🐌 Fantastic Skincare: We're So Drunk We're Seeing Elephants 🐘

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For those who are taking a peek and wondering what this all about, we mostly discuss a bit of advanced skincare here with a perspective of seeking out the right ingredients (rather than the latest new shiny product and all its empty promises) for our particular skin needs. Distinguishing the acid toners from the actives whilst avoiding the truly unimpressive and harmful ingredients with a hope to achieve a bit of anti-ageing, alleviate irritation and sensitivities with some idle chat in between. Newcomers are always welcome but please note the following:

Questions and asking for help on this thread is encouraged, however, we can’t give you a specific routine to follow and hope it works out for the best. There are no overnight miracles in skincare whether it be in the form of products or techniques. It’s about perseverance, understanding your skin, assessing its needs and responding to that in a diligent manner.

These threads were created to help those who want to learn for themselves. We’re a group of interested and invested skincare nuts happy to offer tea and sympathy and dole out advice. Everyone’s journey with skincare is different, what is universal and binds us is that through actually learning about the different active ingredients it helps us get to know our skin and help us adapt as it will change many times throughout our lives - with seasons, hormonal changes, ageing, genetics etc. It's in everyone's best interests to get to know their skin and to keep reviewing those changes with the confidence that comes from the gathered knowledge here. We really encourage you to spend the time reading through previous threads and linked info sheets that the many contributors have taken the trouble to share.

By no means are we experts, we're only a bunch of amateurs that can only respond by suggesting what we would do in your place, for any severe conditions please seek out professional help.

Ahem, and finally a little note on spending. I'm well aware these threads cause many to reach for their wallets and spend with wild abandon. There can sometimes be a bit of a frenzy surrounding the excitement around a newly discovered product or on the back of great improvements when someone reports back. This is all great, it doesn't however, mean everything that's a sudden miracle for one will be it for you. Usually, it's a light bulb moment for connecting the right skincare ingredient with an individual experiencing a specific problem. Take your time to mull over decisions and question whether it's right for you too. Skincare is highly individual, it's a slow game that should cost mostly in patience, input, education, and perseverance. Please don't make it cost you financially needlessly.

I am very slowly working on consolidating the gathered information from previous threads into easier to read formats but it’s slow going. I would suggest reading thread 1 and at the very least the following info sheets (provided they apply to you):

Where to Start

Basics of an Actives Routine

Skin Types vs. Skin Conditions Info Sheet

Anti-Ageing Info sheet

Adult Acne Info Sheet

Understanding Which Sunscreen(s) to Buy

Do I Really Need to Wear Sunscreen Every Single Day of the Year?

A Damaged Skin Barrier - Now What?

NEW SERIES:

So You Want To Buy A Retinoid - A Guide

WRT to The Ordinary/Deciem:

Most of us had long since stopped using it, partially due to the inconsistency of formulations and the worrying behaviour of the CEO on Social Media.

For more info on the latter, overview here

A good overview of alternatives is here

Since that compilation, other brands like the Inkey, Revolution Skincare, QRXLabs, and Alex Steinherr x Primark have launched with similar products/concepts.

From the limited experience on here, the Vitamin C 23% and Azelaic Acid from Garden of Wisdom (at Victoria’s Health) is well liked and much preferred over TO versions.

OCTOBER 2018: In other news, we’re two years old this month! We’re so old- Drunk Elephant is finally available in the UK, but all this celebration is probably overshadowed by the fear that our beloved LRP Toleriane Fluide may have been discontinued

I don’t trust myself with candles, with my terrible memory I’d probably burn the house down I like melts (have an electric melter) but am a bit wary about that too now in case I forget to unplug it, so I’m stuck with those reedy things but don’t find they give off much scent unless you’re right next to them.

Thank you for that video JDSTER my current method is fairly similar but I’m going to be a bit more vigorous with massaging after watching that.

I'm pleased to share with everybody that Bo was right: CultBeauty refunded me £8.5 for my (pre-price decrease) DE purchase, as opposed to my (pessimist) calculation of 40p. :D

Vindicated! now what will you buying me for that £8.40

Not an advent calendar, please. Never bought into them, they never seem good value for money to me, as I'd use less than 10% and the few things I would genuinely be interested in would make more sense to buy full size separately. Don't like assortments of any kind tbh, only liked one type of licorice all sorts, like very few fragrances, etc. I did occasionally get those mega goodie bags from SpaceNk or Cult Beauty when you spent over X amount. They always include a gift certificate and often actually had things I wanted to try but I rarely spend that much in one shop anymore. I think I'd even struggle to curate one, though would be interesting to attempt one with the beloved products on here. Cicaplast will obviously be the last day...

Pupsie, nourishing as in moisturising or hydrating?

Also I had my hair cut and I'm trying not to go into full meltdown about it. There was so much styling product in it I don't even know how bad it is beyond waking up to a giant sticky clumpy rat's nest on the back of my head. Enid, time to open up the gallery full time I think

Oh good news Babypigeon spend it wisely

Bo I’m debating whether or not to go a proper hair dressers and have a good chunk cut off my very long hair, and maybe even have some sort of a style. But with the luck (or lack of it) we have on this thread with hair my gut instinct is saying don’t do it! Hopefully yours won’t be too bad once you’ve washed and styled it yourself.

Another thing that puts me off hairdressers is the amount of gunk they use. In the past they have sometimes sent me home with my hair looking pretty good, but it would take a gazillion different styling products and about 2 hours every morning to try and re-create the look, otherwise I’m left with the dreaded triangle of frizz

Sallie - I refuse products because I'm curly girl and don't use shampoo or silicones. Luckily I've found a hairdresser who cuts my hair dry, curl by curl and charges me £10!!

Trying feather and down bath stuff today - really lovely

Sallie, I'm seriously considering spending some quality time on YouTube to learn how to cut my own hair, even if I mess up the texture of my hair will probably mask minor mistakes and I'm unlikely to lop off too much. I know what does and doesn't benefit my hair (which hairdressers all nod along to when I explain in detail but then ignore ) and I already remedy my front layers myself anyhow.

It's not the stuff of nightmares this time but it's definitely another case of not getting what I asked for. I'm not interested in lots of volume, I think it looks very old fashioned and therefore unnecessarily ageing but it also accentuates the male pattern baldness I have. I'm quite sensitive about it and it feels very dismissive when I explain at length what I don't want as it emphasises that hair loss and it's done anyhow in the pursuit of big hair.

Could also have done without the constant subtle sales pitch of all the products when I made it quite clear that I'd tried the brand before and it really didn't agree with my hair. So no surprise really that the styling products were far too heavy and suffocating to my hair.

There was a thread on here about a hairdresser that cost the earth in London but took all the time in the world to get exactly what you wanted. Sounded too good to be true but if I was in the UK I'd probably consider it at this point, possibly worth exploring for you?

Thanks Bo I’m not near London and although I occasionally go for work I don’t think I’d have time to get my hair done - plus I’m a great big London wimp and scared of the tubes

The lack of listening from hairdressers and their obsession with Big Hair does drive me insane too which is why I gave up on them. They seem to nod and agree when you tell them what you want and then merrily go ahead and do what they want - why can’t they at least tell you that your expectations are unrealistic and suggest some alternatives that you might be happy with

I’ve been cutting my own hair recently but only taking the ends off, I’m not confident enough to do a significant chop and my hair is starting to look like it needs a good cut rather than just a trim. I think I’ll just go back to my Mum’s hairdresser - they cater to an older age range so no fuss, frills or products and do a dry cut, but I’ll ask them to take a good few inches off the length.

Ollie my hair is neither straight nor curly, it’s thick and coarse with lots of frizz. I tried the curly girl method and hair plopping (!) and it did help with frizz but I ended up with uneven, straggly, tatty type waves. That’s great you’ve found such a good hairdresser though and so cheap too, even the older ladies place I go to is about £15.

My hairdresser is excellent. But I still always tell her to give the product a miss because I've got sensitive skin and have to be very careful (bit of a porkie) or better still I take my own product for her to use .

Bo my skin doesn't feel dry. I guess I'm just hankering after sth new . I don't usually use masks. I did have the black and pink ones mud ones (can't remember the name at the mo). I've tried the Una Brennan Rose one but it irritated a little. Not helping much am I? Just wondered what others use...

Vichy clay (grey one) and Elemis papaya enzyme mask. Skyn gel things under eyes.

I think if you're ok with hyaluronic (?) acid, a sheet mask containing that and loads of glycerin (??) would be good for plumping and hydration.

Enid sorry about your migraines, they are a bugger. I used to get them all the time but not so much any more. I think with me it was dehydration.

Pupsie I have been loving Superdrugs Simply Pure serum and Superdrugs B.hydrated HA facial spritz and their Vit C spritz. In fact I love them so much I have already reordered as they have a BOGOF offer.
I find them all very hydrating as my skin was getting very dehydrated in all this central heating and change of seasons.

The spritz's are both great over make up and seem to keep my Nars TM lasting longer than usual so that's a bonus.

BabyPigeon I'm so glad Bo was right and that Cult Beauty did right by you with their integrity.

Sallie I often trim my own hair in fact it's probably due a trim now. I find if I do small amounts more often there is less change of glaring errors.

And as for advent calendars my DM has bought me the M&S one which I wont get till Christmas Day but my DD has filled up an old M&S one from a couple of years ago with products I havent yet used which are in a box and other bits and bobs like chocolate etc

Tant I think it was you that posted the hair cutting tutorial that I’ve been using. I have been doing little and often but my hair grows like a weed on speed so I think the time has come for a Big Chop as it’s starting to get tangly and matted, I look like Hagrid I’ve booked into the old dears salon for next Saturday

Fingers crossed I’m not here this time next week crying, but they normally do exactly what I want which this time will be to take about 5-6 inches off the length and absolutely nothing else

Sallie yes I'm guilty

Too late Bo :P I already used the money to get a Kat von D cracker since Debenhams has 15% currently :D I also found this nice set of 2 mini liquid lipsticks in the shades lolita and lolita 2. I like the look of Kat von D makeup a lot but I don't have many things from them, it's annoying how Debenhams has exclusivity (like Harvey Nichols has for Fenty).
Sallie I assume I failed to spend it wisely on even more lip products. :D It's a curse.
Tantric I was honestly surprised.
Since everybody is talking about hair, I'm afraid I'm one of the "volume" people. I have fine limp hair and volume is what I cling to to make it look like it has body (too appear like MORE hair). But it does not mean that everybody wants that or that it suits all hair types. I thought that hairdressers are suppose to tailor things depending on the hair type and what the client wants (when possible, when not they should communicate that). I guess there are too many bad hairdressers that can only do a few things. And they have the nerve to charge an arm and a leg. :(
I started to use the peptides serum for hair from the ordinary, did anybody else use it? I don't have high hopes but I was curious so I'm giving it a try.

Babypigeon lip products seem a sensible choice to me The only thing I’ve had from Kat Von D is a foundation years ago (think I ordered directly from the US) it had a really strong smell and oxidised quite badly on me so that put me off trying an thing else.

I did see that hair serum from TO but haven’t tried it, I’m not sure where I stand on purchasing anything from Deciem since the BT debacle.

I used my medik8 3tr again on Friday night and woke up to a couple of tiny whiteheads that could literally be scratched off, also a few red spots on neck. Is it time to accept my skin just doesn't like or get on with retinol?? I don't get this reaction at all from the c tetra.
Also does anyone here use HA in the pm only? Wondering whether to start using my mineral 89 in the pm as using it during the day can sometimes make my skin feel even more parched!

I was wondering the same thing Sallie when receiving that Deciem email about their award winning offer thing, although it was mostly clouded with annoyance as I unsubscribed from Deciem when BT first descended into troublesome behaviour.

But a lot of the reasons I stopped buying Deciem were made before all the drama, it wasn't consistently working well enough for me, formulations went off. I've always considered the NIOD line overinflated self importance that didn't warrant the price tag. Hylamide was again overpriced in comparison to Japanese formulations. The peptide hair serum would potentially of interest to me as someone with genuine hair loss issues but I also know it's all bollocks unless it's prescribed so I really shouldn't waste my money on empty promises.

On the other hand just from a customer's perspective I was disappointed in the environment cultivated by BT that allowed things to come to a head as it did. The entirity of it feels toxic, specifically the workplace conditions that were well in place and enforced before any signs of BT's issues. EL and the current interim CEO didn't consider it before so I'm not entirely convinced that's been tackled/will ever be tackled.

I don't keep up much with the beauty industry dramas but isn't Kat Von D set to be the next BT? Think there was a lot of hubbub around being conspiracy theories on her SM, coming out as an anti vaxxer with the whole autism nonsense?

Bo I agree with you regarding the toxic environment at Deciem which is why I’m reluctant to purchase from them again. Also agree about TO being ineffective and NIOD overpriced but I did like some hylamide and hand chemistry products. I’ve found replacements that I’m happy with though so on balance there’s no reason for me to go back to Deciem.

I did not know that about Kat Von D, but I’ve paid so little attention to the brand since my dislike of the foundation that I’d pretty much forgotten about her being a RL person & was sort of thinking more along the lines of it being a brand name like Estée Lauder

I think there's definitely a dark side to all these personality led brands and the tide seems to be turning on a lot of them. There was a good article on high ego CEOs and how sensible it was to elevate these in the media as 'geniuses'. BT and Elon Musk featured heavily in it. I'll have to see if I can find it again.

I'm not a fan of companies taking political stances, even when I agree with them or not. It just adds fuel to the fire and hardens division when the primary motivation on company's behalf is their bottom line and aligning themselves with the right focus group.

Found it:

www.thecut.com/amp/2018/10/brandon-truaxe-of-deciem-and-the-rise-of-the-ceo-meltdown.html

I think social media takes companies too close to the consumers. Like I said before, companies like to behave like they are our friends but they are not. I understand supporting someones brand/business because you like them and what they stand for, or, the opposite, boycotting a company for "bad" behavior. But I think nowadays ppl get offended and very aggressive and tend to overreact to the smallest things. Every day there is some new drama in the "beauty community".
I know Kat von D had a huge controversy about vaccinations. I know about her since she was in Miami Ink/LA Ink and I think she is very talented. She does the art for her make-up line and I think it looks very nice, I couldn't try her products because for a long time they were not available in Europe. What I tried so far I do like. I only have a matte nude (shade and light I think it's called) eye shadow palette, the tattoo eyeliner and some mini lip products. I wish she was not an anti-vaxxer, but I guess she is entitled to her opinion like anybody else, brand owner or not.
As for Deciem, I have no idea what is going on there, I wasn't into their products when they were over hyped, but I saw the peptide scalp serum and I thought it won't do me any harm to try it. I hope the owner gets the help he needs.
That said, I must admit I do like Paula's Choice partly because I like Paula Begoun herself and also Bryan Barron (he does live chats on youtube and responds to skincare related questions). They are both very nice people (no social media drama) and that does influence my opinion about the brand. But if they weren't, my BHA would still work the same I guess.

I just used a facial scrub >>ducks

Maybe Kat Von D is a bit more informed on the Anti Vaxx matter now and less inclined to voice her ill informed comments online.

However her lipsticks really do last ages it's just a shame as with all these long lasting lipsticks there are none in my shade whatsoever so I have resorted to good old fashioned Lipcote.

Bo That was an interesting read. One minor thing I wasn't aware of: Brandon is a software developer. That tells a lot (partly explains his oddness).
Tantric I agree informing someone is important, but I'm amazed how aggressive people are. There is no need for a backlash and abusive language to deliver facts to someone. Some people really do not show their best behaviour on social media. Sometimes what they say is in stark contrast with their beautiful selfies. It's jarring.
You made me curious about your lipstick shade. I assume you know about temptalia.com , where you can compare swatches for thousands of lipsticks and other makeup. Is that lipcote not very aggressive on the lips delicate skin (it has a lot of alcohol)?

No I havent heard of temptalia.com but will definitely have a look. Some people do find lipcote stings them but it's fine on me after I have applied my first layer, blotted then apply second layer and make sure the lipcote doesnt go over the lipstick line onto my skin.

My shade has always been something like Rimmel 700 Naughty Nude. I'm not fussy about brands just the shade. My favourite is a Lancome shade but it doesn't say what on the bottom just L'absolu rouge.