No Cry Sleep Solution Success!!! (I hope...)

[kayjayel]

Anyone want to join me in trying to make the NCSS work? I have an optimistic feeling (foolish I know) it may work with DD (5 mths).

She looked like a promising sleeper for first 2 mths (4 or 5 hr chunks!), then it all went to pot and has been waking every 2 hrs (or 45 mins, or constantly feeding) since then really. Had DS (now 3) as a sleeper from hell and I really can't do that all over again.

So I'm sticking with just one thing - trying to get her to settle herself from wake to sleep in her cot the very gentle gradual NCSS way. So - the plan -

Current going to sleep: on the breast
Goal - going into cot sleepy then settling self to sleep.

What I'm doing: the repeated pulling off the breast at the end of the feed and getting her to settle with just a cuddle, with the aim of then being able to cuddle her then put her in cot sleepy.

So night 1: Fairly normal 2 hrly waking, but seemed a bit easier at going into cot
Night 2:
Bed 9pm (socialising, so late),
woke 9.45 (rocked to sleep, back in 2 mins),
woke 1.30 , fed, back in cot (bit wriggly and fussy but no crying),
woke 4am (fed, fussy, but no crying, back in cot)
woke 6.30am (fed, awake for day)

It felt great! Longest sleep was 3.45 hrs, went 4.45 between feeds. And first night she's spent months in the cot all night (usually I get too tired and pull her in with me). And despite being wriggly and having more 'awake' breathing when put back in the cot after a feed she didn't wake or call for me, which feels like progress.

Excuse the me, me, me, thread, but I want to keep a log, and remind myself to keep going. Does anyone else want to join?

Oh bugger! Your night sounds a bit too frequent. Do you think it was teeth, or a backwards step, or just mystery children?

Maybe all 3?!

Hello

Can I join in?

Been doing self-settling training as my 9mo had his first tooth 5/6 wks ago which seemed to make him forget how to self settle!

We did a combination of rocking and cc the first time round as I knew no better

But now we have the wonderful NCSS so have been doing gradually reducing assistance (patting and rocking). He has managed to get himself to sleep a few nights this week and then today, first time for so long, DS self settled for BOTH day-time naps!!! So proud! Unfortunately had to assist this evening but wanted to share the success.

We are working on lengthening his naps too and this seems to be working very slowly too - had his longest lunch-time nap in history today.

Scifinerd - you are so right about quickfix and slow - we just have to keep at it!
Good luck all.

Hi Gabster - that sounds brilliant and so encouraging! How are your nights?

Last night v similar to the night before for us. Fortunately as weekend DP kindly got up with DS at crack of dawn, then all back to bed together later for extra sleep..

Hi Gabster, yes really encouraging - please stay and help us stick with it!

I think teeth are a prob here. Not coming through, just that long several months of grinding grumps that only really comes out at night. She settled okay, bit more hard work, but wasn't fed to sleep, then woke 2 hrs later, then just would not settle inthe cot. So in the bed with me, I reckon about 8 feeds between 11 and 7. So very much needing encouragement!

Well, afraid to say naps are pants today, but DS woke with a temp of 38.6C so he is obviously poorly.

Have just given him a second dose of calpol and his temp has come down a bit. I am consoling myself with the fact that if we had done CC again, we would be back to the drawing board once he is no longer ill, whereas this time it is a long-term solution!

Hate to say DS is a good night sleeper. He wakes a lot, more and more lately, but usually self-settles - has done from an early age. But we are having early riser problems, I think caused by his total reluctance to nap in the day. And he is a bugger to assist. Its my fault - I used to give him all his naps in the pushchair so I could walk the dog/go food shopping at the same time.

Hope your weekends pan out better.

Hi Gabster, sorry to hear DS is ill. Hope it doesn't last too long. By theway, did he alwayas self settle well or did this come with him self-settling to sleep at the start of the night?

Well, I tried to move us on to settling her in the cot, almost asleep, but not quite. Took 5 times and about 30 mins, but she was more awake than usual when she finally went in then settled with a hand squeeze and a shush.

But in terms of waking its pretty bad - every 45 mins til I took her in bed with me, then I lose track, prob every 1-2 hrs, lots of comfort sucking. I'm hoping this won't last.

Does anyone have any gentle tips on how to get her to settle for DP - I can rock her back to sleep so in theory DP could resettle her at least in the early bit of night, but she goes ballistic when she realises its not me.

Tinier - a better night yet?

Same again really, except fed at 10.30 instead of 11.45 so it felt better as I got more sleep between then and 2.30. Feel a bit discouraged but have to remember it will take time, just need to keep at it.

Yes, its hard to stay positive, isn't it. I nearly didn't tonight, and it took 10 repeats to get her into the cot slightly awake. But only 15 mins. Then I had to remember that 10 days ago she was falling asleep on a feed, so need to remember progress! But night wakes are another thing! I'm expecting to see her again in about 35 mins. Try to remember your lovely night last Wed (?), maybe it'll come again?

Hey kayjyel - sounds like you have made real progress to me. 15mins and 10 times down sounds just like where we were a week or so ago. Even when he self settles, DS usually takes between 5 and 10mins - sometimes 15.

DS started re-settling himself in the night pretty much on his own, but we had to work at helping him learn to go to sleep on his own from awake. We did similar to Pantly - put him down progressively more awake but only did the official bed-time one that way (7pm jobbie). Once he could do that we started working on day naps.

I reckon the evening bed-time is easier to work with because they are sooooooo tired. But that's my preference. Others say its easier to do a day nap or two, then one in the buggy/car to give yourself a break and just make sure you get them down on time in the evening no matter how so that they are not overtired.

DS certainly is waking every hour after about 1am at the moment. I am fairly sure its his teeth but he is not re-settling at the moment so each time we have to go in and shush pat him still in the cot - it is almost like he is crying in his sleep. We have found if we pick him up to pat him he wakes up more/it takes longer. Not sure if anyone else has found this. Patt his belly where he lies and he goes back off quicker.

Common ladies - a new week and a new log. Look back to the last log and compare to get your motivation.

Hi kayjyel, yes, that really is progress - it's easy to forget!
Last night was better- woke at 2.15 then not again until around 5.40, hurrah! Still not convinced it's anything other than luck though.

Bizarrely, have just been for walk with DS screaming from tiredness all the way but not going to sleep, brought him back home, checked nappy and he just lay down, looked peaceful and self-settled. Very weird.

Sounds like a great night! In the scheme of things, anyway . Anyone have any idea why DD is doing pretty well at settling, but waking every 45 mins after that? I rock her back to sleep for the first one (again progress ), but she'll only settle with a feed at the second wake (about 2 hrs after bed). Last night (night 8?) was:

Bed 7pm
Wake 7.45 (rocked back to sleep)
Wake 9 (fed, rocked wouldn't settle back in cot easily til about 10pm)
Woke 1am (only now am I realising that this is a fantastic chunk!), fed lying down, stayed in bed
Fed 2am
Fed 4am
Woke 6.30am and fed for day

I scared myself silly in the night forgetting that she was there. - this is usually a sign that I've had enough sleep to properly go to sleep iyswim!

Tinier - weirdly dD was also not happy in buggy this morning - can we blame the weather!? Or a full moon?

Tinier that's Fab. I'm so P.S. my ds always screams when we go out in the pushchair if he is really tired. Not sure if its the same thing.

Kayjayel - your night sounds scarily like mine. My DS has real problems re-settling at the moment. We have been doing the "quick back to sleep" method from the book for day naps and we have had minimal success but I am fairly sure it is teething in the night at the moment as so not like him and gave him calpol at 3am - with the lights off so I also gave it to the floor, the pile of clean washing and the bedding ...... .

Hiya! Would love to join this thread as have just embarked on NCSS with 12 month old ds who needs to learn to self sooth back to sleep in the night. Last night as follows:

Bed 7pm - backrub, occasional picking up, sleep at 8pm after A LOT of crying!

Awake 9.30 pm - backrub, key phrases back to sleep at 10

Awake 2am - 10 min backrub & key phrases

Awake 5.30am - back rub, key phrases, cuddles, eventually into bed with us at 6am & only went back to sleep after a bottle

Would love to hear any success stories of this method...

I like the calpol technique! Hate bloody teeth. I always think I'm not believed as well if I suggest its that, by some people at least. My mum blames teeth or hunger for EVERYTHING. Its ridiculous. Gabster - let me know if you hit on a solution - did the calpol help?

Hi ladymoo! sounds promising, hopefully it'll work for you soon. 12 mths is a long road.

Have things I have to do but just want to mark this thread so I can come back to it.
I did it.
DS2 now sleeps 6-5, has a feed and goes back down until 7:30.

Not convinced it was the calpol that sorted him in the end, but he eventually slept which is the main thing for now.

Had a FABULOSO day for naps today though. Suppose that figures after the last few nights we have had.

Had to get DS back to sleep again middle of lunch-time nap, but had already slept 1hr15 so was not convinced he would sleep much longer but actually slept 2hrs30 in the end!!!! Love that Elizabeth Pantly. That is such a huge improvement from total 45m to perhaps 1hr20m 3 weeks ago!!!

He went down well tonight and self seltted, with just a murmour after 45m so I am happy (for now).

Good luck for the night shift ladies.

How old is your DS? And how long did it take (a pleading, hopeful emoticon!). Tales of success are what I need to have in my head when I'm feeling too tired to be bothered.

Horrific day with DS today, household stress high, so I didn't have the strength to calmly do the putting her in cot awake, but at least I didn't feed her to sleep. And she's been asleep for nearly 90 mins, so breaking the pattern of frequent early wakes. Sensibly I should get off to bed. How is everyone else getting on?

He is 7 1/2 months. We only started it about three weeks ago.
Mainly shh pat and PUPD plus shortening of feeds.

Not a great night, bed at 6.20 after about 20 mins cuddling, singing etc then
9.50
1.10
3.30
5.25 and up at 5.45

Is any of this making any difference? Our nights just seem so erratic.

I wish I could make day naps more predictable, I know there should be more of a routine, but when the time he gets up varies and the length of the naps varies, it just ends up being as and when he needs it - which is every 2 hours. Plus not napping in his cot yet as DP works from home and picking up and putting down with intermittent crying in the bedroom disturbs his telecons.

And I have just rocked him to sleep completely for a nap now. Rubbish. He was making such sad whingey noises, there didn't seem to be any other way.

I feel very dispirited today. I think I am a bit of a crap mother. I get loads of help, DP gets up at 7 several days a week to take DS for a walk, he gets up at crack of dawn one of the weekend days, his parents come over once every couple of weeks to give me a break and I still can't manage to do this properly.

Sorry I typed and dashed both times yesterday.
With DS we started by making his cot somewhere for 'quiet time' rather than enforcing sleep so he would spend time there a couple of times a day when not tired or too wide awake.
Then I locked myself away with him for a week and watched his sleep cues so I could put him down at the exact moment he was tired and he magically just started sleeping in his cot for naps, no fuss.
It wasn't so easy with night times but be started by changing his last full feed of the day and moving his bedtime forward, so where he was previously going down at 7 straight after a feed I'd give him a full feed at about 5ish, bath, small feed, talking to him during the feed so he didn't nod off and then put him to bed awake, read a story, leave the room (all by 6pm)
The first few nights were horrific, I may as well have camped outside his door because every time I put him down within five minutes he would cry and I didn't want tears so I'd run straight up. Then I'd shh/pat him until he was calm, put him back down ad infinitum.
Within about a week he cracked going to sleep by himself, then it was just stopping the night wakings. Most of which automatically fell into place but I have been doing the withdrawal of feeds if he demands in the night so I'll give him enough just to calm him down, then sit him over my shoulder and pat his back (like winding) to make sure he is semi-awake when he goes down.
Last night he fell asleep on me at 5:30! He woke for a small feed at 3:45 and slept through til 7am.
Keep up the good work, it will happen eventually!

VS - that is really encouraging, thank you. I have a query though, when I put DD down sleepy, she usually wakes, but is quite happy babbling for a while. Should I pick her up immediately and get her back to sleep, or let her lie happy until she gets upset and cries for me? I've tried both a bit, and leaving her happy for a while seems to mean it takes longer to get to sleepy than if I'm quick with it? What do you think? I may move a bit closer to VS's way rather than this slow crawl.

Tinier - I'm so sorry you're feeling this way, I know it too well. Today I decided her keywords will probably be the noise of me sobbing uncontrollably. I'm trying calpol tonight just in case it helps (though getting it in her is another huge problem). Please don't feel crap - everyone has days like this, no matter how much help you have or don't have. I had absolutely tons of help with DS, and much less now with DD, and I found it harder with DS than I do now with 2 kids and less help . Please treat yourself to something today and you're being a fab mum because you care so much about him you responded to his whingey noises with a cuddle. Yet again he gets to feel secure and loved.

Dreadful night here, after a promising start (2 hrs sleep) - she was just permanently attached to a nipple until I lost it at 5, and actually woke her up just so I could lie on my own a bit. (The sobbing started at 6 when she wouldn't go back to sleep). But at least she didn't fall asleep on the breast... I'm clinging on to that!

Thanks, sorry, just being a bit self-pitying today! Sorry for whingeing. Your night sounds a lot worse than mine. And it IS progress if she is not falling asleep on the breast, even if it doesn't feel like it right now!

Am also interested in the put down, happy babbling bit, DS can be the same, esp for naps.

Thanks for posting VS, think that's the encouragement I need, it does work.

Well our night looked like this in the end:

7pm - to bed.
7:10pm - fell asleep unaided
10.30 - 11.00 - lots of noises and groans (quite usual) no assistance needed

1am - screaming at top of lungs
4am - decided to have a nice chat for 20m. Listened and cursed as know will take me 1hr to get back to sleep.
6am - screams (dog now awake and liking face so no chance of sleep)
7am - up for the day.

Not too bad. Vast improvement on lately.

DS decided to only take 20m nap this morning but did not think he was going to take anything. Chickened out and took him out with the dog. So much less stress!

Has just taken 15m to get him in the bed not crying for lunch nap, but has taken him 7m after shutting door to get himself to sleep so can't complain.

Good luck ladies.