DSS when DD is having her nappy changed

[Namechangeof2021]

I've put this here rather than on any of the main boards as I don't want an onslaught of people saying I'm horrible or that I'm implying he has nefarious intentions. I'm really not so I hope it doesn't come across that way. It isn't an attack on him, just me looking out for my DD (and maybe some unintentional projection on my part as a CSA survivor) again, I'm not saying he's planning to do anything.

I have a 3 year old DD who isn't yet toilet trained. I have noticed that DSS who is about to start secondary school always makes a point of coming over and looking when I'm changing her. He isn't discrete about it so I don't think he's trying to hide the fact.

I've raised it with dad before who thinks it's innocent childhood curiosity which is normal among siblings, and it may well be, but it makes me uncomfortable.

The bathroom is too small and awkward to change her in so It's always the living room (when the older kids aren't in there - but they happen to come in to) or the bedroom, again which they come in to. Dad seems to forget I've raised these things and will happily change her in the same room that they are already in. He'll just walk right up and stand over her.

Would I be unreasonable to have a talk with him myself and ask that he respects DD's privacy when she needs to be changed?

I'm afraid the non-potty trained 3 year old is the issue here. Not the child obviously, the parents. Why is she not potty trained - that would solve the problem surely??

The issue was the girl’s short skirt. Her mum should never have let her go out dressed like that. Her own fault really.

PS my eldest didn’t potty train till 3.5 and it wasn’t for a lack of trying. She’s now 7 and i still can’t get her to do things that she’s not ready to do.

Op should have to fit locks or crouch behind doors.

He should be told to go away & that's the end of it.

We often nip from the bathroom to our bedrooms naked after a shower.

No one makes a point of turning up for a look!

Oh for goodness sake, this is nothing like victim blaming. It's sensible to treat 3 year olds to use a potty or they'll end up starting school without any basic skills.

It is amazing how few people read my actual post before jumping on their high horse and saying i'm blaming the child!!!

Lol she will not. Don’t be so ridiculous. As I said, my daughter is now 7. Do you think she’s still in a pull up??

The minute my daughter wanted to use the toilet, she did it. I didn’t really have to train her at all. Because she was thag bit older she understood what she had to do and once she wanted to do it she just got on with it.

Fgs @JulesJoules how ridiculous. Loads of three year olds are in nappies. The poster doesn’t even bath her dd if the ss is in the house. He’s extremely inappropriate and many of us have already said that he needs help.

I was thinking it sounded like curiosity and immaturity until you said the sexy comment, which sounds far more worrying to me. I think for you to follow your intuition with your dd is right, but more than that, I think that his dad needs to be exploring whether there are red flags which indicate that the 11 year old has been exposed to abuse, whether at school or elsewhere, or hearing things other children are saying, or reading something on the net, or whether his immaturity is a worry, I would be very, very worried if my ds11 said a baby looked sexy. There is a lot out there on the net and in society about this sort of thing so it could have come from anywhere, but it does need to be explored, I feel.

For context, I have talked a lot over the years with dc about what is for children and what isn't, about the pants rule, so dc are fairly clued up about those sorts of boundaries and understand about private parts and privacy, but they are also immature and curious in some ways - yet still I would be very shocked if that said that about a young dc.

Your ss might need more support in some way, and i do think this needs to be explored for his benefit.

Off topic slightly but is there any reason why the 3 year old isn't toilet trained? The problem would be solved if she wasn't wearing nappies and at 3 I would expect her toilet trained anyway

No you’re not blaming the child but you’re blaming her parents for not “covering her up”.

I hope you don’t have boys.

@Barkingmadhouse the ss is such a persistent pain in the neck that the poster can’t even bath her dd if he’s in the house.
That isn’t normal and won’t be solved by potty training.

Off topic slightly but is there any reason why the 3 year old isn't toilet trained? The problem would be solved if she wasn't wearing nappies and at 3 I would expect her toilet trained anyway

Fuck me & you wonder why there are so many abusive relationships victims on here ... that does not solve the problem of a 10year old boy exhibiting dodgy voyeristic behaviour

@RockinHorseShit

Please read my post before laying into me. I am not blaming the child FFS.

In any potentially overly sexualised behaviour situation, saying to remove the victim to prevent them harm IS victim blaming & in such young DCs is laying down dangerously lax boundaries & that she has to behave herself so as not to arouse a weak man.

NEVER cover up & remove the victim, ALWAYS deal with the perpetrator, no matter how you as you are teaching them not to behave like creeps. Don't be surprised when your boys are up for a sexual assault charge before they have even left home. That is the legacy of not dealing with this shit properly & being so bloody naive & focussing on the wrong shit

Just a side, by blaming the boy you could also be construed as victim blaming if it turns out he has been exposed to some very inappropriate stuff.

Let’s walk before running people!

I don’t understand the “it’s just curiosity” argument, he does this every time she’s having her nappy changed and she’s three years old now, what is there to be curious about at this point? He also has a younger sister himself so it’s not like this is all new to him, presumably he’s seen this many times at home. Also, he is 10/11, not 5, at his age he will have had sex education and will more than likely have been exposed to adult content by other kids or googling it himself, he’s not some naive child who doesn’t know what genitals are.

OP said she’s stopped bathing her too when he’s there due to lack of privacy, so what was happening when she was being bathed? Was he coming in and staring too? So he’s also curious about bath time? At 10?

I think people are being too dismissive here, I can understand if this was a new baby and he’s never seen this stuff before, but she’s been around for three years now and he has a little sister himself, so this really shouldn’t be interesting to him.

I think you need to put a stop to this asap, just tell him he doesn’t need to be staring, that he is getting older now as is his sister and she needs privacy. If he carries on then you’ve I think you need to address it with your partner again as I would be extremely concerned about the safety of my child.

As you feel uneasy it needs to be addressed

A simple lock with a bolt high up in your bedroom and bathroom is needed

He needs to be told people need their privacy and not to look at others naked, esp starting secondary school and pe etc

Maybe both you and dh talk to him together

Does he barge in when you are in the bathroom having a wee or bath

With kindness, you need to stop projecting your anxieties on to your child. I have an almost 3 year old, and an 11 year old, and it wouldn't occur to me in the slightest that the older one seeing the younger one having her nappy changed would be an issue. In fact, the younger one loves nothing more than to be naked.

Maybe I'm more relaxed because mine are both girls, but that really shouldn't be an issue. They're both children, and they're siblings. Nothing weird about that.

Just a side, by blaming the boy you could also be construed as victim blaming if it turns out he has been exposed to some very inappropriate stuff.

Let’s walk before running people!

Ridiculous argument, I wasn't planing of gathering up the pitchfork & torches crown to hunt him down & hang draw & quarter him, just teach him better boundaries & find out where this behaviour comes from & yes ofc he needs help too if he has been harmed🙄.

I would be very concerned about the 'she's sexy' comment. That's so inappropriate and at his age he knows what it means.

It does seem a bit weird to just stand and watch. Is he curious and wants to help? From the other side of the coin, I had a half brother born when I was 11. I used to actually change his nappy, with supervision. My Dad and Step Mum let me help with things like bathing him and putting his pyjamas on too. I liked helping with the baby and I think they used to let me get involved so that I didn't feel pushed out. I babysat him sometimes when he was a pre schooler/young child and I was older too, which obviously involved taking him to the toilet and giving him a bath etc.

He's now 24 and has no ill effects from his big sister washing his bum as a little one!

I don't blame you for wanting a chat though OP and if you have concerns then listen to your gut and act on them - the protection of your daughter is absolutely paramount. I am just offering a different view j suppose.

@Elsiebear90

I don’t understand the “it’s just curiosity” argument, he does this every time she’s having her nappy changed and she’s three years old now, what is there to be curious about at this point? He also has a younger sister himself so it’s not like this is all new to him, presumably he’s seen this many times at home. Also, he is 10/11, not 5, at his age he will have had sex education and will more than likely have been exposed to adult content by other kids or googling it himself, he’s not some naive child who doesn’t know what genitals are.

OP said she’s stopped bathing her too when he’s there due to lack of privacy, so what was happening when she was being bathed? Was he coming in and staring too? So he’s also curious about bath time? At 10?

I think people are being too dismissive here, I can understand if this was a new baby and he’s never seen this stuff before, but she’s been around for three years now and he has a little sister himself, so this really shouldn’t be interesting to him.

I think you need to put a stop to this asap, just tell him he doesn’t need to be staring, that he is getting older now as is his sister and she needs privacy. If he carries on then you’ve I think you need to address it with your partner again as I would be extremely concerned about the safety of my child.

Some people are being too dismissive, yes.

But most of us have said the same thing as you just said.

OK, I take the points onboard but I think there's quite a bit of hysteria on this. DSS is still only a small child himself and could very easily be being subjected to outside influences himself, so before we categorise him as a child sex abuser lets think please.

It doesn't take away from the fact that the OP's DD should be being encouraged to come out of nappies at 3 (unless there are other issues not mentioned).

I can't believe that you or your h haven't brought this up with your ss every time he does this! It's massively inappropriate and frankly odd.

Just say to him, 'dd needs privacy. How would you like it if I came into the toilet with you and watched you? Everyone needs privacy when changing, bathing, going to the toilet, etc.' Rinse and repeat.

And your h has to be on board too.

Has it occurred to people that OP may be having problems toilet training her DD because of the SS? She won’t even bath her when her SS is there because of his inappropriate behaviour, why would she want her running around without pants on so he can gawp at her? He’s been told and hasn’t listened and doesn’t respect boundaries.

@RockinHorseShit

I have no idea why that perfectly valid point you made about not victim blaming, removing the victim, rather than dealing with the behaviour has been removed?

There was nothing offensive in what you wrote.

Deeply disappointing that MN is so ready to delete a post about victim blaming.

It is weird to show a persistent interest in staring at genitalia. He didn't just show interest on one day (i.e. noticing girls look different), OP knows he's repeatedly wanting to look.
Why is he repeatedly wanting to see a girls genitals at 10-11?

My DS would have gone yuck nappies, and run off. Just like the other male SS.

I'm sure that his dad does just want to think it's curiosity.

Does he think it's OK for his daughter to be stared at then?

He can tell his son not to do it without it being accusatory.

At the very least if Op goes into the bedroom he shouldn't be following her in!