of men. Because it makes men uncomfortable and women feel that they're being stupid and hysterical and getting it all out of proportion, or just plain man-hating.

We are supposed to accept the prevalence of male violence and the constant low-level threat of it, with a "NAMALT" response, but at the same time we are supposed to be really careful not to invite male violence by going to certain places, wearing certain clothes, doing certain things.

The background knowledge that there's always a threat, is supposed to be a) ignored but also b) taken into account so that we don't go to places where men can easily attack us otherwise we're asking for it, because what did we expect?

It's an attitude of cognitive dissonance. It's why women can say: "I don't have any fear of men at all", while ensuring that they always get cabs when it's late at night rather than walk a short distance to home (it's not wolves or bears they're avoiding, is it?), or that they will sit in their locked car (because who do you fear will open the door and what will they do, if it's not locked?).

AskBasil · 31/08/2017 11:31

Sorry, I meant to say or that they would sit in their locked car if they broke down, because there's nothing to fear.

As other people have asked, if there's nothing to fear, why do the car doors need to be locked?

Sorry to the poster who posted that, I'm not "getting" at you, but that is such a classic example of cognitive dissonance, that it's striking. (Unless of course, you do live in an area where there are wandering bears who have learned how to unlock car doors. I know little of bear-skillz.)

NoLoveofMine · 31/08/2017 11:43

Very true AskBasil. We're supposed to be simultaneously taking precautions (which don't actually serve to protect against male violence anyway since women and girls of all ages are attacked in all sorts of places at all hours of the day) yet emphasising NAMALT and not naming what we're supposed to be guarding against lest we be labelled "man hating" or "hysterical". It's also ironic that the misogynist/victim blaming response which often comes after a woman is attacked is one which pretty much says women and girls should view all men as potential attackers and that such attack is inevitable. Yet if we ever said we viewed men as such the criticism and accusations of "man hating" would swiftly follow.

I feel the threat is always there as I said because I know to some boys and men being a female marks you out as a target and has resulted in so many attacks.

deydododatdodontdeydo · 31/08/2017 12:08

women and girls of all ages are attacked in all sorts of places at all hours of the day

Not with equal occurrence though.
Even you have said where you live is "relatively safe".

Swipe left for the next trending thread