CMS and my income

[BaconAvocado]

Hi, does anyone know if there are any circumstances in which CMS would take into account my income for the calculation. DH is on a private arrangement with his ex at the moment and keeps being asked if I can help contribute towards things like school uniform and why he's not paying more as the DSC have told them I've got a new job.

@BungleandGeorge

Marital assets are generally 50:50 on divorce and it’s very unusual for any spousal maintenance to be due. CSM is the only ongoing payment due, at what a 1/5 of salary for 2 children. That’s nowhere near enough to fund previous lifestyle is it? And it stops at 18. I can understand why people don’t want to fund an adults lifestyle but surely you should want to fund a room in your house for your kids to stay. It’s not for your ex, it doesn’t affect them. I do t understand the attitude of getting out of paying for as much as possible but that’s irrelevant as OP partner is paying more than the minimum and chipping in for extras such as music. OP just pay the £25 or whatever to get an official figure and shut down the complaints. It won’t take your earnings into account. Then you can show he’s paying more than required

Again if not married things often are not split fairly (experience).

I don't think it should fund the previous lifestyle. I think everyone involved should adapt. If our household split of course our lifestyle wouldn't be the same. I think it's hugely entitled to think that it would be.

I think each parent should want to fund a room in their own house for their child. They shouldn't be responsible for the other person's house.

Would you as an rp want to fund a room for your child in your exs house? Course not. But you think they should fund one in yours? Why?

@AnneLovesGilbert - the fact you believe buying uniform once a year is laughable... 8 weeks before the end of this summer term my eldest needed new shoes, £35 to replace he's now gone up another size and needs another pair for the start of term...
At the start of this calendar year my youngest had misplaced 2 jumpers at school, which in itself is laughable seeing as though due to covid they have been confined to 2 rooms. But despite school staff looking for them they had disappeared. As they are purchased from school at £12 an item that's another £24. Yes I could have just replaced 1. I have also replaced their WHITE polo shirts throughout the year (why they have white is beyond me) and school trousers with holes in the knees. If I was separated from their dad should I have had the burden of the cost all on my own or should I have been able to ask for a contribution from him / his family money? If neither of us budgeted for this type of expense who pays for it?
Just like car repairs happen all year round so can buying uniform.
And if she is to budget for uniform rather than enjoying herself why shouldn't the OPs DH? Why should she burden the whole amount of the cost for uniform?
And speaking from experience my DPs ex has done EXACTLY the same asked for his contribution towards uniforms (he always contributes) but also for a number of other things pleading poverty.... but is currently abroad after having booked a last minute holiday. It is not for us to question her decisions or how she spends her income.

Things like that are what maintenance is for. It's a contribution to the childs costs. She's not burdening the whole cost because she gets maintenance. I really don't understand what about that is unclear.

It is not for us to question her decisions or how she spends her income

Maybe not but it's foolish to keep throwing money at her for the kids when she's pissing it up the wall on other things.

@Getawaywithit thank you for the reminder that I do have no idea what is really happening in her life only what she tells DH and her children pass on to us. Similarly it's possible she thinks my new job means a vastly increased income just because its extra days. I shall try and remember your words as you have made a very important point.

@Getyourarseofffthequattro - I totally understand your point, but unfortunately this woman then says to the kids you can't do X or have Y because your dad won't contribute. He absolutely does not hesitate with uniforms / hobbies etc.
He did refuse to contribute to mobile phone contracts when the kids were still in primary school. The issue of buying them had been discussed, he said he thought they were too young, but she got them anyway. She has never asked since though even though they are much older now.

[quote Hiphopboppertybop99]@BaconAvocado another way of looking at it is, if your DH had that unexpected car repair bill and he couldn't afford it this month - would you offer to help him out whether that be by way of a loan or offering to pay it? Is it because its maintenance you're not keen to contribute? Just a hypothetical question.[/quote]
This isn't unexpected though. The pair of them should have worked it out before hand. Not left it to now to bicker over it frankly. And I'm only being dragged into it as I started a new job! She only knows about it as one of the DSC must have mentioned it to her.

If DH knew his car would need new brakes in a couple of months then no I wouldn't be paying for it. He can get the bus if he cant afford it this month.

I'd get it done officially, your income won't be taken into account, and of course if he wants be can pay extra beyond the legal figure; but private arrangements don't always end well.

DH is going to offer to go to CMS and ask them to work put the amount formally (thanks for that info sorry can't remember who it was).
Then he's going to offer to pay for half the hobby and the music lessons as he is already doing.
And half the school trips.
And.... half the school uniform each year. (Horray!)

He's going to offer to pay half of this years but it will have to be a bit late as he hasn't planned for it. If that isn't good enough then he can borrow off me and pay me back.

He is going to stop paying for Eldest's phone though and show her how to use data.

@Booknooks

I'd get it done officially, your income won't be taken into account, and of course if he wants be can pay extra beyond the legal figure; but private arrangements don't always end well.

Yes DH is going to offer to go down that route now.

@Getyourarseofffthequattro
If the children stay with NRP the RP is effectively ‘funding’ the cost of care in the other house because maintenance is reduced proportionately. You’re presuming my personal position, it’s not really relevant. But the point is it’s a bit sad when people turn everything into financial terms. If I can afford it there will always be a space in my home for my children even when they’re adults. If I’m paying towards a household there will be room for my children unless I’m so hard up that it’s not at all possible, because they’re my children not anything to do with anyone else

I can imagine what happened is that the eldest is now at secondary school and mum has been shocked at the costs of uniform. She asked dad to help contribute, he said that he was already paying extra and had nothing more to give her because he has bills to pay, and that's when she said that OP could contribute more towards the bill now that she has a better job so he has more disposable income.

Either way, it sounds she is just being greedy. She doesn't have childcare costs, nor housing, got decent maintenance, she is doing very well and should count herself lucky.

Saying that, I'm amazed that some think that kids don't cost much more when they are with the resident parent.£
If we forget the obvious, bills, housing, bigger/reliable car, there is still a lot to pay. If the kids are 12 and 9ish, there will be:

• two mobile phone, likely £40-50
• school dinners: £80-£100
• clothes: £100
• potentially transport to secondary school: anywhere up to £100
• activities AND everything to relativity. Sporting kits, music instruments, petrol to take to events: potentially up to £100
• gifts for birthday invites, pocket money or cash for trips into town, cinema, swimming, bowling etc... especially during holidays
• extra school costs, outfit for xmas show, book days etc..., ingredients for cooking class
• hairdresser, over the counter medicine, potentially teeth retainers

And on and on.... I worked out that my kids with in primary school cost me about £300 each per month and a bit more in secondary when clothes from Tesco didn't wash any longer, mummy cutting hair either, school uniform and activities much more expensive.

I worked out that my kids with in primary school cost me about £300 each per month and a bit more in secondary when clothes from Tesco didn't wash any longer, mummy cutting hair either, school uniform and activities much more expensive.

You’re lucky you can afford to spend so much on them. That’s far more than many people can afford.

@candlelightsatdawn morally? Morally I feel zero compunction to provide for children who are not mine. The level of stress and hours I work are for myself and my kids, period. I’ve made numerous sacrifices to get to where I am. Including missing countless school things, assemblies, sports events. I’m not home when my DC come back from school. I have even had to miss my DC’s birthday once because of a work trip that I simply was unable to not attend. That’s without adding into it the exhaustion I have on a Friday night week in week out after another week of work.

I don’t want pity, I don’t need it. But I work that hard for me and my kids. And I’ll be damned if someone comes along and tells me I am ‘morally’ obliged to work this hard to provide for someone else’s kids.

Re the comment (sorry I forgot the posters name), of not judging anyone else for not working. I will categorically judge and do judge. Due to the litigious nature of my partners divorce it is very clear from statements why and what his ex wife did regards work. They had both stated that she would continue some form of work pre having Dc. Then babies arrived and she unilaterally told my partner she was not returning to work as raising children was far more important than ‘WOHM’. She also has family money she is set to inherit. Her sheer entitlement that everyone else owes her a living because she deigned to birth children is beyond any sort of entitlement I have ever witnessed.

So morally? I owe her and her children sweet FA thank you. And I absolutely judge someone for not working once children are in school, no special needs, but a huge expectation that my partner is there to pay for her and her lifestyle.

When plenty of woman somehow miraculously manage to juggle the demands / costs of childcare and work/ home balance.

@BaconAvocado

I mean I work for my child's benefit really not for hers. But that makes me quite mean and cold I guess? I don't know it's all very confusing.

But they are your husband’s children too, aren’t they? And your child’s siblings? I couldn’t live with SC seeing their sibling living a lovely comfortable life 100% of the time while in their primary home they can barely afford school uniform. It’s just shitty for one sibling to live differently than the others and it’s certainly not going to foster strong sibling relationships in the future. No this is not your fault and legally not your responsibility, but if you care about the children and it’s in your power to make things a bit more equal I can’t see why you wouldn’t.

My parents never had much money until my mum got remarried to a relatively high-earning man. My stepdad had one older child snd my mom had my sister snd me. SD didn’t directly pay for school things, trips, etc but he bought a bigger house for all of us and paid for all of the utilities etc, which left our mum with enough money to give my sister and me uniforms, trips, music lessons, etc. My SD didn’t consider himself our father but he was of course a parental figure and when we were together the five of us were a family. It wasn’t just bc he cared about us but bc he adored my mom and he knew that giving us those things made her happy. My dad on the other hand was already stretched and he spent the little extra he had on doing nice things with us and making his home comfortable for us. My mum could have demanded more money from my dad but we kids would have been the ones to lose out, which is sadly what often happens in these situations.

@BaconAvocado - I know uniform isn't an unexpected cost..... I was asking more really to see if you would help him out with with a different type of expense. I think you said in one of your very early posts something along the lines of you feel your income should be used for the benefit of your household/ children. Apologies I can't remember exactly. So just wondered if in theory you would help him out with a car expense as it may benefit your child if they needed taking somewhere / school for example? Perhaps a little digression from me.
Anyhow, seems like your DH has come to a sensible conclusion in the end. Hopefully it will all be sorted.

I think it's clear to see there is definitely more than one way in which the non resident parent supports his children. I don't think there is a clear right / wrong answer and people will obviously post in relation to their personal experience.

But they are your husband’s children too, aren’t they? And your child’s siblings? I couldn’t live with SC seeing their sibling living a lovely comfortable life 100% of the time

This is sooo wide off the mark. Why do you think I had to apply for a new job with more days?!

while in their primary home they can barely afford school uniform. we're not sure if they can barely afford it or if the ex has just decided she thinks DH should contribute.

It’s just shitty for one sibling to live differently than the others and it’s certainly not going to foster strong sibling relationships in the future it is! Tell that to my DC, they are the one with the less ideal home life!!

@Hiphopboppertybop99 ah I get you. If unforseen car issue I'd help. If not he probably wouldn't even ask. But you have given me food for thought thank you.

Yes hopefully proposed solution will sort everything out.

And thanks to all those that said its normal for extra payments on top of maintenance for uniform. I don't think DH quite realised how expensive the secondary uniform can get!

No absolutely SP's income shouldn't be taken into consideration with regards to CM!

I personally don't think it's right they are taken into consideration in all other ways - for example when I moved in with DH when DS was younger, we lost CB as his income went over the threshold. DS also won't get much of a loan when he goes to Uni next year due to DH's income. It's fine in our case as DH has always been happy to support DS, but what if he wasn't?! Step parents income shouldn't be included in any of it.

DS also won't get much of a loan when he goes to Uni next year due to DH's income.

What? Will my income affect their uni loan?! Oh dear! So they get assessed on 3 adult's wages?!

Do most stepparents pay towards their stepkids uni fees?!

@BaconAvocado

DS also won't get much of a loan when he goes to Uni next year due to DH's income.

What? Will my income affect their uni loan?! Oh dear! So they get assessed on 3 adult's wages?!

No, the student essentially picks the parent's income which is taken into consideration, more often than not that's the RP's income. It's not a 3 way thing

@BaconAvocado

Do most stepparents pay towards their stepkids uni fees?!

We paid towards travel and tech at first (having bought SC's car. But when she went NC with DH we stopped that.

@Dollyparton3 phew! So they just choose mum's income or dad's income (presumably go for the lowest) and then as long as my money is kept seperate my income won't count.