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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

I thought I was a feminist until someone showed me this forum.

207 replies

debucnik · 18/04/2015 08:20

As in the title I was brought up to believe that feminism is about equality and choice but having recently been introduced to this forum it would appear that that is not the case. The forum gives the impression that feminism is not a choice but compliance to a set of rules.

When did feminism change to fight anyone who doesn't conform to what feminists want, instead of embracing the fact that women are equal with men and its our choice to do what we want?

OP posts:
StillLostAtTheStation · 18/04/2015 14:34

cailanda As I said before I struggle with the endless negativity; turning everything in to a feminist issue; blanket statements about how awful it is being a women; a determination to put the worst possible interpretation on any situation; looking for ways to be offended.

For example the thread exploding with anger because a man in a shop called someone "love" or something similar. The nice man of non white British ethnic origin in a local newsagent calls me that. I quite like it - he didn't when I first started buying a paper there - now he does. Should I come down on him like a ton of bricks?

Similarly there was an extremely rude response to one of the few male posters whose own post had been utterly misinterpreted. Frankly what he said was perfectly clear and supportive and you would have had to jump through several hoops to twist it the way it was to lambast him.

The ways several of you who are determinedly of the view all things can be gender neutral still manage to dismiss things which might just appeal more often to a girl. The badge of honour in being able to say "my daughter hates pink " The commiserations offerred that she will grow out of it if she does.

Am I feminist? Never called myself that. I am a wife and a mother . I have always worked. I suppose I get on with my life.

Someone posted a link to the thread in AIBU. It's interesting reading.

cailindana · 18/04/2015 14:36

If you're not a feminist why do you come on this board? That's a genuine question by the way, I'm not being snarky.

cailindana · 18/04/2015 14:38

"For example the thread exploding with anger because a man in a shop called someone "love" or something similar. The nice man of non white British ethnic origin in a local newsagent calls me that. I quite like it - he didn't when I first started buying a paper there - now he does. Should I come down on him like a ton of bricks?"

With this example, a bunch of posters on a thread find being called "love" offensive, you don't. That's a difference of opinion. No one would say anyone should come down on anyone else "like a ton of bricks" - why would they? It's up to you how you deal with that situation.

Feminism does see things like women being called "love" as an issue. You don't. That's fine, especially as you're not a feminist. You don't have to engage with feminism at all.

Hakluyt · 18/04/2015 14:39

"For example the thread exploding with anger because a man in a shop called someone "love" or something similar."

Could you link to that thread, please?

cailindana · 18/04/2015 14:40

As an analogy, I'm not religious and don't agree with religion at all. I could go on the religion boards and say "why do you always talk about Jesus, I don't think Jesus was real" etc etc but why should I expect anyone to listen to me? It's clearly a board for people who do engage with religion so it would be odd for me to go on there and tell them they're all wrong. I wouldn't expect to get a great response.

YonicScrewdriver · 18/04/2015 15:02

Still, that was the post to which Backinthebox responded how you describe. The doughnut reference is to a bun like hairstyle, I believe.

If there is a different one that I have missed, I would welcome you posting it.

BuffyEpistemiwhatsit · 18/04/2015 15:05

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

StillLostAtTheStation · 18/04/2015 15:30

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/2324812-When-men-call-you-darling-or-lov

Sorry Buffy no need to drop your hand. That is appreciated.

I'm not sure the religious analogy works. I am a woman. I have opinions on issues that affect women. One does not have to identity as a feminist for that.

BuffyEpistemiwhatsit · 18/04/2015 15:32

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

cailindana · 18/04/2015 15:34

Yes, so you post on mumsnet as the whole of mumsnet discusses issues that affect women. But why come on the feminist board if you don't agree with feminism?

almondcakes · 18/04/2015 15:37

This always happens on these threads. Somebody will start a thread saying they don't like the feminist section, someone will complain about the regulars, and then someone who posts on here all the time will agree about how awful and rude and abrasive the regulars are.

Stilllostatthestation, this time that poster is you. You are a regular. You are a prolific poster. You post on the feminist section all the time. People often find your posting style abrasive.

If people are complaining about rude regulars, that means you too!

SenecaFalls · 18/04/2015 15:52

For example the thread exploding with anger because a man in a shop called someone "love" or something similar.

I have read the thread. I don't think anyone was exploding with anger about being called "love"; the snarkier posts were actually people thinking it was ok.

cailindana · 18/04/2015 15:56

Yeah, the posters who didn't see it as a problem were very sarcastic while all the others were offering advice on how to deal with it. I didn't see anyone "exploding with anger."

Hakluyt · 18/04/2015 16:28

Mighty we be getting to the point here?

Because if somebody could read that thread and genuinely think that anyone was "exploding with anger", then FWR threads must look like a nuclear war to them.......

BuffyEpistemiwhatsit · 18/04/2015 16:51

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 18/04/2015 17:01

I've read that thread.

"Exploded in anger" ???

Confused Hmm

StillLostAtTheStation · 18/04/2015 17:40

Yes, so you post on mumsnet as the whole of mumsnet discusses issues that affect women. But why come on the feminist board if you don't agree with feminism?

What does that even mean? I'm not allowed to express an opinion on rape or prostitution or prnography unless I agree with "feminism"? This forum discussed those issues in far greater depth, including the idiocy of the Green party policies. I contributed to those threads.

Whose definition of "feminism" anyway? How often are there threads on here about how misguided so called liberal feminists are and they aren't really feminists either.

I can't remember who said it but apparently being a Tory means one isn't be a feminist. I'm pretty certain Lousie Mensch considers she is.

cailindana · 18/04/2015 17:43

You've said you don't agree with feminism. So obviously people on a feminist board are going to have different views to you. Which is something you seem to object to. That's what I don't understand.

reni1 · 18/04/2015 17:49

I think it boils down to training girls to be meek and sweet, not vociferous (opinionated!) or loud (shrill! disagreeable!). Many grown up women are uncomfortable arguing at all. Of course many feminists have successfully overcome this terrible conditioning so look a bit confrontational. Not the worst thing to be.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 18/04/2015 17:54

Lousie Mensch - ha!

Fairenuff · 18/04/2015 17:55

OP are you going to engage with the posters on the thread at all? If not, why did you start it?

sausageeggbacon11 · 18/04/2015 18:11

I am split here, part of me is very liberal feminism pro choice (and before people start going on about choice being limited that applies to 98% of the population both men and women) but I do have some issues that get up my nose. I certainly know I am not the best liked person on the board but I will throw in my opinion asked for or not. If I feel it is pointless answering things I won't waste my time but on some subjects I will weigh in continually, some people don't like my opinions well I will go to bed crying my eyes out (not). The problem is that there is more than one opinion on what feminism should be and this board is more towards the radical than the liberal. Sometimes I think it would be nice if there were more liberal posters. I will say that whole issue here is reflected in the real world where many of us find the Bindels' and Burchils' laughable rather than some sort of goddess. I have reached an age where I am quite amused when people get upset at my opinion.

Hakluyt · 18/04/2015 18:23

Have you seen the research (I'll look it out in a bit) which says that if any group has a third or more women, people think that women are in a majority? I wonder whether something like that is going on? Women are so used to being compliant and agreeing that if a woman disagrees they are perceived as aggressive and bullying?

uglyswan · 18/04/2015 18:32

OP - you've done it now. You've split the feminist movement right down the middle. Things fall apart, the centre cannot hold, and mankind can breath again, safe in the knowledge that the matriarchy, the evil tyranny of shouty women, has been averted at the last moment. Are you happy now, OP? ARE YOU HAPPY?

StillLostAtTheStation · 18/04/2015 18:36

callandaia what I said and have said before is I disagree with some, perhaps a lot of the views expressed on here. I'm still puzzled why that should preclude me expressing an opinion on issues which affect women. Particularly those issues I referred to.. The Green thread was fascinating and informative.

Why do I have to agree with feminism to have an opinion ? And whose definition of feminism?