Ngozi Fulani receives personal apology at Palace

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Lovely picture of them both too. Seems so rare to see a positive news story these days so this was good to see! Peace, reconciliation and understanding. 😊

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64005705

No one said that she did not have African heritage, did they? You are not clever, in fact you are just showing your ignorance even more. I would be happy to have a reasoned discussion about the fact why it is problematic to ask a black, or a brown person about the "where are you really from" question with anybody who I felt would understand, or at least may have the capacity to do so. Somehow I highly doubt that would be the case with you.

I didn't walk into anything

l know its possible to both have african heritage and be British, those two things are not mutually exclusive. If you think we are all defending NF because we think she didn't have african heritage then you are not paying attention.

I have Pakistani heritage. But I am welsh. If someone said to me:

Where are you from
Where are you really from
Where are your people from
Now we are getting somewhere you are actually Pakistani

I would have been similarly offended. My heritage and my nationality are not the same and the indication that someone cannot be British if they are black is offensive.

You think you have some kind of gotcha but you really really don't.

That poster is not worth any further communication with, as far as I am concerned.

It’s good that the charity is being investigated regardless of the issue with the RF. There are very clearly some serious issues with it which should see daylight. A robust system of charity regulation is necessary to keep confidence in charities. There are too many charities still still set up for the enrichment and status of their founders rather than any genuine charitable purpose.

You have a right to be offended. I’m not taking that away from you. Whether your offence gives you sufficient grounds to ruin someone without giving that person a fair hearing is another argument. And the thing - really the only thing - that concerns me most.

what you have to admit however is that it’s not an easy landscape for people to navigate - especially old people - so we could perhaps give people the benefit of the doubt.

Ohtheweatheroutsideistoocold it works both ways. Your extreme left views offend me. So, technically, you could get stitched up by someone like me.

If you read his very detailed investigation, that isn’t at all why he is raising issues at the charity. There is substantial evidence of fraud and misuse of public money just from documents publicly available. Also it doesn’t seem the charity does anything particularly charitable. Your post shows incredible bias.

Let’s have a proper investigation but fraud and misuse of public funds, especially by using a charity structure for domestic violence against black women is nothing short of disgusting.

Please do explain how my views are extreme left wing...

I am left wing yes, but if not wanting people to be racist is extreme left wing then i think you are being a bit harsh on moderatly left wing, centrist, and moderately right wing people!

It's interesting how people always bring up age as an excuse. NF is nearly 60 but apparently age is only an excuse for behaviour if you are white

The Twitter thread may contain valid accusations, but it is also full of misogynistic, racist and victim blaming ramblings. Yes, I am biased against such a person (but never criticised the idea of an objective investigation), why on earth aren’t you?

DH has an Irish name - all three names are Irish. His parents and two of his siblings were born in Ireland. He and one other sibling were born in the U.K.

He often gets asked where he's from and he'll say Bristol, where he was born. If pushed to explain the Irish name, he'll just say his parents moved to Bristol before he was born and he was born in Britain. To people who reply along the lines of "you're Irish then" ( people do), he'll say, no, British, and add that he has fought in the British army.
DDs, who have his Irish surname get the same kind of question, and even I have on occasion, despite my obviously Welsh accent.

Is that racist? Or does it not count because he and DDs are white?

Of course.

A robust system of charity regulation is necessary to keep confidence in charities.

There’s a risk with the word ‘charity’ because it’s associated with virtue. And therefore at risk of exploitation in the name of ‘charity’. So it does need clear and just oversight.

This

Anti Irish discrimination is absolutely a thing

People don't tend to refer to it a racism if it's a white British person to a white Irish person for example but that doesn't mean it's not discrimination to imply someone cannot be British because they have Irish heritage

Why does it have to be out in public before the investigation is finalised though? For salacious details? For attack purposes?

These are my complaints about why she shouldnt have gone to twitter in the first place rather than raising her concerns about Mrs Hussey to the palace or the woman hersel. And I say the same thing about any investigation in the charity because by all means pick up on irregularities and look at them but publish it when finished, not while its ongoing. Charities and accounts for all sorts of business and people get looked into all the time, its not all over the news though

what you have to admit however is that it’s not an easy landscape for people to navigate - especially old people - so we could perhaps give people the benefit of the doubt

It us pretty easy to not be racist tbh. All it takes is a bit of honest self-examination and thought.

Maybe we should also overlook older men, who display misogyny, and sexism. Because, you know they are older, and they are past learning. Sounds ridiculous doesn't it?

Apparently black women are not allowed to really be victims unless they are perfect

White women are automatically the victim even when they admit they are at fault

Luckily not everyone thinks like this but a proportion of people do

👏 👏 👏

OP, I am with you.

SH and NF both seem (I don't know them personally) to be competent adults.

SH has chosen to apologise, NF has chosen to accept the apology.

From what I remember NF said from the start she didn't want a witch hunt, but wanted people to educate themselves on the impact of this sort of behaviour. Being asked the same question over and over again, rather than accept the answer is rude, and in the context implies that the original answer wasn't believable because NF is black.

On the other hand, I am interested in people's heritage and culture, and if they are happy to talk about it I an interested in hearing about it. It is possible that this is what SH was asking, but in the wrong way and not accepting that NF had no obligation to talk about it.

Intention does not equal impact, but I think intention is relevant in admitting a mistake, apologising, and doing better in future.

In being interested in other peoples experiences and heritage I do not want to imply that - if they are not white British for generations - they do not belong here. DD is black African (from South Africa) and we talk about her birth heritage as well as her heritage by adoption. I would be furious if someone said she cannot be British because she is also black and African by birth. But it can be a fine line between showing interest in someone else's heritage and implying that they do not belong. I can imagine a situation where I get it wrong, and would want to apologise - without any pressure on the person I had hurt to accept the apology. The alternative is to block any conversation about different experiences and heritages, which I think would continue to privilege the white British heritage.

DD also sometimes wears clothes that reflect the traditional clothing of her birth heritage for special occasions - why shouldn't she? And for day to day wear she generally wears jeans/trackie bottoms and a T shirt. Why shouldn't she? They don't invalidate each other. I wear jeans/trackie bottoms and a T shirt most of the time, and occasionally put on a nice dress and wear heels. That doesn't mean I am being inauthentic when I wear the dress, or when I wear the jeans - just that I dress differently for different occasions.

So, you can read whatever you want into this story.

Personally I think there is a case to be made that SH did not realise the impact of her words and actions at the time, and once she found out she wanted to apologise. And that NF was able to recognise that SH's words and actions came from a place of ignorance, and therefore was willing to accept the apology.

'But what were the mechanisms for a fair trial?

BP could not oversee a fair trial because she’s the next in line’s godmother. Conflict of interest.'

Not sure I understand this - Susan Hussey resigned immediately and gave a full apology, which has been very graciously accepted by Ngozi Fulani. What sort of 'trial' did you want?What did you want Susan Hussey to do? Fall on an actual sword?

I am white, and have been questioned about where I am "really" from, on the phone. Presumably because my surname does not look British. It was incredibly unpleasant and othering. I would not like to experience it again. It was not racist when it happened to me because I am white, but it was anti-place-my-surname-is-from, which is also a real and unacceptable thing.

Imagine getting the honour of being invited to the palace because of charity work and then being treated badly. It would ruin what was intended by everyone concerned to be a lovely experience for participants. If then, you're invited back to the palace so that the person concerned can apologise, it makes perfect sense to go. If you were an anti-monarchist, you probably wouldn't have accepted the original invitation.

Individual racism is not wildly different to other ways in which we can treat people badly, either deliberately or accidentally. The only thing to do is apologise if possible and genuinely strive to do better in future. If that means learning more, then learn more. If it means changing views, then change views. This is what is being presented as happening in this case, I'm happy to assume that it's genuine - it's unlikely to be proven otherwise.

The Charity Commission will get many reports from people complaining about charities for both spurious and excellent reasons. I'm sure they aim to investigate them all appropriately.

You need someone to explain to you how someone with African heritage isn't being culturally appropriative by wearing 'African clothing' ? Really?

(oh please do explain what african clothing is, does the entire continent wear the same clothes!)

If someone wants to wear clothing from their heritage that surely can’t be racist. If they want to change their name to reflect their heritage that surely can’t be racist either. I’m Jewish. Our family names were changed when my DGS came to the Uk. I’m not sure what one of them originally was as there are no documents. I do now my late DGFs original name and I’ve been thinking of using it again as no one should have their names changed on arrival to a country they’re seeking asylum in. If I decided sometimes to wear a hair covering or dress not show my shoulders or upper arms would that be racist?

I don’t think you can be racist for connecting with your heritage in any way you choose.

What would you have preferred? A firing squad? Riots in the street?

It was a complaint made public so the resignation and apology was public too. A very gracious and reconciliatory one too. A good model for handling disagreement in a civilised, grown up and ‘British’ way over a cup of tea and a chat.

It is still possible to get it wrong. Let's face it, racism is so embedded in everyday life, no matter how self-reflective you are, there can be times when you just make a mistake. And then should apologise and learn from it, and do better in future.

Actually, when I think about how pervasive racism is, I would say it is difficult not to be racist.

DD's birth family (black South Africans) made a big deal out of her having lighter skin than her sister - it was seen as something to congratulate her on. And pretty nasty for her sister to experience. But then, they had been immersed in the racist narrative of pale skin being superior in every way. And taking it further, while DD had paler skin than her sister, she still had dark skin (and tight, curly hair) compared to people who weren't/aren't black.

Are DD's birth family to be condemned as racist as well?