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Waiting it out

449 replies

burritofan · 18/09/2019 20:28

Is anyone else following the extremely vague and lazy "wait it out and hope it spontaneously resolves itself, maybe solids/crawling/walking/time/eventual night-weaning/magic/bribery once she can talk or be reasoned with" baby sleep plan?

We're nipple-deep in the four-month regression, which followed fast from the 8-week-jabs endless night poo era, then the 12-week hourly waking growth spurt. Throw early teething,

a late tongue tie division and a crap reaction to 16-week jabs into the mix – all in the same week! Which is when she migrated from Snuzpod to sleeping in my armpit – and you get a shitstorm of night wakings, my solution to which is:

plonk baby (now 21 weeks) in bed with me each night – after first making comatose with boob after rock-solid bedtime routine – and reapply boob as needed. Sometimes sleepily snuggling works in the middle of the night. Sometimes she wakes, babbles, pats around to check I'm there, and resettles. (Rare as a unanimous AIBU? thread, but like sunshine when it happens!)

Sometimes we start the night with a 3-hour chunk, other times 45 minutes. Some nights she wakes up only 4 times, others what feels like 4,000. Very little crying unless more teeth/colds, in which case howling then calpol and boob and a lie-in if she grants it. (I know the advice is to wake at the same time each day but (a) the baby wakes herself at the crack of dawn most days and when she doesn't (b) if she was up for two hours howling because of her teeth, I'm not going to enforce a wake-up for the sake of some Gina Ford nonsense.)

The 45-minute wake-ups are guaranteed if I put her down in her sidecar crib now, or even if leave the room – sometimes she wakes straight away if I try to swap with DP. Even in deep sleep she has a batlike sense for my being in the room. She generally starts the night starfished on the bed; as the night goes on she gets more unsettled and likes my armpit to snuggle into best. Perhaps it's the woolly mammoth furriness?

She's not great at feeding lying down but I'm persevering because I'm lazy. Occasionally I attempt the pull-off thing of putting my finger in her mouth to delatch once she's asleep but I'm too knackered to do it consistently or time it to gradually reduce feeds, I think I'm doing it in a half-hearted "gosh I really should sort this sleep thing". Mostly I do it so I can go to sleep if I'm feeding sitting up. I've no idea how to shhhh-pat; PUPD seems like an awful lot of effort with a heavy baby when I could be lying down, and deeply confusing; gradual chair or whatever makes me want to weep with exhaustion more than the current situation; CC or CIO is neverrrrrrr going to happen. On the other hand, I have wistful recollections of evenings, of my lovely DP, of times when I ate dinner somewhere other than over a snoozing baby's head in the dark...

Basically is anyone else doing what I'm doing to improve their baby's sleep, i.e. not very much at all, and wants to commiserate while we ride it out, slash create bad habits, construct towering Jengas of rods for backs, build sleep crutches, and generally arse it up? Any experienced "totally winged it and it worked out fine" mothers want to share delightful stories of "Oh one day he just pushed the boob away, fell asleep and did 12 hours and it's been a fairytale ever since, I got my bed and my sex life back" lazy parenting magic?

DP & I are softies who plan on an open-door policy of "if the kid can't sleep because of nightmares or growing pains, come on in our bed, they're only little", have fond memories of childhood shenanigans of sleeping on the landing or sneaking down to see what the grown-ups are doing, BUT also have no interest in "giant floor bed co-sleeping til 20" and quite like each other and the idea of the kid in her own room eventually, it would be nice to have some hope.

::rambles on in a sleep-deprived manner while teething DD snores on my shoulder, preps coffee machine for tomorrow, hopes there are other chaotic parents out there doing the absolute least::

OP posts:
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Harrysmummy246 · 18/10/2019 14:36

@burritofan

YOU ARE NOT BAD AT THIS
You are sticking with it and doing the best by your child. Yes it's f*ing tough especially when there's a smug off going on or you get the 'Formula would make them sleep' rubbish trotted out at you.

You are doing brilliantly and it does eventually get better.

Do you have a sling/ carrier so you can at least make a sandwich (next time as I appreciate this was yesterday, I went to bed early with my stinking cold)

Mariposa123 · 18/10/2019 18:19

@Whuut we’re in the same boat with bottles. She won’t take them. Or she’ll take w bit and spit it out. How old is your LO? I’m taking the same approach and hoping she’ll take to a cup but I’m not optimistic it’ll happen anytime soon

Whuut · 18/10/2019 18:55

@Mariposa123 DS is 16 weeks. How about yours? He took a couple when he was younger, so I know he can do it but, I was so afraid of it affecting breastfeeding that I didn't really bother too much. At the moment he'll chew on it for a bit maybe give one suck then get annoyed and want the boob. I'm not holding out hope he'll take a cup either.

@burritofan I think that every day. But like harrysmummy said, you're not bad at this!

Mariposa123 · 18/10/2019 20:25

@Whuut she’s 24 weeks, but we didn’t try bottles until she was about 14 weeks as I was worried about nipple confusion. We aren’t far off weaning but it does mean I haven’t been away from her for longer than an hour, which probably doesn’t help with night time clinginess!

Whuut · 18/10/2019 20:32

@Mariposa123 Yeah I think so too. DP was going to try bedtime tonight but, after a full scale meltdown whilst changing he's now falling asleep on the boob. Nails dug firmly in. Hopefully weaning helps for you. I'm holding onto the thought it will.. clutching firmly at straws over here.

At this point I feel like I'll have to make visits to school to feed and rock him.

bottomflannel · 19/10/2019 14:34

Hope everyone’s having a nice Saturday. DH held DS between 9pm and 12.30am so I could get some sleep so feel at least vaguely human today. I think DS is teething, is constantly chewing on his fingers and drooling constantly, so that might explain how he’s being. Also we’re apparently smack in the middle of leap four.

DS currently on my lap after a boob snooze, watching the Brexit debate. He has just done a massive poo - about sums it all up really.

Speaking of things that are poo, it’s looking likely that I will have to go back to work a month or two earlier than I hoped :( A spate of Things Needing Fixing has wiped out a chunk of the money we’d saved so I could be going back as early as six months, but hopefully I’ll be able to hold out until seven taking AL into account. Thankfully I work fr home a lot and my mum is going to look after him during the days until he is one, but I’m absolutely gutted. And also have no idea how I’ll manage to work efficiently if his sleep is no better by then. Sigh.

At least it’s sunny outside.

OhHolyNightWaking · 19/10/2019 15:08

I haven't RTFT properly (too knackered! Grin) but I could have written the OP. Except my DD is 9 months. I am a very tired husk of a woman.

Currently trying to boob her to sleep for her second nap (#contactnapper) and on verge of weeping. I feel like I spend so much time awake from my DS trying to get this effin' baby to sleep. Also my DH is resentful of the situation, he never sees me, etc.

Part of me wants to hold out for the magic point at which it just gets better by itself. Part of me is sorely tempted to CIO, although it goes against my instincts.

OhHolyNightWaking · 19/10/2019 15:09

AWAY from not awake from... but what a fitting typo. 😆

burritofan · 19/10/2019 15:56

@OhHolyNightWaking Hahaha to your username, well done. Did you ever think you'd be here at 9 months? I read so many books and schedules before DD was born; I had the perfect hypothetical baby doing well-timed imaginary cot naps. I knew and feared the four-month regression. Yet here I am at six months in absolute chaos.

Whuut, Mariposa, Harrysmummy – thank you for tolerating my mini meltdown the other night! It was the first night aside from hospital that DP hasn't been with us and, even though I basically deal with nights by feeding, I think not having him there as emergency rocking/walking/holding backup caused major anxiety. Of course there is food in the freezer! We have a microwave! All is not lost! Yet when you're bouncing a baby in a dark room for the umpteenth time it feels like it.

bottom That sucks about work. I'm simultaneously ready to return – woo, using my brain! Not thinking about nappies – but also can't imagine it. Both from the sleep perspective but also the time away from her.

She's done two 90-minute naps today. ::twitches:: DP has the nap knack. (In the Ergo, not a cot or anything. He's not actually a wizard.) And we started BLW this morning with avocado toast, so I expect a structured 3-meal, 3-nap routine will quickly fall into place and the night wakings will cease ahahahahaha

OP posts:
Whuut · 19/10/2019 17:56

@bottomflannel Sorry to hear about work, we are pretty much scraping by, with family help, I want to return when he's about 9 months, I'm self employed so it's a bit different though. We too are in the middle of leap 4, and I think the 4month regression too (regression from what, I'm not sure.) DS has always been a shit sleeper but one good thing is that he was always relatively easy to get to sleep- cue, the last 3 days. It's taken bloody forever to get him to sleep, only for him to wake 30 mins later. Last night broke me, and DP. I'm gonna wait it out till 6 months but if something doesn't change I'll have to look into actively trying some gentle methods- I could never do CIO/CC.

@burritofan Always here for a meltdown, I'm on the verge of one as well tbh.

Welcome @OhHolyNightWaking, very fitting username. Glad you could join us, doesn't give me much hope for the future tho! I also feel like I spend most of my time either getting DS to sleep or, trying to keep him asleep.

In town today, he fell asleep in the car seat on the way there, after crying from over tiredness. Put him on the pram, got to the shop and a dog starts going mad and DS wakes up. I could of cried there and then but DS did that for me.

bottomflannel · 19/10/2019 18:59

Ah burrito So sorry, in the midst of my pity party I must have missed your post. I understand completely re the anxiety - whenever DH has plans to go out (which is really rarely tbh) the thought of managing two children sends me into a bit of a panic, especially in the evening. I hope you are feeling better now.

Whuut Am so sorry you are having it rough too. Sounds like the Great Nap Conspiracy has done its evil work again. Wishing you strength, this too shall (eventually) pass.

OhHolyNightWaking Welcome! I too spend far too much time trying to get/keep baby asleep and not enough time with my eldest. It is shit, to say the least. While I always wanted two children and love DS2 very much, sometimes when I’m at my lowest I yearn for the days when we were just three. Feel bloody awful and guilty for even going there though - and don’t feel that way at all when my mood is brighter.

Wishing you all a good night.

Harrysmummy246 · 19/10/2019 20:07

So I'm away from home this weekend to visit friends and help with their DTs (13w corrected). Hotel room. Lovely bed. Didn't bloody sleep til 1 did I. DS was down at 7 and that was it til 8 am for daddy apparently and just woke up giggling then came through when DH talked on the monitor.

I am waiting for an update on how DS does for daddy at granny's house and contemplating night nurse to knock myself out since I won't need to get up for DS

It's very very unfair that I had a crappy night

Whuut · 19/10/2019 20:17

If anyone wants a laugh, I'm currently slouched on the bed feeding DS (AGAIN), sucking the dummy I'm desperately trying get him to take and reading sleep solutions. Oh, what have I become?! Atleast I'm laughing at what a hot mess I am.

@Harrysmummy246 Oh that's so annoying! Try and forget about DS and enjoy the break. Very jealous and hoping you get some sleep tonight.

OhHolyNightWaking · 20/10/2019 09:01

Thanks for the warm welcome ladies. Although sorry we are all in this shitty boat together.

I hope the age of my DD doesn't strike fear into any of you. Honestly I think it's my fault for fucking it all up, so I wouldn't read anything into it. My DS wasn't a great sleeper, but he was a million trillion times better than DD.

Our nights have gotten marginally better recently, but that's only because they were so shit - waking every hour and something twice an hour! Now we're usually looking at 5-6 wake ups, which are mostly a quick cuddle/feed. I usually have to sit up to feed though, as DD doesn't really find laying down to feed soothing and will thrash around until she wakes herself up fully. The act of getting laid back down is getting tricky now as DD is a big girl. Sometimes I wake her up in the process, which is a definite low point.

I can't really believe I am here at 9 bloody months. It feels shit.

@Harrysmummy246 - night nurse sounds amazing, do it!! I cannot wait until I am done with BF and can take night nurse again. I haven't been able to take it since I got pregnant with DS in 2015! Shock I hope you get some well-deserved rest. I can never sleep on the rare occasion that the opportunity arises. If DH gives me a lay-in for example. I feel under too much pressure to get some sleep and then just can't do it. So annoying!!

@bottomflannel (love the name!!) I too have similar thoughts about what life would be like if we had stopped at one child. Which sounds awful... and I love DD so much, so it makes me feel so guilty about these thoughts.

Solidarity ladies. It is only a phase and things WILL get better.

We're buying some (more) dummies today as I have convinced myself that is the answer. If only she would take one... Hmm

burritofan · 20/10/2019 09:16

Honestly I think it's my fault for fucking it all up
Nope, nope, no way! This might be my first rodeo but I know that's not true.

For instance, my daughter has a feed-to-sleep association in the night and is used to sleeping in close contact with me. But that's not because I fucked it up. It's because she would only go to sleep by feeding and touching me. I couldn't not fuck it up. If I'd tried to swaddle, dummy and Moses basket her, she wouldn't have slept, she'd have screamed. Therefore feed to sleep, therefore sleep association. Therefore the BABY fucked it up.

Basically what I'm trying to say in a sleep-deprived way is you can only parent the child you've got, and get them to sleep the way they need. I could no more have taught her to self-settle before the regression hit than I could teach her not to wake at 4am to practise Radio Baby Burrito – last night we had The Screeching Hour followed by The Cot Crawl Danceathon.

Firmly believe they're all different, their sleep patterns are all different – even bad sleepers are bad in different ways! – and everyone is doing the best they can. Even the baby.

Whuut That did make me laugh. DD won't take a dummy but I don't think it's the answer anyway; like OhHolyNightWakings she won't feed lying down, and thrashes herself awake to be picked up. She's not sucking in her sleep, she's a mystery cat a bellend difficult OK, fuck knows what she's up to.

OP posts:
Harrysmummy246 · 20/10/2019 09:39

I slept just knowing the night nurse was there (the takeaway g and t did the trick). Back with friends and their DTs for the morning having had to do a video call to wake Ds up! (8:45). He only woke once for daddy so that was a winner.

I need to go away more often!

bottomflannel · 20/10/2019 15:35

FUCKING NAP CONSPIRACY.

Whuut · 20/10/2019 15:56

I thinks someone snuck in and swapped babies last night. DS slept 4 and a half hours straight! I, of course, woke up every hour wondering what the hell was going on. He then took 2oz from a bottle, from his dad! THEN, napped for an hour and 10mins. Not sure what's going on but I like today.

I agree with @burritofan, you didn't fuck it all up, some babies just need more help/attention/comfort than others. Also, I know a dummy probably isn't the answer but I can't deal with the screaming in the car anymore, it's soul destroying.

bottomflannel · 20/10/2019 17:47

Wow, Whuut! Hope he keeps it up so you can get some sleep yourself. Nature is so cruel keeping you awake while baby sleeps.

I feel your pain re the car. It’s absolutely awful. We’re still trying with the dummy as well - he sort of holds it in his mouth for a few seconds and then pokes it out with his tongue. We’ve tried soooo many different brands, the closest we’ve got (I.e the only one he’ll entertain in his mouth at all) is the MAM ones. It’s a pain because I think he’d really like it if he gave it a proper go - he gets so miffed if he just wants to comfort suck and gets deluged with milk.

Had a lovely day today, DS1 had his best friend over to play this morning and my brother came for a visit this afternoon. Of course he is downstairs with DH and DS1 while I sit in the dark with DS2 while he power naps...

AliCanTea · 20/10/2019 18:14

“It’s a pain because I think he’d really like it if he gave it a proper go - he gets so miffed if he just wants to comfort suck and gets deluged with milk.” - this is exactly my DD!! She just turns dummies round and chews on the hard plastic bit...

burritofan · 20/10/2019 20:03

We got a video monitor! Since the cot is sidecarred thus DD could theoretically wake, silently, and crawl across the bed and straight into a pillow. She doesn't, she just goes straight to screaming. So I snuck out and had dinner alone with DP for the first time since she was born. Reclaiming my evenings since October 2019! We ate in silence, staring at the baby on the tiny screen. (Yes it's 8pm and yes she woke after 33 minutes so I'm back in a dark room, feeding.)

bottom The conspiracy follows me everywhere!

This week, though, I've realised that she really isn't going to go back to just dropping off in the sling, and the conspiracy will continue to wake her if she does. Our out-the-house naps are all 15-20 minutes now. Whereas once we're at home, which we always are in the afternoon really, she'll do a proper long nap, by means of sling, woolly hat yanked over eyes, and loud pink noise. Or two medium naps, one sling followed by boob.

So CONTRARY TO THE SPIRIT OF THE THREAD I am going to Take Charge and redirect the late afternoon long nap to be a lunchtime nap, by actually being at home instead of titting around eating cake and meandering bored around town. God I'm so close to being Gina Ford I can taste it.

OP posts:
Mariposa123 · 20/10/2019 20:36

We never managed dummies, she just spits them out and cries! We also have a massive sleeping association with feeding, she’s asleep on me right now after a feed, after a post bath meltdown.

I have realised though she’ll sleep happily in the pram and car seat, and when she’s fallen asleep there I can transfer her into the cot happily. However if she falls asleep on me she’ll wake immediately. Which doesn’t help nighttimes at all, but feels like a small step in the right direction

Whuut · 20/10/2019 21:17

@bottomflannel I hate the car. Its frustrating as it makes me not want to leave the house with him on my own. Most annoying thing is, he will fall asleep in the car and nap for a good 45mins but it takes between 5&30 mins of screaming first. So much yes to the dummy situation. DS gets so annoyed sometimes when he gets a mouthful of milk, but just wont actually suck a dummy. We too are trying the mam ones, I might try tommee tippee tho as that's the bottle he has taken to today.

@burritofan Yaaaayyy! So happy you got to eat dinner somewhere other than over DD's head. So good you can get long naps, I say do anything you have to to get them. You just reminded me, my step mum calls her book 'the contented little Hitler book' Grin

@Mariposa123 DS has only just started tolerating the pram but thankfully will usually nap in there now. We also sometimes have issues with being put down, luckily it seems to be easier to put him down at night, naps are a no go atm, unless straight into bouncer which has to be already bouncing, it's a skill I don't yet fully possess.

So after amazing me all day, we thought DP could try bedtime with a bottle. It went waaayyyy better than I imagined. DS took 2oz from bottle but got frustrated and started yelling so I went and fed to sleep. Still, a massive improvement. I think maybe it was too big of a step as he has only took to the bottle properly today. So happy, I feel having an evening to myself is in sight, somewhere in the not too distant future.

JohnLapsleyParlabane · 21/10/2019 06:03

We had a week of decent sleep. I felt human. I barely shouted at my 4yo. It has ended.
DS is teething soon painfully and not only can't be put down, can't feed lying down because of stupid teething snot. I have not lain down since 2pm yesterday afternoon. (DH does his share usually, but as DS needs to be in constant contact with my nipples, I've made him sleep so he can deal with 4yo-on-half-term-and crazy-with-it tomorrow today, ugh)
Is it just me or are babies reall badly designed?

Newtothecrew · 21/10/2019 07:30

What’s everyone naps schedule looking like - 10
Months old??
Hi everyone, looking for some advice. My DD is 10 months old. She has never been a great napper always just had 30-45mins which was fine when she was having several naps a day. Problem is trying to transition to two naps. She wakes so early at the moment - 5am (which is new) and as she only has such short naps her first nap could be over by 830 leaving a very long stretch to her afternoon nap. She often falls asleep at 1230 and will have a good hour here but still meaning she has from 130 til bedtime which is 630-7.
This gap is probably too long which is causing overtiredness and early morning waking as well as lots of overnight waking.
Any ideas please as I’d really like to get it right for her so that she’s well rested.
Thank you
In advance.

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