A polite request that only people who believe in attachemnet parenting ish and self weaning join this thread please. I am just not up to being told I'm useless or a slave to my children

[IAmTheNewQueenOfMN]

Gecko is still waking at least 3 (sometime 6 and up times a night) to bf

Has anyone else had this?

she is 23 months

Hi, my DS is 4.2 and only having the briefest of feeds every few days now (in fact I wonder with each one whether it will be the last ), but at your DD's age he was the same. The bf-sleep connection seemed to get more and more reinforced as time went on, and I found being "on duty" all evening and all night quite tough.

In the end I decided to have a go at night-weaning gently using The No-Cry Sleep Solution for Toddlers and Pre-Schoolers (not sure if it's been mentioned already). The process was very slow, so it's hard to know how far the changes were a result of my efforts, but between the ages of about 2.6 and 3 he got used to going to sleep without feeding, and then I felt able to start putting some limits on his nighttime feeding. For a long time after that he was happy with a bedtime and morning feed, and in the last few months it's decreased even further, admittedly with a bit of encouragement from me. We still co-sleep for part of most nights.

I'm not sure whether any of this is relevant to you - think I just wanted to show that there can be a kind of middle way or compromise. At no point did I feel I pushed DS beyond what he could manage, and I feel fine about having bowed to some of my own needs/wants as well as worked hard to be responsive to his.

Good luck

Oh, and this is totally self-indulgent, but let me share the conversation we had at bedtime tonight (story, no request for milk, but he almost always wants one of us - okay, me if I'm there - with him while he goes to sleep):

DS - When I think about you it stops me from going to sleep.
Me - Does it? What is it that you're thinking?
DS - That I love you so much.

It's so good to know that he's happy and secure and genuinely doesn't seem to need to bf anymore.

i have a lovely dd, 10.5 months. still wakes 4-10 times a night, breastfed exclusivly, doesnt eat anything but breastmilk! (well almost) also co-sleeps, we do have a side along cot which sometimes works, but not always.
its hard work! but i wouldnt do it any other way.
so sick of other peoples negative opinions on co-sleeping and bfding on demand, but it really is the best thing for my dd, she is so happy and lovely.

I love this thread!

Am now on velcro baby no.3 [haggard]

maybe i should join this thread instead of my thread about nightweaning! dd is 18 months, we co sleep and she still feeds a lot at night. i've loved it but recently we've felt enough's enough. anyway i'll pop back and read this thread tomorrow when i'm more awake!

FinalFurlong your DD sounds just like my DS! Same age, same "eating" habits . His birthday is Feb 13, when's hers?

Hi
DS(only DC) is 2.5. I have always just done what felt right with DS. It turns out a lot of it is what AP is about. BF and co-slept (still do from 3am ish almost every night) Having trouble with getting him / helping him to sleep. DH wishes to use crying methods, I CAN'T and WONT. I'm knackered (athough not as much as the wonderful women on this thread I suspect!). Am starting a new thread about what the alternatives might be - please help!

I was also wondering - maybe linked to your problem too Queen but probably not - my dd seems to be suffering from 'weeellly scarewwweee dwwweams'... is this normal for a two and a half year old but we are just more aware with it because she is thrashing around between us in our family bed???

I'm also wondering, and would love advice on, how do you differentiate between a situation where your child needs your guidance and when to let them guide you?

Mine are a little older than many here, but this is one that still poses sticky questions for me.

My inclination is to let them set their own pace in life, but I worry that by doing that I'm not meeting their need for guidance. Surely the fact that I've had so much more life experience than them means that one of my roles is to make tough decisions on their behalf? Yet that can come into direct conflict with the idea of following their instincts. Throwing the demands of school etc. into the mix only complicates it further.

Any thoughts?

Isn't that the million dollar question, flummery? I wish I knew the answer too. Have a few half-thoughts about it, so will come back later if any of them develop into something coherent.

I also used the No Cry Sleep Solution, the first book, for babies, and made the move from DS falling asleep latched on, flutter nursing & waking frequently, to having a good feed and coming off on his own, which also led to reduced night wakings. It's a lovely book, author E Pantley very much one of us, a sling wearing co-sleeping mummy! The tone is very much that night nursing is not a problem that needs fixing, and only make changes if its really becoming an issue for you, not because the rest of the world is critical. V briefly you start to unlatch as soon as start flutter nursing, hold their chin up gently, so close mouth. Use key words that sooth, or a set piece of music, or rock/pat. If baby fusses give back the breast quickly for a short while, but keep repeating as many times as need. Finger on chin really works if they're v sleepy to accept being unlatched & stop rooting around! Can move on to using the key words/music etc to totally night wean, but I was happy when we went down to one quick night feed to let him drop this on his own, which he is now doing (age 2.4). I've just bought the toddlerand preschooler version of the book for her tips on transitioning to Big Boy Bed! It too has night nursing + co-sleeping toddler sections , along the same lines, but perhaps slightly more emphasise towards nightweaning. We had no tears, and he still lets me know when he really does need to nurse all night again, for teeth/illness and thats fine, glad to have the instant cure!

I've been think alot recently about self weaning, and if DS can truly self wean without me providing him with choices/replacements for BF. I can see how they drop day feeds on their own, but BF is entrenched in our bedtime routine, and night time soothing. If I do nothing will he really one bedtime just say no thanks mum!?
A few weeks ago he by chance carried up a drink from downstairs at bedtime, so I offered it to him at bedtime, and he had it and didn't ask for BF! Was bittersweet and I cried after he was asleep. The next night I brought the cup up and he chose to have it again, but the next night he asked for both and now back on bf! I wonder if at night times too should I offer alternative soothing or water to give him real choices. I guess I know the answer that he will stop when he's ready, but will he cling to it longer than he would have done because I have used it so much in my mothering of him that its entrenched and he know no other way yet. Perhaps when we move to his new bed I should be the one to move the bedtime feed so it's not last in the routine, making it easier for him to forget to ask when he's ready. Guidance or setting his own pace- but as it's me that set up our current routines... confused!

hi there

am also still feeding, co-sleeping half the time, and otherwise cot next to our bed (ds is 16 months)

am desperate to night wean thougb as want another child soon and too tired to think about sex!

do you think the pantley toddler book is really worth it - is it different enough to the baby one??

oh and he still wakes 3-4 times a night
i hate it and love it IYSWIM!
he is a gorgeous creature

Maygirl, I guess it depends how keen you are yourself on him weaning sooner rather than later. Why not try offering alternatives and see what reaction you get? You don't have to force the issue if he shows no interest.

In the course of learning to go to sleep without bf and in his own bed, my DS has seemed to need various "props". Most of them were suggested by me initially, but it's him who accepts them (and then gets quite fixated on them) or doesn't. We bought a cuddly toy together which he pretty much ignored for months and months, and then suddenly fell in love with. For a while he unfailingly asked for water or a cup of milk at bedtime. The current "helper" is a hot water bottle which he arranges very particularly under his feet!

Luvaduck, as I remember it the Pantley toddlers book does have lots of ideas that would really only work above a certain age (because they rely on a certain level of understanding on the child's part, for example). Good luck with your efforts towards another gorgeous creature!

In no hurry, but felt perhaps I should show him alternatives, in the same way I offered him solid food at a particular age, but left it up to him whether to eat it, made the potty available etc. He's bound to need some prop or change of routine at bedtime to be able to stop. I'm not to keen on cuddly toys, at least I can't get lost, but there are some around, so maybe he'll choose one as his prop himself! I'm probably thinking too much about it, he's probably old enough now to simply ask for a drink of water in the night if that's what he wants!

Have you got the baby Pantley book Luvaduck? The ideas are pretty similar, with the gentle unlatching, pressing on chin, but
before starting you create a phrase for all done nursing, which you use loads at the end of day feeds. Then you stop them falling totally asleep on the breast if they wake at night, do the unlatch when stop actively feeding, move boobs away quickly, if fussing repeat process at 30sec - intervals until falls asleep with patting.Once they are accepting falling asleep without being on breast then whisper the all done phrase. She reckons when they start to fall asleep without boob in mouth they also start to wake less for it. This was true for us, but it was before he was a determined toddler!
We moved our DS into his room at 16 months as he started waking loads again, seeming cross to be awake and not always wanting much milk. I think we started to disturb him, so we tried him in his own room and it worked. I was the most upset about it, he didn't bat an eyelid! I couldn't sleep without hearing his breathing the first few nights. I would have rather kept him in our room for longer, but it wasn't working anymore. Perhaps if will be moving him when have a new baby, could try now, especially since you don't want him waking more when you start babymaking !

I am in the same position as many of you. Ds is 26 months and still feeds 3-4 times a night (I think).

It is getting easier, I believe in what we are doing, it feels right somehow.

And I cower in the face of alternatives.

I still find it hard though when I hear Mums complaining about 9 month olds (or whatever) who still wake up in the night.

I think I sleep well enough, although I feel a bit haggard too!

Me too! I am totally exhausted this week as dd2 is waking even more than usual,I lost my temper dreadfully with my four year old yesterday just due to tiredness as I had been feeding every hour for a couple of nights. So today I feel a bit depressed by it but usually I just get on with it,I think she is too young (20 months)to be told to "save it all up for the morning"or whatever,(which I tried with dd1 and it did work,she was about two then I think)I think controlled crying seems cruel,but then bellowing at a four year old and tossing her toy onto the floor is pretty cruel too so today I feel a bit of a failure to be honest!

Sorry haven't read everything but just wanted to say that I really sympathise and think you're doing a brilliant job!

DD is only 7mths and co-sleeping and waking about 400 times a night. DS (nearly 3) also wakens up and wants in bed but due to baby, DH takes him downstairs and sleeps on couch with him. So we're all over the place. Afraid I didn't selfwean DS as I wanted to get pregnant and still not ovulating so weaned him off at 20mths. (Then hey presto - pregnant) Would have just continued otherwise though so completely support your choice.

It's certainly not the easy road to parenting but I feel it's the best for them.

I also feel that I can't share my horrendous nighttime problems as I will be told to get her into cot, let her cry and completely go against everything I believe in. People shake their heads in despair and call me a martyr.

Sorry for droning on and on but I just saw this thread and felt I had to lend support and also let off some steam....

Sorry - forgot to point out that DS is nearly 36 months and still wakens up around 4 times per night although not to feed (since that stopped at 20mths) so it's double trouble in this house

i lie between ds (3) and dd (9 months) every night, stealthily trying to unlatch dd when ds whispers "cuddle, mummy?". sometimes it's lovely and sometimes i fantasise about running onto the night bus in my jimjams and letting it rock me to sleep on the back seat. we have some idyllic moments, and others where i grumble, "leave me alone!". not really what sears had in mind, i suppose, but i'm trying!

I'm sorry to be earth-shatteringly dim, but what is attachment parenting? It sounds like it's something to be religiously observed. It also sounds like it's something to do with sleeping at night. And/or feeding at night. Have I got it?

I liked it when the DCs come into our bed. They are still encouraged to come in for a cuddle now at 8&10. It's nice, isn't it? I hadn't realised I was following a School Of Thought.

It does sound like the OP is a bit weary of it though. Is it okay to say you don't have to do it if it is making you overtired? Or is that heresy?