Not allowed to talk at meal times.

[Toto531]

Something that's occuring recently in my relationship is beginning to upset me. My partner of 5 years won't speak to me at meal times. When we first met, we always used to laugh and chat at meal times. But recently, whenever I try to talk to him, he tells me he's eating and not to talk. Which really upsets me. My partner works 7 days a week (farmer) and I'm left at home all day long to look after our 2 toddlers (apart from when i work, 3 days a week), so I desperately need adult conversation by the night time! I get he's been working all day so probably wants to switch off but I just hate the way I'm dismissed and told to be quiet. Meal times are a social time for me where the family should be able to chat about their day etc. And I know that he used to be able to do it so I'm not sure why it's a problem for him now. Communication in general has become quite difficult over the last couple of years. I don't have any support with the children and sometimes it gets a bit much, if I try to tell him this, he dismisses me and won't discuss it and I'll either have to continue suffering in silence or just figure out solutions by myself. I don't know how to approach the situation as if I try to say how I'm feeling, he gets very defensive and speaks to me in an angry tone and it just ends in an argument and we get no where. I really don't feel like I can carry on like this as it's making me unhappy. I've no idea how to sort things out but I really want to try and make things better.

Get your kids into a routine. They are staying up way too late and this will then inevitably impact on everything. Once your kids are in a routine (bed by 7pm) reassess your situation with DH. It's really not ok for him to silence you but you both might feel differently once there is more adult space in the evening.

Getting the kids to sleep early might mean they don't get to see their dad in the evenings but many working parents get home late past kids bedtimes. Their routines shouldn't be affected by parents work schedules.

It really important for their growing brains and parents need downtime without them around.

Was also thinking the same. Are you the poster whose in-laws live next door and are abusive towards you too?

The news has been full of the challenges to the farming industry in recent months. The costs, the weather, the Labour Govt’s about-face on supporting farmers, the stopping and changing of various support schemes out of the blue, the loss of a close trading market following Brexit. All of these are mounting and weigh heavily day in, day out, 7 days a week, and the lack of income is very scary if that’s your only money source to support a business and a family, and it’s diminishing. Not forgetting the long-term planning about how to afford IHT on a farm business member’s death.

Then work on your own with your spiralling lthoughts, and going home to a fraught house with a knackered other half, fractious kids, your’re hungry and tired and your blood sugar’s low and they want to chat…. You get the picture.

Good behaviour, respect and kindness isn’t too much to ask though, and that has to work both ways. I’m going to be a bit harsh though, and say the farming lifestyle isn’t an easy one to lead, and is as lonely, isolated and worrying to be at home as the farming ‘Other half’ with the prime responsibility for the children.

And this is it for as many years as you can do. The only way to survive, if you choose to stay there, is to find your own life and network locally for you and the children, and be prepared to be the team leader at home. He’ll dip in and out, but that’s as good as it will be. Farming life is a peculiar one, unlike any other, there’s no HR department to take care of behaviours and standards, it’s how you muddle through it - or not.

i know these because that’s the life I’ve led. But you do need local support, which it doesn’t sound like you have a lot of. Plus setting your own boundaries - which is very reasonable to do. Unfortunately it sounds as though his Mum was a bit of a dogsbody feeding and caring for ‘the menfolk’ long after they really needed that. Kind, but it creates a rod for the next woman’s back! I survived through making some great friendships (which took a while) with other women who were to all intents ‘single parents’ as their OH’s were away working so much.

My MIL always used to say “the farm comes first” - what a load of sh*t - and a terrible message for families. Life comes first, no need to sacrifice all for a job. Sadly a common view amongst the older generation, and very destructive in my view.

Please decide for yourself if you can face the battle of boundary setting to reset his behaviours to those he used to have, or whether for your own welfare and happiness, even though scary, you need to start afresh elsewhere. I wish you luck, it’s a real dilemma. Please ask your GP to point you towards counselling, or look into other support groups in your area. You aren’t alone. 💐

He’s out working in all weathers, and the farmers mum knew definitely didn’t have wives who worked away from the farm- and they cooked for the family.

( Plus looked after the smaller animals) or did B&B for holidays,

”Farmer’s Wives” would definitely have cooked for their husbands, as they don’t have time to cook.

It seemed a very traditional life.
Not marrying and having kids is probably risky as legally might not be as protected as a married woman.

Sounds like he’s angry ( not talking)
There is a lot of mental health issues on farms - loneliness &c -

It’s not a romantic role.

I agree, meal times around the table is a time for a family to come together and talk. I hope you have help with this, it doesn't sound a nice homely environment and perhaps as your little ones grow not a nice atmosphere that they will pick up on.

Your parents are wise indeed. You are fortunate in the fact that you have a house to go to. Please go now before your kids settle in school. You really dont have to put up with being miserable. Let him sort himself out....

It's all very one sided here isn't it?

Couples need time alone to talk too.
Not with tiny kids around till they all go to bed at 10 or 11pm.

OP- why don't you give your kids their dinner earlier, get them to bed, and see how he behaves when it's just you and him? Because from what you say it's never just you and him.

If you want your relationship to improve, you've got to create the environment for that. The first thing is space- for you as a couple.

You call him your partner- are you married? Because that could be a huge issue in terms of finances if you divorce and his equity is in the farm.

I'd tell him you need adult conversation so leave him with the kids, go out and find some adult company elsewhere. Fuck him, frankly.

Yes, and I would ignore his phone calls about what’s for dinner. And when he asks why I didn’t answer, I’d tell him exactly why. You need to talk to me at mealtimes like a normal person or I will ignore your phone calls and there will be no meal for you.

Stop letting him walk all over you.

There’s too little information here to call it abusive. Traditional gender roles are still very entrenched in farming families so he wouldn’t be expecting to cook, clean or do childcare. He works long hours 7 days a week in a hugely pressured industry and doesn’t take holidays. Given farming is famous for its high rate of suicide and mental health problems, perhaps we shouldn’t jump straight to him being abusive.

Get the toddlers in bed before 10pm and they could chat each other.

Probably he gets starving out in the cold and wet doing a physical job- Probably Dinner is the high point of his day.

Men who work physically burn masses of calories especially in cold weather.

Today for example - sluicing rain, cold wind, flooded roads and the only people out were Farmers and horse/dog people

If one takes on the role of Farmer’s Wife the expectation of hot food on the table is probably high on the list of things to do.

Farmers work insane hours- and it does seem very traditional way of life still.

It’s not like an office worker who sits at a desk in the warm all day- he could probably get by with a microwave meal flung on a plate when he gets home at 6 .

There is a lot more going here than someone needing a holiday.

OP, I wouldn’t be able to stay in a relationship if someone treated me like this. I hope you a get the courage to do something about it.

He's been a farmer for a lot more than the five years he's been with OP for and would chat to OP at the start. Now he won't talk to her, after the kids are here.

Absolutely this.
Mum knows a Daughter of a Farming family- the son stayed on the Farm, but the daughter trained in another profession and moved away.

When her parents grew older and died, the son ended his life.
He hadn’t told his sister he was feeling so low.
Being on his own was just too much.

Farming seems a really hard life.

So it must be abuse? It’s more likely to be a deterioration of his mental health. Possibly caused in part by not getting any downtime with kids running around until he goes to bed. No wonder he just wants some bloody peace and quiet while he eats.

He sounds absolutely horrible, OP. This relationship is a one way road to misery. You have one life. Don’t throw it away on this.

I agree- get the kids to bed early, plenty of families have two mealtimes - Kid’s tea then they go to bed and the adults eat together later.

My DH was like this about plans. He's not abusive though at times his behaviour might appear to be from outside. He's autistic, and terrified of change. (Not saying this is your issue, just explaining wh`y I am still with him). I decided, after years of disappointment and feeling my life was on hold, that I would just do things. If I wanted a family outing, I planned one, explained that's what I'd done and he could come along or not.

Very gently start to regain control of your life, your opinions, your right to exist and be different from him. Without sounding accusing or starting a row, learn the art of stating very gently and calmly what you need and why you will have it. I started to say things like: Every time I ask your opinion about a plan you say 'We'll see' and that means we don't end up doing things. I don't want to feel sad and bitter about missing out on life so I have cleared next Saturday for a trip to the seaside with the kids. We'd love you to join us if you want to but you don't have to.

If he is just knackered and overwhelmed by life or depressed he may not come but won't stop you. If he is abusive, he will find a way to stop you from going, as a means of controlling you. If that happens, I'd make plans to leave with the children and give him no warning at all, because he won't get any nicer.

If he doesn't seem abusive, try and remind him what fun you had chatting away and laughing together over dinnertime, say you miss his company and you think both of you could do with a bit more laughter in your lives.

He may be depressed or stressed. But that doesn't give him the right to control your behaviour and your happiness.

@Toto531 did he want kids? Were they both planned? ( as they are very close in age to each other? Does he take any joy in seeing them, does he even have any time for them if he works 7/7? I couldn’t imagine being with someone for only 5 years and already having a 3 and 2 year old, I wonder how well you knew each other before the first child arrived?

Why is this? If you eat too quickly you get indigestion so it doesn't seem healthy to be concentrating on getting as much food down as possible.

Millions of people, all over the world, talk at mealtimes. That's partly what they're about. Probably only in silent religious orders is this not the case. It doesn't really help to claim that this is in any way normal, particularly the controlling aspect.

How about a wee holiday to your own place with the kids. Tell him you don't know how long you'll be gone but you'd like someone to talk to so you're going away for a while. If he protests, he either cares or is just concerned about who's making his tea. You can't keep living like this. It's emotional abuse my friend.

But none of that excuses his rudeness.

I have a horrible feeling reading this. I think you should be making your plans and leaving him asap. I wouldn't tell him anything. See a solicitor about what you can and can't do but I wouldn't have him in your property and I would not be going back to his property alone or allowing the children to. He sounds quite sinister and controlling and ready to react.