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Original poster

Sleep training, cries for 2 hours straight? Normal?

218 replies

Lynstar05 · 30/07/2021 08:00

Hey guys, I am with a sleep consultant and doing gentle sleep training of parent stay and fade method. We are on day 2 and for all night time wakings, bedtime and naos it takes him over an hour to fall asleep at 1hour 20 mins of crying shortest and went 2 hours yesterday morning and still not asleep. He kicks ans screams and red in face. He is 6 months old.

Has anyone else found this? It makes me so sad and worried about him but desperate to help his sleep and for this to work. I never thought id end up doing this and feel guilty for him.

Every time I read about parents sleep training they always say 'It was horrendous, he cried for 15 minutes'. Well try 2hours!!

Words od encouragement and support or advice needed please :((.

Struggling first time mum X

OP posts:
ittakes2 · 30/07/2021 11:05

When my children were young because I had twins I bought a baby bjorn with back support. I would put a twin which needed being held in that while I washed the bottles. From memory it goes up to 15 kilos but I was still using it (just) when they were 2 years old. Maybe that might help.

Feetupteashot · 30/07/2021 11:05

I couldn't listen to my 6 month old cry for 2h :(

TaVeryMuchLove · 30/07/2021 11:06

It will get better, honestly. Just do whatever you need to do now to get through and then maybe try the sleep training again when he’s a little older. It will be ok. This first year really is so tough. Keep going Smile

orangejuicer · 30/07/2021 11:08

Perhaps it would help you OP to get this thread deleted. You will get a mix of views, some of which you might find unhelpful/upsetting.

I stand by what I said but there comes a point when advice stops being helpful.

Horehound · 30/07/2021 11:10

Hi @Sunshineaftermorningrain
I mean in African countries babies bed share with their mums and share with cousins and there's no pressure yet we seem to think we must put our babies away in another room at 6 months and they should be sleeping through the night and of not, then it's us doing something wrong.
Pressure builds and we think we need sleep consultants to come and fix our babies. Does this not seem crazy to you?!
What I should have said in my first post though, was that I myself got worked up constantly thinking about my son's sleeping and I went through utter hell and various techniques, mainly the Lucy wolf ones, because we were quite against cry it out or controlled crying. Tried controlled crying for two nights and all that happened was my son was very upset and didn't get the support and cuddles he wanted and I was upset and angry for it not all going to plan. I remember Exactly what op is going through. Holding baby for 30 mins then trying to put on cot only for them to wake. I was frustrated and my back hurt. I blamed my husband for not letting us do controlled crying for a week etc and thought it would sort all our issues but at what cost to DS? In the end it was just months of hell trying various things to suit the agenda of getting baby down nice and quietly for all night etc...not realistic!
We adapted things slowly and found using a combo of things like using white noise, the Lucy wolf pat and shush technique and God knows what else worked for certain periods. Then as soon as DS got Ill or was teething we were back to square one again and started on something else. In hindsight, the most pressure I felt was from listening to other people going on about them doing controlled crying and how their baby was sleeping so well and oh my god, they couldn't believe all the stuff I had to do. It was like a competition. So I know it's bloody hard but we really try to make our adult lives easier instead of thinking what our baby needs and most wants and 6 months is still very, very young really.
I have complete sympathy for the op. But 2 hours screaming for a 6 month old...no. pick up and cuddle. Things will change as they get older but you don't realise it in that moment.

FreeBritnee · 30/07/2021 11:11

In my experience if we ever let our child cry themselves to sleep they’d always wake up in a complete stage hours later. Was never worth even though sometimes I was so exhausted I was hallucinating.

FreeBritnee · 30/07/2021 11:11

*state

1940s · 30/07/2021 11:15

God that sounds so so cruel.

6 months old is way too young for a method that is clearly leaving them in absolute distress. The stress and cortisol in their body will be horrific.

A baby needs to have good comprehension to understand any method of 'gentle' training.

Stop, cuddle and comfort your child and look at gentle methods when they're older (assuming they've not settled naturally)

Sunshineaftermorningrain · 30/07/2021 11:19

I am not an expert on African culture but I don’t think needing sleep is crazy. For mum or baby.

Vitallyli · 30/07/2021 11:22

@Lynstar05 sorry the sleep is so bad at the moment, it will get better eventually. We had his cot with one side down next to our bed (between wall and bed) so we would co-sleep but had extra space. Once asleep I could sneak out with video nanny on. Do you breastfeed? If you do id try to eliminate the dummy first and then make more changes. He needs the comfort of sucking to fall back to sleep but then it wakes him up when it falls out. I used my boob as a dummy but somewhat it's easier to take it out when he's asleep without waking him up, it's a good indicator if he's in deep sleep if I take it out and he's not fussing about it. I hope it gets better soon.

Sheldock · 30/07/2021 11:25

Sling in the day time, swaddle at night.
DD needed me to fall asleep for a very long time, some babies just need that adult/reassurance. DS could fall asleep anywhere, anytime.
We eventually did the white noise and rub back method (made up by us) but not until at least 12 months. She was never left to cry as that made it worse. She had separation anxiety from a newborn so we just went with what she needed then...us.

Original poster
Lynstar05 · 30/07/2021 11:29

Yes I worry about going back to work soon and will he sleep during the day.

OP posts:
Vitallyli · 30/07/2021 11:29

I also find it helpful to lie down next to the baby rather than holding them and rocking, you can pay them, cuddle, rock too, it helps when I do deep breathing. It takes time too but once asleep it's easier to retreat. I'd introduce small changes over time, not all at once. He sounds like he's not ready to fall asleep on his own yet and that's perfectly fine. It will get better once he's a bit older.

Original poster
Lynstar05 · 30/07/2021 11:30

Perhaps we could try this cot thanks. We do have it already next to ourbed but S soon as he sees him going near it he cries lol ahhhhh

OP posts:
Hardbackwriter · 30/07/2021 11:31

@Sunshineaftermorningrain

I am not an expert on African culture but I don’t think needing sleep is crazy. For mum or baby.
People who go on excitedly about what they do in 'African tribes' always make me cringe - there's such a 'noble savage' thing going on there, and the way that it's discussed as if there's one culture across the whole huge continent...

Cosleeping is indeed by far the most common way in which babies sleep across the world - though it's rarely done by the wealthiest in any society, which maybe says something about how much of that is a choice. The vast majority of cultures also still use physical discipline for young children but weirdly that doesn't seem to be taken as proof that it's natural and best and that western mothers have lost touch with their natural instincts in the same way...

Original poster
Lynstar05 · 30/07/2021 11:31

Thank you yes this work sometimes so I do try it for his naps!

OP posts:
Horehound · 30/07/2021 11:31

@Sunshineaftermorningrain

I am not an expert on African culture but I don’t think needing sleep is crazy. For mum or baby.
It's not crazy but it's just to show op that what is happening is normal for the babys age. When you're in the midst of it you think you are the only one going through it and every other baby in the world is going off to sleep easily and it's just not reality.

I think op needs help, husband to do a few nights holding to sleep if he can then maybe op does two or three or even night about or something. Then introduce some gradual things...you just have to try various things. I remember for a while my son liked the song Vide Cor Meum from the Hannibal soundtrack 😂Christ knows how my husband figured that one out but it worked for a month or so then we had to switch up our methods again.

Op can your husband take annual leave and give you a break?

Horehound · 30/07/2021 11:33

People who go on excitedly about what they do in 'African tribes' always make me cringe
No one mentioned "tribe."

Not every one in African is in a tribe these days Hmm

Hardbackwriter · 30/07/2021 11:35

@Horehound

People who go on excitedly about what they do in 'African tribes' always make me cringe No one mentioned "tribe."

Not every one in African is in a tribe these days Hmm

Indeed, and nor do they all bedshare.
TheQueenofMoo · 30/07/2021 11:38

I haven't RTFT, but I've read all OPs post?

Has the sleep consultant looked into any underlying conditions such as reflux etc. My first baby was very difficult, because he had CMPA and reflux. Once that was under control, his sleep improved on its own.

Sunshineaftermorningrain · 30/07/2021 11:39

In any event sub Saharan Africa has the highest infant mortality rate in the world. That’s not linked to sleep especially I wouldn’t have thought, it’s general lack of resources, but it does show that whatever is being done there is not an exemplary practice we should all seek to emulate.

CloseYourEyesAndSee · 30/07/2021 11:39

@Sunshineaftermorningrain

I am not an expert on African culture but I don’t think needing sleep is crazy. For mum or baby.
My in laws are African and they don't stress about baby sleep really. Baby gets strapped on the back while mum is working until they go to sleep, then they get popped on a bed to nap. Baby goes to bed when mum does and they share sleeping space. I've never seen any baby in the family have sleep issues. Maybe that's just luck/genetics but my baby was as much their genetics as any of his cousins and I found sleep more stressful than any of them and I did cosleep etc too. The need for routine is a construct that doesn't actually meet babies' needs.
Starjammer · 30/07/2021 11:43

DD went through quite a long phase of contact napping - I just kind of went with it, watched Netflix, listened to podcasts, read, took the opportunity to do no housework without guilt Grin Sling is good for sleeping while they are on you if you need to get stuff done. DD also co-sleeps - we have a really big bed, which helps, and DH slept elsewhere when she was smaller so it was just me and her. She decided she hated the cot, so it became an expensive storage unit (and still is) but she will happily sleep in a grown-up bed and once she's asleep at 7 I just get back up again till I'm ready to go to bed. She's 2.5 now and sleeps through the night.

Baby sleep is almost invariably a collection of phases that come and go. They feel like a lifetime when you're in them, but sometimes you need to just go with them because it really does pass so fast. I look back on those contact nap days and I do miss them (not least because she dropped napping at all quite early so she's just on the go all day now!).

Horehound · 30/07/2021 11:47

I've just remembered something I tried.
Op has your baby ever been in the cot without the expectation of sleep?
You could try putting some toys in there and just giving your baby some time to get used to the cot and see that it is not a scary thing.

Also have you tried putting a cosy water bottle on the mattress for a few mins before laying baby down? It could be something simple like that change on heat going from a cosy parent to a cold or ambient mattress that might stir them enough to wake up.

Just a few things to try.

Cookofcastamar · 30/07/2021 12:10

@Lynstar05 sorry to hear you're struggling. As a parent to a clingy non sleeping child I sympathise. I can't explain it but just thinking about that period sends me in to panic mode. Mine woke every two hours until 23 months. He had eczema l, reflux and allergies. He's 8 now and still doesn't need much sleep. When it is your first everything seems endless and takes forever, the crying, no sleeping etc. I have no advice on how to make him sleep better but just want to say it will pass. Leave housework for now and if you have nothing pressing sleep with your baby if it makes you both happier. The sleep consultant will not tell you otherwise as that is their livelihood. Your baby will not be like this forever, it is a phase that will pass. There is so much going on at 6 months with solids introduction, maybe teething, crawling etc. It is tough but will get better.x