Harry and Meghan still not replied to Coronation Invitation

[Viviennemary]

Harry and Meghan still haven't replied to the invitation to the coronation even though the RSPV deadline has passed. If it's true I think it's a bit rude. They know the preparation that goes into these events. It must be a headache for the planners not to know if they are coming or not.

Apparently Arche and Lilibet aren't invited to the actual ceremony as they are deemed to be too young. My bet is they will all come to the UK for the coronation but who knows. Not heard if Andrew is coming or not. And Fergie. Will she be there. Maybe behind a pillar.

Also why would every POC support her because she’s mixed race, no matter what her behaviour is like or what she says? What an extraordinary claim.

Who are you directing your comments to?

Exactly. That applies to all of us, including this woman how loves to use her "duchess" title given by the very institution she despises. But hey anything if it will print dollars in America 😅

There there now. We’ve noticed you. But you should know that not attention is good attention.

Funnily enough none of the POC I know support Meghan. But then I am white, so obviously the POC I am friends with are tainted.

Tbh most couldn't care less, she just isn't of any relevance to them. Yes, she's experienced racism, but she has also had numerous privileges so 😴

It’s so gross for white people to discuss people of colour in this way. Nobody here thinks POC are tainted for being friends with you. Disgusting suggestion.

So if you get privileges then you should accept the racism erm no 🫤

I haven't said that.

DD is black, and sadly has experienced racism, both here and when we lived in South Africa.

However, if she gets a sanction at school for being late, she doesn't put it down to racism. She puts it down to being late.

Just as those who don't agree with the behaviour of Meghan AND/OR Harry (who isn't a POC) can criticise them because of their behaviour, not because of her race.

Btw I am not a DM reader either!

Sadly DD has been called a 'coconut' by other black girls at school for having a white mother. So I think 'tainted' does apply.

Exactly. Judge the behaviour every time. Harry has behaved absolutely appallingly and I've no idea why some folk just absolutely refuse to admit it and keep gaslighting everyone. It isn't race related it is behaviour related.

He isn't perfect, none of them are. But gaslighting? Really? Is that what a different opinion is called now?

If you mean the book, Press and authors have got rich writing about him for decades, I don't have a problem with him writing about himself. Yeah the book was ridiculous in places, boring in others but anyone who has read it will say he shows great affection for his Dad and it honestly was not that bad!

Gaslighting, no. Just an opinion that might differ to yours.

Gaslighting, no. Just an opinion that might differ to yours.

Racism No. Just an opinion that differs to yours.

@Roussette I think the issue isn't people having a different opinion, it is people dismissing those with a different opinion as racist, or as DM readers, or (insert defence of Harry and Meghan that attacks the person holding that opinion).

Sometimes that's overt, at other times it is implied, such as saying that they are a POC and every POC they know supports Meghan. The implication is that anyone holding a different opinion is racist, or, if a POC, a 'coconut'.

I have never ever said that every poster who dislikes Meghan is racist. I've probably said that god knows how many times on these threads.
BUT there are some posts (note...SOME not ALL) rooted in racism

I do accuse some posters of reading the DM usually when posts are lifted directly from that rag almost word for word!

Yes. I get so tired of the 'white people think like this white people say this' narrative then get accused of racism. The irony.

“How do you know that though. How do you actually know that people only see her through the prism of her colour? Surely that’s an assumption on your part coloured by your own bias.”

I will change your sentence to show you how you might be missing something - imagine a man saying “How do you know that though. How do you actually know that people only see her through the prism of her gender? Surely that’s an assumption on your part coloured by your own bias.” - I hope you understand that as women we are attuned to misogyny and sexism that is not always obvious to men who have been beneficiaries of systems that have been advantageous to them, likewise I hope you understand that people colour are attuned to racism and bias that are not always obvious to to white people in a society that is built to be a net benefit to them. POC (most of them anyway) do not see all criticism of this woman as racist but we absolutely can see the racism when others do not.

As women we are all aware of women who can buy into patriarchal thinking and misogyny just as there are POC who hold similar views - people are not monoliths therefore holding a woman or a POC as a shield for problematic views really doesn’t support an argument.

people are not monoliths therefore holding a woman or a POC as a shield for problematic views really doesn’t support an argument.

Which is why I referred to POC I know who do not support Meghan's behaviour as 'tainted' - not because I think they are tainted, but because I knew that by referring to their views on this thread they would be dismissed as being a 'shield'.

Oprah Winfrey is worth billions - that hasn’t stopped her from being racially profiled in high end shops. Privilege does not shield you from discrimination- it can insulate you for sure but it still happens. It is still hurtful when it happens regardless of wealth or social status.

Yes and ditto Serena Williams. A hugely successful talented sportswoman and she has been subjected to horrendous racist slurs

Agreed.

That doesn't mean all POC must approve of everything they say or do, or see them as role models/icons.

When the whole 'people in South Africa were dancing in the streets' thing came out I asked various (black) friends from SA (some South African, others from Zimbabwe, Botswana and DRC) about it.

They were all a bit bemused. Meghan doesn't really register.

Tennis is a niche (mostly white) sport in that context, so the Williams sisters, though hugely successful and talented, aren't much known. Oprah Winfrey is known, though not hugely compared to South African stars, the school for girls she set up has raised some awareness for her, but on the whole foreign superstars aren't seen as very relevant - from my experience of living there for over a decade and from what my friends tell me now.

And I with family from that area have a different experience to yours.

Tennis is a niche (mostly white) sport in that context, so the Williams sisters, though hugely successful and talented, aren't much known. Oprah Winfrey is known, though not hugely compared to South African stars, the school for girls she set up ……

I’m sorry but Serena Williams is world known - she was the number 1 athlete in the world for several years. It is serious minimising to say this about her (and her sister).

The point about Serena and Oprah is not that they are well known (this is not about South Africa) - in fact the point is the racism they experienced because they were black as one poster seemed to imply that privileged POC are insulated from discrimination. Oprah’s billions did not prevent her from discrimination in a place where she wasn’t well known - Serena experienced increased morbidity in maternal healthcare afforded to black people in the US (where she was well known) because she was black - her wealth is what got her the right outcomes many people do not get.

DD had various ed psych tests done aged 6, having come to live with me aged 5. One was a 'spot what's wrong/odd' from pictures.

One of the pictures was of two people playing tennis, but there wasn't a ball. DD didn't spot what was wrong.

I queried how culturally appropriate the tests were, as I didn't think DD would have been exposed to tennis in her birth family. As part of that I asked friends and colleagues from similar communities to DD's birth community (black, urban township, mixed formal and informal housing) about their tennis watching habits. I didn't come across anyone who watched tennis, or were aware of the Williams sisters.

It's anecdotal, of course.

Yes, they are incredibly talented and successful.

But - tennis is a sport of the global north and privileged societies.

Serena's wealth got her the right outcomes

Exactly. It's the combination (in some countries) of race and socio-economic status that is toxic. Which is why some (many?) black people, from a global perspective, don't see Meghan as a role model/someone who has overcome the odds.

Colourism matters, money matters.