Would you get rid of the titles "Miss" and "Mrs" and use just "Ms" if you could?

[peppaistired]

I would like to campaign somewhere about this. I don't see the point in having so many titles around for women, and only one and simple for men: "Mr"
After all, why should people or society care if we're married, or single? They don't seem to care in the case of men, why is there still an issue with women's marital status?

But as temporaryusername sad, "Retaining the three titles is imposing your choice, and all its implications, on other women who would prefer a system that at least paid lip service to the idea of equality." I want society as a whole, not only women, to remove the choice. And yes that will be progress.

Fad if you get the choice to have Ms as the only title, is anyone going to give a damn about the effect it has on me? I guess my feelings and needs don't matter.

And how, exactly, will that be progress? You haven't explained that.

Firstly it don't think people do make the choice often to be Mrs. I think most just do it because it's the norm and they think that's what you're supposed to do or because their fiancées want them too.
When women do go by Mrs it doesn't just affect them. It is a choice that has a negative impact on all women. It perpetuates the idea that women's worth is based on their relationship to a man.

It will be some progress toward equality. Women and men will be treated equally in the matter of titles.

Not being allowed the choice to be Mrs would have a negative effect on me, itsbetterinabox - don't I matter? Or are my feelings and happiness an acceptable sacrifice?

"Fad if you get the choice to have Ms as the only title, is anyone going to give a damn about the effect it has on me? I guess my feelings and needs don't matter."

Of course they do. But perpetuating misogynist, patriarchal stereotypes is bad for all women. And men, actually. And the suggestion that women should be identified via their relationship with men is such a misogynist, patriarchal stereotype.

Alternatively, you might find that women make the choice to be Mrs because they've made the choice for themselves

I know, it can be hard to accept other people's views when they are at such odds with your own, but try to think of it as not imposing your will or views on other women.

Yes, it's annoying and I purposefully don't select an option if I can help it, and I don't write it when I post things to people

And why might women decide to identify themselves in relation to their relationships with men?

Hmmm - not sure where 'fad' came from - or what I was trying to type. And no alcohol has been taken, I assure you.

SirChenjin I'm just going to copy and paste what I said above -

If you want to argue for a system where woman are preceded by an announcement of marital status and/or personal views, you can. I don't think you can use the argument of 'don't impose your choice on me' very effectively though. Retaining the three titles is imposing your choice, and all its implications, on other women who would prefer a system that at least paid lip service to the idea of equality.

OddBoots is right, none of the choices are good, and the 'choice' to have no title or a more neutral one is not even on the menu. Some of us would choose to get rid of multiple options and all that implies.

I really find it odd that some people are offended and resentful at the prospect of women being put in the same position wrt titles that men are already in. If you feel that strongly, shouldn't you be campaigning for men to have these liberating 'choices'? Do you wonder why men aren't campaigning for that?

Actually it seems quite likely individual preference will continue on this, but will gradually phase out the options. I think maybe what will happen is that more and more women will stop using Miss/Mrs until it starts to look very odd to do so, and gradually those options won't be placed on forms.

Hak - it is absolutely none of your business why one woman decides to identify herself in a certain way. None at all. All the claims of the removal of choice being for the greater good somehow are spurious.

Temporary - use the Ms option. Problem solved.

"ak - it is absolutely none of your business why one woman decides to identify herself in a certain way. None at all."

That's why my question was couched in general terms.

But women in general need to be aware that the choices they make impact, sometimes negatively, on other women. Not to say they should not then make them. But they should be made in full knowledge and awareness that it is an anti feminist choice.

Yeah, but it isn't solved, is it Sir Chen, because while I might choose Ms, the whole of society gets to keep on insisting that whether or not I choose to define myself by my relationship to men is meaningful.

Can you reiterate what feeling or need you think is being met by choosing your prefix? And why do men not need the same choice, do you think?

I think the term 'feminism is not about choice' is more that feminism really isn't about choice, it's a political movement which seeks to liberate women from the oppression of patriarchy, rather than, you're not allowed to make choices, you daft woman IYSWIM?

FWIW, I use Ms now. It's the only choice as far as I see it that, within patriarchy, doesn't define me as belonging to someone else. My birth surname was also a source of bullying, including racist bullying, I hated it, so I understand that feeling.

Providing choices for all women to make freely is not anti-feminist.

I think maybe what will happen is that more and more women will stop using Miss/Mrs until it starts to look very odd to do so, and gradually those options won't be placed on forms.

This is what has been happening in the US and Canada for years.

"Providing choices for all women to make freely is not anti-feminist."

It is if some of those choices perpetuate misogyny and the patriarchy. Which identifying women by their availability or otherwise to men is.

How would not being Mrs affect you badly STD?

How does the whole of society get to keep on insisting that whether or not you choose to define yourself by your relationship to men is meaningful? It doesn't - you (and all women) are offered 3 choices (and more, usually) and you pick the one which suits you best.

I've already said upthread that I would prefer to do away with titles altogether - however, I recognise that other people have alternative opinions, and as a result am not about to start a campaign to impose my egalitarian principles on others.

What are the positives of making the 'choice'? What good do these titles do for women or society as a whole?

Sirchenjin it isn't just a simple choices. We are heavily pressured to be mrs and name change if we marry. It's still seen as the right thing to do and insulting to men not to! The stigma attracted Ms also pressures women not to use it. It is not just a choice.

I know - awful things, choices, aren't they. Much better if women who don't conform to the correct way of thinking are simply guided by women who know better