Mumsnet encouraging brigading by Twitter TRAs

[TerfinUSA]

Apparently Mumsnet now takes 'reports' by Twitter.

twitter.com/MumsnetTowers/status/991593570955153408

May I ask why? It seems normal that threads should be flagged on site, and that Twitter isn't an appropriate mechanism for this.

Moreover a purpose-built Twitter TRA account, one of hundreds on Twitter set up specifically to harass and silence gender-critical feminists is being actively engaged with, even as it publicly defames Mumsnet on Twitter

twitter.com/MumsnetTowers/status/991683672356028417

The TRA modus operandi on Twitter is to mass-report feminist accounts until they are blocked and banned, and dozens have been silences in this fashion, now it seems Mumsnet, is voluntarily submitting to TRA oversight.

A thread from November about an article from 'Shon Faye' on transgender access to women's refuges has been deleted based on this Tweet:

twitter.com/youngvulgarian/status/991328378178473985

The basis for deletion appears to have been 'misgendering'. It seems to me that it is rendered impossible to have a discussion on protecting single sex spaces if you are forced to use 'preferred pronouns' instead of ones that reflect biological reality. It is rather hard to understand the worldview whereby the feelings of the likes of Shon Faye asserting the right to enter a single sex space is prioritised over actual domestic abuse and rape victims. Especially on a which from its name 'Mumsnet' clearly has some basis in female biology!

Moreover, it seems reports are being received on the basis of 'Shon's feelings might be hurt', but it doesn't seem these same standards are applied to people who are not TRAs.

Any given thread about anyone, be they Jamie Oliver, Chris Evans, whoever, is likely to have people being slightly rude, but it seems that Mumsnet is inviting TRAs to brigade the site to enforce trans ideology ('misgendering', etc.) and render women voiceless the same way they have done on Twitter.

Already TRAs are circling demanding bans of posters for not being 100% on-board with trans ideology, they will not rest until this place is indistinguishable from a NUS conference.

twitter.com/MumsnetTowers/status/991707542752583681

Sending so many PMs today. Sorry, any creepy people who may be spying on user accounts, all you're going to see is links to Reddit.

MNHQ you must have lost your minds! Please listen to everyone on this thread, people who care about the site and have been loyal members.

@AngryAttackKittens Me too please. I'll follow if you go.

Don't go, AngryAttackKittens! Stay! It will annoy Shon Faye more.

(But PM me too - maybe we need more than one space to talk about this).

Mumsnet is being very badly advised at the moment.

Take a few days. @JustineMumsnet

Shocked by MNHQs attitude here.

I think it is veering towards insanity to bow to the Twitter nonsense, and allow reports from Twitter - stupidest idea I ever heard. Have you seen some of the accounts you're taking orders from - and then deleting your users here on their say-so? You know, your users that you supposedly value and listen to - those same ones Justine promised a voice to in the Times article?

I'd like you know that one of my posts has been screenshot and put on Twitter today.

I'd also like you to know that because of your ex-intern putting user's IP addresses up on Twitter a week ago, and potentially doxxing users, that I do not feel completely safe anymore. At home, with my children, I do not feel completely safe now.

You are capitulating to the WORST kind of bullies.

I do think that misgendering, on purpose , when the person concerned may have a GRC, is a bit mean minded. I'm not sure if it is illegal; perhaps someone can tell us? If they havn't got a GRC, it just seems mean-minded.Watching this sort of thing from afar, but having reason to know a bit about this stuff, I feel that both sides are being pretty unpleasant to each other. Possibly claiming that " they started it", in " playground style". Wouldn't it be possible for both sides to make the points without adopting a bullying, deliberately aggressive tone?

I'd just like to say, I didn't misgender anyone - my post was about child protection and the methods the (modern, updated) PIE are using to making child sexual abuse normalised and legitimised.

That's why I'm so fucking furious. Posts (not just mine) about child safeguarding were deleted from a parenting website ffs. Where the hell are we supposed to talk about this - if not here?

Do you think death threats and doxxing are a reasonable and proportionate response to "misgendering"? Because if not then this oh well both sides have been unkind thing is a bit ridiculous.

Misgendering on MN cannot be compared to the deep-seated, scary and frankly all too familiar hate for women happening on Twitter right now.

It scares the shit out of us that this sort of hate is being promoted and celebrated as pro-LGBT rights.

The same women who fought for the LGBT movement are now seen as bigots, transphobes and even (stupidly) Nazis for rightfully saying 'What the fuck'?

Oh, and as far as I can see it has become the GBT movement because no one seems to give a fuck about lesbians except to demand that men can decide to be one.

Such progress!

"I do think that misgendering, on purpose , when the person concerned may have a GRC, is a bit mean minded. I'm not sure if it is illegal; "

There's no law requiring members of the public to follow a GRC, no. GRCs are private documents used for official purposes, they aren't used to police speech.

"Wouldn't it be possible for both sides to make the points without adopting a bullying, deliberately aggressive tone?"

Both sides? How would that even work?

Shon is now 'pregnancy shaming' women who dare to call out and telling them to take up 'basket weaving or yoga'.

But apparently we are supposed to indulge pronoun preferences.

@JustineMumsnet. I spent days sticking up for MN on Twitter. It lead to threats of harm (thankfully no death threats) and a temp banning following targeted reporting. The first thing I did when unbanned today was report the MumsnetT account for targeted harassment. That has led to a shadow-ban.

I didn't regret any of it, until I discovered you are inviting reports from Twitter from TRAs who aren't even members.

You perma-banned a much loved regular poster after they posted something you didn't like on a different forum. How does that jibe with this new policy? Why are you letting them in like this?

@Datun has given you a great statement above. Please consider it. We don't want to lose MN. I have kept away from Reddit as I felt my loyalty was to MN, I'm not sure how I feel now.

(Fuck, this is like #LabourLosingWomen all over again...)

Uuf, what a disaster.

If you do have any suggestions of where else to go AngryAttackKittens I would also be interested, please.

I too have been defending mumsnet on twitter. MNHQ, you absolute idiots, you have been warned time and time again by people here that giving them an inch they will take a mile. They will threaten, harass and bully you until you shut down a very active part of your site and guess what, by inviting reports through twitter you have just opened the floodgates.

They will post themselves, screenshot it and plaster it all over the internet, report it, you will delete but the damage is done. You can't go back and say oh it was a new poster because guess what, by that time no on will care. They are destroying your brand and you are actively helping them.

Forum moderation by twitter?
Look it was bad enough hiring an intern who put posters at risk. I’m slightly boggled by the rationale that sending an open invite to every TRA in the cyber sphere to moderate your forum. And then bending over backwards to appease them whilst they laugh their fucking bollocks off at you.
What an absolute fucking shit show.
When I saw the open invite to all the twitterati I assumed some silly intern had been let loose with the sm. I mean, Jeffrey was a Low point (and I speak as someone who was outed and had to spend two days changing every password I had because it was splashed over tinternet with my email address) but allowing the frothers in to dictate the parameters of your forum?
Fuck that noise. I’d be battening the damned hatches, not laying out the welcome mat and washing their feet in case they got sullied when they stamped all over us.
Grow a pair, for goodness sake.

Can mnhq define what they consider transphobia? Please dont allow this website to be bullied into silencing women and shutting down the debate just when more women are speaking out. I dont want my daughters to grow up a society where men can rape and this be hidden in statistics of women, or that she can no longer feel comfortable in a female changing rooms because outwardly appearing men are also present, or that ahe cannot ask for a female hcp and be guarenteed that she will get to be treated by a hcp.......

For everyone asking about the other possible space, not sure if it's OK to link to another site directly here, so, a link can be found on page 3 of these comments.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3238869-Hi-Mumsnet-if-you-are-asking-feminist-women-to-consider-whether-Mumsnet-is-for-them-please-be-clear-that-the-space-we-made-here-is-for-all-of-us?pg=3

Thanks, Angry.

Let's just hope it isn't necessary to relocate.

Don't leave me behind if you find somewhere else. We're like hunted creatures aren't we? This is what male violence does to women - if organisations and political parties collude with it.

@MNHQ: you were incredibly foolish to invite a Twitter mob to monitor your posters

This is a site that is aimed primarily at women
You should not invite an online army of aggressive men to censor them, to publicly hound individual MN posters

In protecting your bottom line, do not sacrifice the wellbeing of women

Making concessions to men who bully women, just encourages them to bully even more

This is fucking outrageous. Just that.

If MNHQ allow this we might as well start wearing a TERF target on our clothes. How far are you willing to go in this MNHQ?!

Your members are on the whole a bunch of well educated women with very valid arguments as to why we need this space to discuss the attack on womanhood in general by a load of bully boys who feel that wearing pink is very much a real characteristic of being a woman and we should therefore call them Shirley instead of Seamus.

By the way, I firmly believe I was born in the wrong household. I have the brain of a Royal and therefore am one. I will report any old fucker who refuses to refer to me as Princess Consuela Banana Hammock. I am knocking on the doors of Buck House this PM to demand entry and residence since, well you know, I think I am a Royal and therefore I am one.

Fuck this shit.

(Points up) Are you OK with seeing women feel like that, MNHQ? Isn't that a pretty clear indication that making the hunting easier by allowing TRAs to paint a big target on each person virtual arse on Twitter is a terrible idea?

You perma-banned a much loved regular poster after they posted something you didn't like on a different forum.

Oh yes I'd quite forgotten that

This policing of comments on other forums is a bit weird

Did anyone think that through or was it one of those awesome brainstorming ideas that don't work in real life

for the tightrope walkers at MNHQ, i think you're gonna need it

After the intern incident and now this I feel like MNHQ are signalling their position on this.
And it's not with free speech for women on FWR, despite what Justine said.
Actions Vs words.