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Secondary education

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I feel so angry reading 'Everyone's Invited' website about rape culture largely at private schools

232 replies

Bouledeneige · 26/03/2021 00:02

So I read the Dulwich College post and now the allegations about Highgate School on Newsnight. There are fulsome letters to both schools governors published online. They make for heartbreaking and stomach churning reading. I am so angry. I've just read the 'Everyone's invited' website and I can see how entrenched misogyny, rape culture, slut shaming, homophobia and racism are in the named school. - mostly private but a few selective.

And underling them all is a powerful suggestion that school leadership is all about 'boys will be boys', reputation management and 'there's two sides to every story'. So traumatised female students are forced into silence and reduced to walking the corridors with their abusers with lots of mockery and slutt shaming accompanying them. Its so disgusting - it is beyond anything that can be excused. Who on earth wants our sons to be recruited into this misogynistic and coercive rape culture or our daughters abused and living in fear of it?

I've stated my views on other threads. My kids went to a not so perfect state school in London. The big difference to these accounts is that they experienced a very 'woke' and 'right on' school culture that demonstrated a zero tolerance culture and empowerment of the female students. They were so empowered they actively and powerfully called out sexist, racist and homophobic behaviours and the perpetrators - boys - were called to account formally and informally. It was not a perfect school at all - there was drugs, sexual behaviour and bullying but the culture of the school was so zero tolerance it went beyond a few PHSE chats it was inculcated in the ethos of the whole school. the predominant culture was mature female and diverse voices,, backed by teachers and the leadership of the school articulating a mature and equitable world. To be fair I think the boys followed behind.

But I'm not focused on my DC's experiences. I'm absolutely choked that the Harvey Weinstein, rape assertive power dynamic is prospering in school environments. Its disgusting. I hope there is a root and branch review and parents start asking about the character that private and selective schools engender |not just the results. There's an old adage that a[rents of boys would prefer them to be civilised by being schooled alongside their female contemporaries but that girls do better in all female environments.

It is such a joke when we talk about equality in work environments when so many women have been exposed to these brutish rapey school environments. We will never change society if we don't change education. And we have to more actively prepare our young men for decent and egalitarian behaviour to women and our young women to be empowered to be empowered and seek retribution. But in the end it will be leadership in schools that have a primarily male culture that makes the biggest difference investigating and punishing out sexist and abusive behaviour and treating perpetrators in the same way as students accused of drugs offences. And secondly, peer pressure amongst young men at parties, on school buses and in classes that really calls out bad behaviour.- this is not who we are as men. It really, really matters. And parents can't leave it to someone else. They need to actively avoid school environments with toxic cultures and probe how they exert a zero tolerance egalitarian culture. Take action, remove your money and change the economy of private schooling.

OP posts:
closertonydanza · 26/03/2021 00:32

You are very naive to think this is just a private school issue.

Dustyboots · 26/03/2021 00:39

A few thoughts: These entitled, misogynistic men end up leading our country - particularly if a certain party is in charge.

My kids are at state schools. Misogynistic behaviour is present there too amongst some kids but not all. The greater variety of backgrounds and culture etc waters it down. Plus as you say OP, there’s an ethos and culture of zero tolerance.

I went to a private school a long time ago before the internet. It was a girls’ school but I couldn’t stand any of the arrogant sexist boys from the neighbouring boys’ schools. I’ve made it a goal through life to avoid these types. These boys/ men must be a hundred times worse now with free access to porn.

I wonder if private schools are worse with this rape culture because parents are more absent and expect the school to parent (as well as educate) their offspring?

alexdgr8 · 26/03/2021 00:39

most of these private schools were all male until recently.
some converted from boarding plus day boys to boys and girls day only.
guess it was easier bucks, not having to engage housemasters etc and all the extra welfare issues, akin to child-minding.
but perhaps they have not moved on with true equality attitudes.

DeRigueurMortis · 26/03/2021 01:00

@closertonydanza

You are very naive to think this is just a private school issue.

I don't think the OP suggested it was just a private school issue, rather she was dismayed as the allegations coming to light re: behaviour/attitudes of male students in single sex public schools.

Frankly I'm not surprised.

Every single boy/man I've ever known (with one exception who had 3 sisters who would take no crap) whose been through single sex public school education has "issues" with women - ranging through from "fear" to "sex object" and "misogynistic contempt".

Why does anyone deny the reality that so many academic studies show that boys perform better in mixed sex schools and girls in single sex?

We only have to look at our Prime Minister as a classic "output" of such an educational system.

I'm not knocking public schools in general but I absolutely can't understand why on earth anyone would send their son to a single sex public school....well apart from the connections, the "glamour" of a "famous" public school education, basking in the glory you can afford it, the privilege it buys your children etc etc

Literallynoidea · 26/03/2021 07:37

This isn't just a private school issue

AuntieStella · 26/03/2021 07:47

This isn't just a private school issue

The press have seized on the better known 'names' amongst the private school, but you will see scores of accounts from all types of schools, from universities (with/without previous school,being mentioned) and ones where establishment is not specified, plus some unconnected with schools/unis at all.

It's really important this does not become hijacked into a 'bash private schools' issue and instead be recognised for what it is - pervasive toxic masculinity which can crop up anywhere.

Because the question that needs answering is how should we as a society socialise out Yong men better?

Loads of us are getting this right, and producing normal unexceptionally behaved young people, who arent overlyy influenced by shitty peers.

But the problem exists in every school (possibly not consistently) and may well be having an impact on all our DDs. Not just those in the private schools.

There have been quite a few threads on this already - had you spotted them?

PreparationPreparationPrep · 26/03/2021 07:55

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

AuntieStella · 26/03/2021 07:56

I don't think the OP suggested it was just a private school issue, rather she was dismayed as the allegations coming to light re: behaviour/attitudes of male students in single sex public schools

Only two or three of the schools mentioned in the press were boys schools. OP says 'largely' at private schools.

Those descriptions are contradicted if you look at the accounts on the source website. The problem is not greater in single sex (the opposite) and is s impossible to call on state v private (as so many accounts do not specify establishment)

The two commonest places for insult/assault are in classrooms/moving round schools/on school transport and at parties.

The 'party set' is a phenomenon that might bear further examination - it doesn't just mean going no to parties and being sociable - it's a particular party hard subset - lots of drink and other substances and no parental supervision.

cryh · 26/03/2021 07:59

Having attended both private and state schools the culture difference is enormous IMO.

oneglassandpuzzled · 26/03/2021 08:00

My son went to a single-sex private school and Is no misogynist. He would have short shrift at home from me and his sister and father.

Poorlykitten · 26/03/2021 08:04

This doesn’t surprise me. Single sex schools are an idiotic idea, my brother attended one and is totally incapable of talking to women plus he is a huge misogynist who try’s to cover it up, badly.

AuntieStella · 26/03/2021 08:05

Having attended both private and state schools the culture difference is enormous IMO

But not all aspects of cultural difference will be relevant to this issue that is woefully present across both sectoss and worse - according to the number of accounts on Everyone's Invited' in coed schools.

It would be a massive disservice to the majority of girls if the 'othering' of this pervasive issues made or perceived wrongly to be predominantly one of certain private schools only.

The girls coming forwards from state schools matter just as much.

Hazelnutlatteplease · 26/03/2021 08:07

It doesn't surprise me. If the boy is intelligent or rich enough the school needs them more than they need the school.

AuntieStella · 26/03/2021 08:07

The website's here

www.everyonesinvited.uk

Do look behind just page 1 of the testimonies to get the fuller picture

Pinchoftums · 26/03/2021 08:07

I used to hang out with boys from private and state school. I have to say the attitudes and entitlement if the private school boys was shocking. No all of them, lots of nice lads but about half were terrible and treated girls like sex objects with lots of slut shaming.

cryh · 26/03/2021 08:08

@AuntieStella

Having attended both private and state schools the culture difference is enormous IMO

But not all aspects of cultural difference will be relevant to this issue that is woefully present across both sectoss and worse - according to the number of accounts on Everyone's Invited' in coed schools.

It would be a massive disservice to the majority of girls if the 'othering' of this pervasive issues made or perceived wrongly to be predominantly one of certain private schools only.

The girls coming forwards from state schools matter just as much.

I didn't say that, I just said the culture is vastly different. Businesses protect their reputations.
IrishGirl2020 · 26/03/2021 08:13

These reports don’t just relate to single sex schools though - Highgate and Latymer (both mentioned on the website) are mixed schools.
As another poster mentioned it seems to be more to do with the so-called ‘party set’ and not much to do with the particular school

AuntieStella · 26/03/2021 08:20

I didn't say that, I just said the culture is vastly different. Businesses protect their reputations

I'm not sure I understand the point. What about all the state schools listed?

They're the establishments who are not getting their fair share of the reaction to this. Does it mean that they are even more effective, eg diversionary tactics?

If this issue becomes divide and rule/demonise only some perpetrators and don't even mention the others; then all girls lose out

Franksalot · 26/03/2021 08:22

I went to a private school, years ago before the internet. We were told many times by teachers how lucky and special we were to go to such a good school. I found that the girls were quite self-depreciating about their privilege. However, many of the boys were known to be very arrogant in their attitude, and very confident in themselves. I wasn't aware of there being much sexual harassment, but as it is so widespread today everywhere I am sure that there are some environments where it can fester more than others.

DarlingOscar · 26/03/2021 08:24

This is a very naive take on the whole thing. This is an issue that affects every kid at every school. The fact that this one website has attracted comments from a small range of (largely) London Boys Independent schools does not mean that the issue is somehow magically restricted to those schools.

HTH

dcb2 · 26/03/2021 08:58

I wonder if private schools are worse with this rape culture because parents are more absent and expect the school to parent (as well as educate) their offspring?

I suspect that many of us private school parents would take issue with this statement. My two sons go to a single sex private school (also in Greater London) and I disagree that rape culture is endemic at most private schools or covered up by the school.

I've read some sweeping and fairly offensive generalisations about private school kids on MN over the last year - I think there'd be outrage if private school parents made equivalent comments about kids at state schools. And rightly so, it's inappropriate and unnecessary.

The allegations made should absolutely be investigated. It's dreadful to hear about the experiences of the girls. But this shouldn't be made into a private v state thing; it can happen in any school.

Lindseylovescake · 26/03/2021 09:35

The private school bashing on MN, regarding this issue, is frankly ridiculous.

If anyone posting thinks that this is limited to private schools, then they are seriously mistaken. It is a cross society issue, fuelled through a mixture of terrible parenting, unhealthy social pressures amongst peers and the internet - whether that be social media, celebrity "role models" (most a bunch of w*ers) and easy assess to explicit material such as porn. There is also a role for decent, more efective (in school) education around all of these issues, but fundamentally parenting starts at home).

As the adults right here, right now, we all have to lead the charge on this to bring about change so that; (A) the historic issues are investigated properly and appropriate action brought about, (B) support is available to victims should they want it and most importably (C) we have a plan to bring about fundamental change in the way young people are brought up - so they have all the tools they need to become decent people and call out/fend off the s**te that exists, in the majority, online.

A constant bashing of 'private schools' is just wasting our time and energy, whilst scapegoating and missing the big picture.

Why don't we try discussing, in forum, what we actually do now, pooling some decent ideas, instead of bringing up the same old blah blah blah on here. We're all "disgusted", "offended", "heart broken", but a constant repetition of those words and re-hashing the same old "bashing" to make ourselves feel better, as women, fundamentally doesn't gets anything done.

Notmynom · 26/03/2021 09:46

Agree @Lindseylovescake. This is everywhere

What message are we sending to the girls who've added testimonies to the everyone's invited page about abuse by boys from state schools (the 3 nearest us are all mentioned). Do they matter less because their abusers weren't 'privileged' enough for it to make the newspapers?

Dillydaffy · 26/03/2021 09:52

State schools under local authority control have to deal much more seriously with these allegations than fee paying schools do hence the fact that some of these schools were able to push allegations under carpet. Just can’t happen in state schools - once they are reported the process is completely transparent, pupils put in isolation units whilst enquiry happens and police contacted. Time for ofstead to scrutinise fee paying sector.

alongtimeagoin2019 · 26/03/2021 10:05

@Dillydaffy

State schools under local authority control have to deal much more seriously with these allegations than fee paying schools do hence the fact that some of these schools were able to push allegations under carpet. Just can’t happen in state schools - once they are reported the process is completely transparent, pupils put in isolation units whilst enquiry happens and police contacted. Time for ofstead to scrutinise fee paying sector.
Do they have to deal with things that happen outside at school- at parties etc?
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