Do women use certain terms to 'shame' certain types of men?

[Enzouk]

Just wondering about female perspectives on this. I increasingly hear women calling guys 'creepy' as a shaming tactic..generally I think that the women doing so do it only if they don't find the man attractive. Where as they will pander to a guy who is physically attractive to thrm they will hate on a guy who acts the exact same way who physically is not attractive to them. I have seen women do it in front of groups of friends in a sort of 'lets put this guy in his place' way. Thoughts? And what do you think of women who do this?

Also, i suppose on similar lines...are women more shallow than men with regards to physical attraction?

OP, you asked us to consider our sons.

If my son were caught up in this red pill (and similar) kind of stuff, I'd be very worried about him.

These red pill type things are 5% true and 95% connecting dots to make patterns that are not there. It is about wanting easy answers to the complexity of life. It's basically a conspiracy theory. You need to get out.

This is from a Guardian article, written by a man, about the red pill:

'What the boys of The Red Pill need, in all honesty, is a massive dose of Romantic poetry. They need a dedicated course of treatment in the novels of Jane Austen and Dostoevsky, combined with significant therapy in negative capability.

They need to learn that love is awful, in the both the ancient and modern senses of the world – that love is infinitely more powerful and real than any marketplace, sexual or otherwise.'

op are you 'creepy' guy??

Put it this way... A man was judged solely on his looks - thought provoking? This has been happening since day dot for women. If an 'unattractive' woman approached a group of men uninvited she would be called a desperate slag.

I used to have a male friend like you - all his life failings where blamed on how horrible women were. 'Only liked bad boys, only like good looking men, only like rich guys, good guys finish last '... When in fact he was just a knob.

Almondpudding...are you samuggesting that tinder experiment is fake then? Looking at the forums discussing it, it seems to have been validated many times over with different models used and screenshots as proof...

I think the 'red pill' thing is pretty true in that respect...in these experiments the good looking guy can say pretty much anything he wants no matter how 'creepy' and it doesnt seem to take long before he gets the girls number. Like even if she initially protests and calls him out for being weird, he just changes the subject and gets her number... I.e. his appearance wins over everything else.

Jinglebellsandv0dka...look at the experiment link i posted. Says a lot. And no as stated i have a gf but it doesnt matter if you believe me on that. Would she be with me if i was 5 foot 6 and balding...probably not.

m 43. If I approached an 18 year old boy and struck up a flirty conversation with him, or any conversation in a bar, I'm pretty confident he would think it creepy and I would get a negative response

Yet older men thought it perfectly acceptable to approach me when I was a teenager

This with bells on. This used to happen to me.

Carmenta..I think suicide is the saddest thing there is. It is someone who has reached absolute rock bottom depression and rather than just crying for help or whatever is completely intent on ending their life because it is hopeless. The fact that men feel like this so much more frequently than women...at four times the rate...yes, I think it is alarming and more people need to take note of it rather than just brushing it off as 'men need to be able to talk to someone'.

I could probably equally quote 20 other statistics of men having things harder than women like you have just done vice versa... But what is the point ...we' ll just go off topic. If i mention courts favouring women for custody or men getting longer prison sentences then i'll just have a million off topic replies telling me im wrong.

What is the Tinder experiment supposed to show?

Of course good looking people get away with stuff other people do not.

He's ridiculously good looking. The vast majority of women will never come into contact with a man that physically attractive, much less have a conversation with him. Of course they'd behave differently.

What gets me is when men purposely post in fem chat then get pissed off and accuse womrn of being hard core feminists when they don't get the answer they want.

It's goady as fuck.

Why not post in general chat op ? It speaks volumes about the type of conversation and interaction you wanted from this thread...

The more you post op it's quite clear you have a chip on your shoulder. You don't like women much do you?

Did you have a good relationship with your mother ?

But by making this connection between being called 'creepy' and suicide, you are brushing off suicide.

There's plenty of good research into certain personality types that are prone to suicide, what makes it more likely, which ethnic groups, age ranges, the particular pressures etc.

But you're so busy trying to make a connection that's not there, you're not listening to the voices of the people who are likely to go through it,

Almondpudding...did you read that tinder experiment to the end? The point was that the guy could be as 'creepy' as he liked and still get a positive reaction. It was about the hypocrisy of women saying that certain actions or words are 'creepy' but that when a very good looking man acts in that way he is given a free pass to do as he pleases. And lets not forget that these women are to be meeting this guy alone ...to hook up. So apparently their worry about safety etc goes out of the window when he is hot...but when a nice but less attractive guy approaches in a bar she feels physically threatened at a mere introduction. Sorry but i do struggle to buy that concept.

I'm certainly not brushing off suicide.... As i said, I think it is the saddest thing possible. I only mentioned it because someone moved away from the original topic by responding that women have more difficult lives in generaland given the suicide stat is so much higher in men i'm not sure i agree. I think if women committed suicide at 4 times the rate that men do then we would hear a lot more about it than we do, in the media etc.

What is "red pill" and "PUA"?

You are conflating a whole load of different things.

A particular word or action is not in itself 'creepy.' It depends on the context, and that does include who does it.

If I walk into a club and think I am going to go up to men and behave in ways that I think Margot Robbie could get away with, that would massively entitled and delusional - both of which are components of creepiness.

Women often do feel more threatened by men they know they will reject, because it is frequently rejection that leads to aggression.

And it is also worth pointing out that being good looking does not mean you can get away with anything, with anyone.

(I know I could Google. Can't be arsed.)

You can't just use the suicide rate by itself to prove men have a harder life, just because many people choose or are forced by circumstance (by suicide attempts not working, feeling unable to commit suicide because of caring responsibilities etc) to live with unhappiness/misery doesn't mean they don't still feel it.

Just looked up suicide rates by country, the UK's is much higher than Syria, will be telling them to shut up about their war torn country now, I obviously have it much worse as a Brit, the suicide rates say so! Is the experience of the 'statistical' woman, raped or if 'lucky' only sexually harrassed, abused in her relationship etc not worth anything if she's not prepared to kill herself to prove how unhappy she is then? Have a look at numbers of women on anti-depressants, having mental health support etc.

And your solution to men's suicide is for women to fuck them, no matter if the women find them attractive or not.

Disgusting trivialization of both suicide and consent.

RedPill is part of the manosphere.

They have a set of core beliefs about male and female behaviour.

They think if you follow the principles women will want to date you.

Some of the principles are sensible and some are not.

Oh come on almondpudding you're making some massive excuses there. All the time men are told nonsense like 'its not about looks', 'such and such behaviour is creepy', 'so and so is a sleaze because he said or did ...'.

What that experiment showed was that what women say and what they do in the presence of a good looking male are two different things. The funny thing is I have seen women publicly shame men...taking screenshots of the tinder messages and posting them on facebook or whatever to humiliate the 'creepy' guy. Guess what? The difference is that the guy wasnt good looking. I don't think making this point ia conflating anything.

Who in their right mind believes sexual attraction is not in part about looks? Of course it is.

I don't know who is saying that, and who is believing that, but they are wrong. It's not something I've ever heard my teens say or that I would say to them.

If you are not exceptionally good looking, whether male or female, you are creepy and sleazy if you walk up to people and behave as if you are.

And if you are good looking, you are still going to come across to some people as creepy and sleazy.

MrsTerryPrachett ... Thats not exactly what i said is it? Although i will say that i believe men who struggle with women are more likely to commit suicide. I'm not sure how someone could do a study on that ..its pretty impossible....but think about it. Who is likely to be more depressed...male model from the tinder experiment who can do no wrong in the eyes of any women no matter how awful his personality is, or nice guy average/poor looking joe who gets glared at any time he even looks at a woman?

'Oh come on almondpudding you're making some massive excuses there."

And that is a very rude thing to say. I have not been rude to you, and have attempted to give honest answers.

If you can't be civil, you're not going to get much of a conversation.

Enzouk - it's actually very unlikely either of them will be depressed, going purely on their success rate with women. You clearly have a very low understanding of mental health if you think that would be even one of the pertinent factors to either of them becoming/avoiding becoming depressed.

Almondpudding ...i think i've been fairly clear here that i am not talking about an average guy acting like he is the best looking man in the world. I've mentioned him being shamed for pretty normal behaviour...or simply being bold (because a man pretty much has to do this to start a relationship..very few women ever approach or want to approach first).

The tinder experiments just show that the veey good looking guy can get away with anything. Like it or not, women do talk a lot about what is 'creepy' and what is not. That is why that experiment went viral. Because it showed that women's idea of 'creepy' is very shallow.

Also... Women say all the time 'oh its not about looks for me...im just attracted to a man who can make me laugh'...or 'just be confident'. So..i think you're wrong there.

Ok fair point almondpudding..reading back , you haven't been rude and that did sound a bit rude from me. I just feel almost a bit exasperated that nobody can go 'yeah actually that tinder experiment is pretty sad'. Or something to that effect.

So you're basing this on a selection of women who choose to be on tinder and are either looking for or at least open to casual sex? Nothing wrong with that but there are other women with other attitudes in the world, some of these will suit your looks/personality/outlook on life, some won't.