Family court and reduction in contact for private nursery

[ThisMustBeMyDream]

My other half is in family court tomorrow. He's self representing. It's a contested final hearing.

He recieved his ex's position statement which states she will agree no increase to current contact (which we expected). But that she wants to discuss a reduction in contact to facilitate the child going to private nursery 5 days a week as she wishes to go back to work. She is offering the bog standard every other weekend with one evening for dinner but must stay locally. The child is currently 22 months old.

He currently has 3 days wed/thur/Fri with an overnight in week 1 and Fri Sat sun in week 2 with an overnight. He wants to increase contact to add the additional overnights in.

He has no issue with her going to nursery. But since he already has this contact and he can care for the child instead of her going to nursery, how could this go down in a final hearing?

He has to prepare himself as self rep - and needs to work out how to address it without coming across badly. Any tips or experience with this?

It’s horrible and it doesn’t have to be the end. Take tonight to process it all together, to be angry and upset, and then tomorrow your DP can see about getting some help for next steps. If I remember right, magistrates cannot go against CAFCASS recommendations without good reasons. I have been in your shoes and we got shared residence in the end. Decisions like this make a mockery of the whole system.

Thanks missmalice. He definitely won't stop here.

Can anyone tell me what he can do next?

He probably does need legal advice from a solicitor who is able to see the documents and discuss the exact details of the case.

He is entitled to legal aid. However he struggled to get the evidence as his GP would only write her own letter, not write it on the form it has to be on.

He's forced to self rep. Possibly because he's a man (who knows!).

He was the victim of DV. That's why he had so much contact. Because social services felt it was better for the child to spend a significant part of her life with her father.

Now a judge thinks none of it matters.

I’ve sent you a PM, OP. It might also be worth posting on the Legal Matters board for advice re getting the correct evidence. There’s some family law solicitors on there that might know what to do.

@ThisMustBeMyDream My heart sank when I read your update. You're both in my thoughts.

DH self-represented but he had legal advice in the background. As PPs have suggested, please get some family law advice. If you're in the NW, I can make a recommendation!

The various judges in DH's case interpreted statements, orders and the CAFCASS reports totally differently. Definitely go back and back again if you need to. Good luck.

Yes we are in the NW.

What an absolute nightmare. I'm trying to pull myself together for when he gets back. I can't stop the tears. They just keep flowing. Him and his daughter don't deserve this.

What has contact been changed to? Seems strange that they would reduce contact that is going well, and go against recommendations.

He needs to know the reasoning behind the decision as indeed, it is very odd that a court order arrangement would be changed to reduce contact with the nrp.

Unless he lost it or there is more to the story, it really doesn't make sense especially Christmas when standard is commonly every other year.

He's still not back. His phone died. Bugger knows when he will be back. I will get the exact changes from him when he gets back.

He said Christmas was because she should spend every Christmas with her sister.

What a shame, it doesn’t sound like a fair outcome at all. If he is entitled to legal aid as he is low income and been a victim of DV, then he really should make securing proper legal representation a priority. A solicitor will be able to give him accurate and tailored advice looking at all the relevant documents. It sounds unusual that he was prevented from getting legal aid due to a form, the solicitor should be capable of resolving that issue with the GP. There are certainly circumstances in which he can appeal the decision (usually within 21 days) so he should contact solicitors to find one who can help him (sometimes you have to keep calling them to get anywhere initially).

Unrepresented parties are a pain at court and the judges/ magistrates find it difficult to deal with them as there isn’t much time and self representing parties aren’t good at narrowing the issues so it ends up being a lot of information and the important bits aren’t clear. This is aggravated when it’s a lay bench of magistrates rather than a judge dealing with the case as they have far less skill in getting to the bottom of it all. It doesn’t sound like the court got to grips with the issues at all, although it doesn’t help if they found his 11 page statement too long- perhaps it wasn’t focused enough?

This isn’t the end so don’t be too disheartened. He might not have got what he wanted this time, but next time could be a completely different outcome. If he can get representation, it will make a world of difference.

He would never ever lose it. He hasn't got that kind of temperament.

I've PM'd you details of DH's solicitor.

Appeal looks like a waste of time. He can only appeal on procedural aspects.

Can he just put another application back to court? Immediately? This is bloody ridiculous and a waste of time!

What happened? Why was it reduced?
Is he ok? It's horrible either way when attending court

The reason it was reduced was (the magistrate said) because what he has now is too close to shared care. And the s7 report that was made prior to contact commencing almost a year ago stated that they didn't recommend shared care at that time. Except it bloody went on to say that they wouldn't be opposed to it when the relationship had built up... which it obviously has! So they've used an argument which is really invalid given it went on to state they wouldn't oppose it in future!

I feel like I couldn't make this up if I tried.

Christmas was ordered to her every year because it would be too emotionally distressing not to be with her sister. Apparantly.

He really needs to get the order as they said their reasoning will be in it.

He just said he can see why dad's walk away when faced with this absolute crap in family court.

He hasn't stepped a foot wrong. Yet somehow he has been pushed in to being a less involved dad. Because why?

So what contact has he been given? Will he get overnights? The Xmas thing makes no sense at all.

They are some terrible excuses and reason.
So my dp can have his ds every Christmas because we have a child together?... they would never do
That to a mother. You dp has had a lot of contact all ready so progression or at least the same should stand.
It really does depend on the judge, from one court case to another.
I fully understand the bs dads go through now, the constant control and comments they receive from the mother about parenting or what ever they do , it becomes abusive.
You've had people on here commenting about him educating himself like he must stop or change to follow what the mother does next.
In time it will get better

He isn't 100% certain on week 1 as he said he was in so much shock he could hardly take it all in.

It is either week 1: Thurs 10am-fri 12.30pm (possibly fri 6pm but he said he isn't sure which it is - he's going to ring court tomorrow to clarify). Week 2 is definitely Fri 10am- sun 12.30pm.

So he's had one increase of overnight, but lost half a day of quality time (weekend time) plus lost a full week day, possibly 1.5 week days depending on which it is.

Just to note, this is how much they took the child in to consideration.... she has her lunch at 11.30. She's a super slow eater, she generally takes a good half an hour to eat. She naps at 12/12.30. How is he supposed to give her her lunch, and stop her having a car nap when he has to get her back for 12.30. The reality is, he won't give able to give her lunch, and she will fall asleep on the 45 min drive back, and that's her afternoon nap and meal times screwed up. It's not possible!

Im sorry about what has happened. Where theres no precedent of alternate xmas's already and a half sibling involved there was little to no chance of him getting it im afraid. I didnt know he was asking for this as I would have prewarned you. It also makes sense that he hasnt been given more contact as theres a half sibling. I dont mean it makes sense to me but that the district judge would make that decision.

I'm really shocked reading the outcome and advice given on this thread.

Mumshappy- would Dad get alternate Xmases if he had another child? I thought that most NRP got alternate Xmases as long as they weren't in jail or something extreme.

He probably would if he had another child yes