Mounjaro / Wegovy with > 5st / 30kg to lose: Thread 4

[VelociraptorsVelociRapping]

Thread 4 (!) of this lovely community. Anyone using weight-loss injections to lose more than 5 stone or 30kg is very welcome to join us.

No discount codes, please - these need to go in the dedicated thread on this board and they will be deleted.

Agree re Robin/Holliday. And you might feel a wee bit different about Tom B after the final episode of 🖤🖤🖤

On the audio book Robert Glenister gives Strike a slightly Cornish accent which took some getting used to. But as Glenister seems to be the worlds finest audiobook narrator I went all in with that & I'm used to it now.

I couldn't agree more.

I shared this anecdote way on the first thread but it has stayed with me and I think about it often. I remember being offered cake at work and my very slim, healthy colleague politely declining saying 'no thanks, it was my daughter's birthday yesterday and I had a massive piece of cake then.' It genuinely blew my mind that she would naturally have a mindset of moderation over the course of the week, still incorporating celebrations and treats but overall remaining within sensible limits. It was such a contrast to my all-or-nothing, start-again-tomorrow mindset that I am trying really hard to unpick.

Its so difficult.
Growing up in a dysfuctional family, food was everything. Its was love, joy, reward, treat, kindness - everything was expressed by/through/with/around/about food, but never expressed emotionally away from food.

So weird stuff/thoughts around food seems to be knitted into me.

Even though I know it is wrong, I cannot shed this warped thinking - everything goes through this weird food prism of lies. I know its lies. That is what I am going to have to work with. I don't think I can undo this embedded early learning about food - goodness knows I've tried (and failed) for far too long.

So now I'm trying simply to add new truths on top. To pay attention to my mind and address constantly the messages about food.

Like @InfoSecInTheCity 's reaction to the guy in her circuit class, I have strong inbuilt reactions to food. Mostly built around feelings of depravation - which considering I've never once been short of food in 57 years is a dreadful lie. I don't even think these feelings of depravation were even mine - they are 100% my Mums (and yes I think she grew up very deprived especially of love), and yet they seem to have become embedded in me from a very young age. I'm not trying to shirk responsibility, just trying to express how I am looking to unpick all of this - it feels like such a mystery & so difficult and I think that is because so much of this gets embedded in us when we are young.

As much as I have struggled, I've tried so hard to bring my daughters up with much healthier attitudes & in a very different environment. I've never talked negatively about my body or food in front of them. I've never talked about diets. We talk about healthy portion sizes, eating a balanced diet, & making healthy food choices etc. We discuss how amazing our bodies are etc. so hopefully I have broken this chain.

Even after losing 24 kilos my teenage girls barely notice - they really don't think its anything to comment on. They are interested in my regular exercise and see how happy that is making me - they are encouraging and supportive, but the food side of things and the weighloss side is not even on their radar. I'm proud of that. I will not be trotting them off to WeightWatchers age 16.

I don't think I'll ever shake these funny ideas about food off, but I am aware of them, I see & feel them, and I'm committed to dealing with them one dodgy thought at a time.

@VelociraptorsVelociRapping I have had similar reactions to the office birthday cake and colleague declining. The unfathomable mystery of it all.

My brain screaming "Its just one (make it LARGE, have 2, there will be leftovers - TAKE THEM HOME, oooh icing) slice of cake".

I need to learn to stick to this thread. The rest of this board is becoming genuinely unusable. I've had to sit on my hands on so many threads where the OP is just plain lazy and clearly hasn't read even the patient info leaflet.

Bitch over. As you were.

I love this thread - its such a cool space to explore thoughts and celebrate with each other.

As for the other WLI threads I agree. Its a bit like Twitter/X - its fine if I stay in my lane, but as soon as I wander into "general pop" the crazy is very strong & not great.

@VelociraptorsVelociRapping yes, lots of new users. I engage my work head strategy of enabling people to help themselves and direct them to the leaflet instead of telling them the answer......and try to comprehend how anyone could start any POM, especially one which is so alien as it is probably the first injectable/storage sensitive/weekly medication most people will ever have had before without reading and understanding the patient leaflets which are actually very good, very clear and not a difficult or particularly long read.

Ah yes, my most used phrase at work is "What does it say in the knowledgebase?" so so so frequently the answer is "I don't know, I thought you'd know" ‼️💥😖

All this discussion the last day or two has given me a lot of pause for thought.

I’ve really struggled the last two weeks on MJ - its just not done what it has previously with regards to appetite suppression and food noise (its time to dose up and I will be!).

It’s made me consider about life after weightloss. I would like to continue because the other benefits have been great, but I need to think about how I eat and reframe normal.

Food in my family is like others have said, the centre of all events, and I really need to learn that it does not need to be the norm to consume so much just because others do. The only people I know who don’t do that, have the complete opposite issue and that’s also miserable and unhealthy.

I think I have two main things to tackle, one is finding a way to socialise and enjoy life in a non food centred way. This feels far more doable, because volume isnt necessarily my biggest issue with food.

The other is my really bad sweet stuff habit. Early mounjaro days it stopped a lot because i had strong enough suppression for it to be a revolting thought. But now I am so far, the urge to eat sweet things is there a lot of the week. Don’t get me wrong, its within my deficit. But its not one single chocolate bar, it might be two, or a little picky bowl. Its not hunger, its in my brain. I also know its a dopamine thing. But its got to get kicked in to touch. I’m not missing anything not having them. I just haven’t figured out how to kick it. I know some folks will say, just have some yoghurt and fruit etc, or other sweet, healthier thing, but that isn’t my answer. I don’t want it to fill me up, i don’t even think its specifically craving sugar on some kind of body, basic level. Its in my head, like ‘oh, still got 400 calories for my deficit, that a ripple and x amount of jaffa cakes’. If i am out and busy, its far less of a thought, but does that mean I am never going to get a night in front of the telly without my brain ruining it.

Basically, these last two weeks have made me realise food noise coming back in full is my biggest fear. I don’t know if I can fix it, if MJ stops doing what it needs to for me, at the highest dose, some day.

sorry, this is me being a rambly downer, but on the plus side, i’ve lost what i’ve gained last week haha!

I've asked this in a different thread but wondered if any of you had any experience of changing your injection days, the official advice on the leaflet says as long as it's been 72 hours it's fine.

I originally did Mondays as I work Fri-Sun so thought I could deal with side effects at home, I have been lucky enough to have only had mild side effects so far.

15 weeks on I'm finding that having minimal suppression whilst I'm at work particularly on a night shift surrounded by snacks is really hard. So before Christmas I moved my injection forward one day to Sunday which has helped.

I'm thinking it might be best to change my day completely and inject on a Thursday instead. It has been more than 72 hours since my last injection (Sunday 9am) so would most people just inject today and then stick with Thursday or move the day more gradually?

I get it @Darlinghag Its a brain/thought thing & for some of us these thoughts/issues seem to be so deeply embedded.

When I did the Gillia Riley "Eat Less" course she talked a lot about rewiring neurons and pathways in the brain. This does seem to be how we address it.

So every night when you have the chocolate calling you need an intervention to change your behaviour.

I guess its like smoking. You don't have to stop smoking "forever" and the thought of never smoking again can be terrifying for a smoker. But in order to stop smoking you just have to not smoke right now - i.e. not have a cigaratte in this actual moment when your body is screaming for one.

You don't have to give up chocolate forever - you just need a workable intervention RIGHT NOW to avoid chocolate in this moment.

Riley's theory (and she did present data to support this) is every time we intervene and don't act upon the unwanted urge to eat food we don't want or need, we are rewiring pathways of neurons in the brain. Do this often enough is how we change embedded habits.

Your call to choclate is your Pavlovs dog moment. You have the thought about evening chocolate (borne out of habit and years of reinforced behaviour), you start salivating, you eat the chocolate - often its an automatic response. If you don't respond in the old way the moment becomes very uncomfortable for you. This discomfort I think it what we need to deal with - feel the discomfort. It's just a crappy feeling. Its transient. It will pass. Find a mantra or breathe through it. Tell yourself, "oh its that thought demanding choclate again - its just a thought. I choose not to eat chocolate now. I might choose to eat chocolate another time but right now I do not choose to eat choclate. This discomfort will soon pass".

If you respond with chocolate the behaviour is reinforced. If you don't respond with chocolate you start to break the habit, weaken the response. And then apparently it gets easier.

Like you I'm a bit terrified of what happens post MJ. But if the problem is in our brain then it seems clear that the solution must be in our brain too.

@WafflingDreamer I think I'd move the day to Friday this week, and then Thursday the week after. Just because I'd be a little nervous about high suppression/side effects from doing the injections closer together than normal.

I'm feeling really down. Suppression is not great on 5mg so am using a lot of willpower!!
I've lost 3 stone 2lbs, I'm now 15 stone 4lbs, lightest I have been in years, and I've just been shopping, I picked up a pair of size 18 trousers in the sale, didn't try them on, got home and tried them on, they are too small 😫 make it make sense!! I still can't get into a size 18 😞

Some sizing in many stores are completely off

I have seen way too big size 18s and some that would barely fit a size 14

You have done amazing

Keep going

You got this

My current trousers are a size 20, and I have not been brave enough to try on some size 18 trousers. My waist is still larger than I'd like, I seem to be losing weight everywhere else first - just got to hope that my midriff will catch up at some point. I currently weigh 15st 5lbs, so pretty similar to you.

I think women's clothes sizes are so variable, between shops and even between individual items that are supposedly the same size. I am pretty unkeen to do any clothes shopping until I am absolutely forced to when my current clothes get just too baggy to get away with. Clothes shopping can be genuinely traumatising.

Thanks ladies, I'm just feeling so down about it all at the moment.
The trousers were only £8 in the sale but it still stings a bit!

I'm really surprised that I'm 2.5st down and fit in the same clothes. In fact, my size 22 jeans still don't fit properly. I'm so embarrassed as I must have been really squeezing into those clothes to not be able to size down yet.

@RobinEllacotStrike
I was just about to recommend Gillian Riley for @Darlinghag

It's exactly that - every time you get the urge for chocolate, acknowledge and accept that it's there and making you feel a bit uncomfortable, but also know that it will pass quite quickly.

And realise that you can choose to have chocolate any time, but that giving in to the urge reinforces it and undermines your self-esteem, whereas resisting the urge weakens it and strengthens your self-esteem.

Sometimes it's helpful to see the decision and its consequences in terms of your self-esteem - do you want to enhance or diminish how you feel about yourself? And remember, you are not forgoing all chocolate for ever, just this one right now because you will simply not tolerate these urges telling you what to do any more 💪

@alwaysscared I have found that moving down the sizes comes in fits and starts, nothing for ages and then hardly any time at the next size down before moving down again.

And it's true that sizing is so unpredictable. I am in size 16, 14 and even 12 right now, depending on the shop. It drives me mad when ordering online, I got a size 16 Henry Holland jumper on Vinted and honestly it wouldn't have fit me when I was a child. DD size 10 has it now and just about gets away with it. So dispiriting. But you will get into those trousers!

I keep a big bag of stuff that is too small for me in the loft and at the end of every month I get it down and try everything on. And check what's currently in my wardrobe as well. Anything too big goes on Vinted and any holes in my wardrobe get filled from there too. It's quite fun, I tend to get something new every month and it's usually paid for by the stuff I've sold.

Don't forget to notice and celebrate your progress - you are doing amazingly well and deserve extra congratulations as it's been so difficult. All this hard work will stand you in good stead when it comes to maintaining, you are really laying the foundations of a healthy future.

On clothing - I am 24 kilos down (thats not far off 4 stone).

I have set aside a few pairs of trousers that are now too big including a pair of size 20 jeans.
I don't have one proper bra that fits. I'm avoiding getting fitted for new bras right now, but the more stretch sports bras are OK and I got some of those in a smaller size. I will need to get fitted for a properly fitting bra before I go away at the end of March and I'm hoping I can hold out until then.
There are some summer dresses I wore last summer pre MJ that probably won't fit me now.
My lovely belt has gone in 5 notches and I am looking at sending it back to the makers to add some extra holes soon.

However:
Dresses (winter ones) all still fit - at the moment I can wear both a sz22 & sz 18 dress from the same brand.
Stretchy clothes all still fit. I can feel they are looser and less snug but all are still wearable.

I got into my old sz 18 jeans when I could no longer wear the sz20's. They are starting to feel a little bit looser each week but still look good.
I just purchased a paid of sz16 trousers in a sale and they were delivered this morning and they fit me well. First time I've worn a sz 16 in many many years. I can't even remember. However I believe the brand tends to "size big" - Damson Madder.
I've got some old lovely pieces out of storage that I've never decluttered and some of them now fit me (I'm talking pre DC clothing & my eldest is 17). Others are close to fitting. Others a way off still.

In summary - I am currently wearing/fitting clothing from size 16 to 22, from L to XXXL Numbers on clothing are just a fantasty of someone elses imagination. They are not teathered in reality & there is no uniformity in sizes/measurements across the clothing industry. We must ferociously guard ourselves from feeling bad due to made up numbers & measurements.

@alwaysscared you will fit those bargain trousers soon enough! Please don't let this make you feel bad.

@RobinEllacotStrike @Darlinghag Thank you for sharing your "food thoughts", you have both expressed so much of how I feel, far better than I could have said it. I realise I carry the disordered thinking of my mother and her generation and, although I have always attempted to hide it and appear balanced to my DCs, I worry I have passed it on to them inadvertently as all are unhappy with their weight (although none are desperately large)

@alwaysscared I have lost over 3 1/2st now and have only just seen a difference in size. When I was about 2 1/2st down I went to replace some work trousers that were size 22, had been very tight but were now falling down. I was devastated to find I still needed a 20! 35lbs down and only one bloody size difference!
I think I am actually losing weight according to the kitchen roll theory as the last stone has been more noticeable

Thanks for everyone's encouraging words. I think it's particularly hard because it's jab day tomorrow, so I'm VERY hungry today! And with everything going on with my son (he has ASD and is in a mental health crisis right now), I'm just very tired and emotional.
I'm glad there is a place I can come and vent where everyone is kind and thoughtful.

I started at 15st 8lb and was wearing size 20/22. I'm 5ft 8 always had slimmer legs then a big belly and like a barrel from there up, so could never find trousers with a proper waistband because they either did up on the waist but really baggy on ass and legs or fit butt and legs but wouldn't do up.

I've lost 3 stone and fitting in size 16 although admittedly I haven't tried jeans or anything with a proper waistband yet. That's based on gym leggings and dresses.

This is what a loss of 3 stone looks like on me.

thats amazing @InfoSecInTheCity - bloody well done. You can really see the difference in your back, belly, arms - all over!