Clare's law request

[olivietolivie]

Has anybody ever done a Clare's law request, been invited to a police station for disclosure and it not be a deal breaker? I've got an appointment next week and it just feels strange continuing to be 'normal' around the guy when I imagine it's all going to end next week. Or is it? Would appreciate some views as I feel a bit muddled.

You ask why they do this and why pretend to be nice - I'm never sure that most folk 'pretend' to be nice with a view to being horrible later . First the early days of dating everyone nearly is on 'best behaviour' as normally we are when meeting anyone new, it's fairly natural. Also early days of dating are fun and make you happy and it's easy to overlook things that aren't perfect for you as on the whole life is good now. However, over time both of these fade and your own normal behaviour arises and irritating stuff starts to be potentially an issue (for some it may be irritating their boy/girlfriend goes out with their mates or similar) - them abuse is an abusive person's natural response, maybe due to background, preferred inclination etc but I suspect that actually at first most are happy and thinking yeah I can be a good person in that relationship - until they can't. Everyone will also rationalise their actions including abusive people - it's easier to tell yourself your partner was irrational or crazy than look in a mirror and know you need work.
I found the thoughts not emotions explanation really good above.
I actually don't think your fella is just pretending and biding his time until he's got you exactly but I think it very likely you'll find his ex wasn't making rubbish up.
I think it would be nicer for everyone to leave it now whilst some nice memories remain and for you not to be now 'waiting' almost for any sign - it would be anxiety inducing and I feel you're kinda likely to be overthinking and blaming yourself if stuff did happen.

What was the nature of filming friends? Was it in an indecent way? Or was it something else? Deleting documents off a pc, again worrying but you need a bit more context. Overall I'd say if you do decide to still see him, I absolutely wouldn't introduce my child to him until much much further down the line. Also for yourself, try to be safe, any sniff of a sign of aggression/jealousy etc, run for it!

‘I have read that back and i would be yelling at someone in my shoes to run a mile but he volunteered the information about his ex and says the abuse was the other way around.’

You say you felt pressured by the thread. Read your own posts back and take your own advice.

You’ve barely known him a couple of months.
You have had a few dates and spent one evening at his house. It’s nothing to be attached to is it?

You might miss the attention on your phone for a couple of days but your future self will be relieved you ended it.

I work in the police, I promise you that they’ve given you this disclosure for a reason. They can’t tell you what to do. That’s your decision. Just because he hasn’t been arrested it doesn’t mean he’s not bad news.

It’s a warning of who you’re getting involved with. But I strongly advise you walk away. It never starts bad in relationships… they show their colours eventually, just depends when.

Good luck.

Ah, that's interesting - I focussed on OP's posts only so didn't see that.

As I said in my post, I would still walk away if I were in OPs shoes.

When I met my DH there was no such this as Clare's Law, so this is all new to me. I will definitely be mentioning it to friends that meet new partners.

OP, please please read between the lines here I am begging you. There is a reason why she decided to disclose ANYTHING to you! With Claire’s Law requests, even if there’s a massive criminal record for other non-violent crimes, if theres nothing that they think could bring you to harm, they don’t and CANNOT disclose any of it to you. However this Officer did disclose it (or whoever did it). If they thought he was of no risk then they wouldn’t have shared anything at all but again, they did! They just can’t give you anymore details. Think about it this way, there’s a reason this was brought to the attention of the police in the first place. False allegations usually have an element of truth to them!!

He is not the only man out there! As a mother you (& I too, along with every other single parent) owe it to our children to pick the best we can find. Is he really the best you can find??? Someone who has a history of volatile relationships?

Let’s imagine you waited 10 years to introduce your child to him, they’re still going to meet eventually, if it’s when your child is an adult. They still need to be a decent enough person to be around them at any age and from you’ve told me, speaking objectively, I’d be running for the hills and believe me I’m not one of those people who ends relationships at the tiniest little niggle. People have differences & flaws and long marriages stem from making an effort to take the rough with the smooth. This is different though, this sounds like a guy who is combative and controlling. Could be false, could be true but it’s a game of Russian roulette and it’s just not worth that massive risk when a child is involved, at any stage, imo

I’m sorry you feel pressure, I think it’s because the thread is nearly unanimous, which is rare and tells you something.

The other thing is, and I say this very gently, the fact you would even consider continuing with this, when you have a child, and when it’s such a new relationship, potentially says that you might have underlying feelings about yourself that make you vulnerable to a situation like this. I genuinely, genuinely mean this in a kind way. But I think it’s something to think about carefully. Men like this are so clever and choose women for a reason. It’s not a flaw in you, but it can be a pattern if you’re not careful.

I think the other thing is too, would you want your child to take a risk like this in future relationships? If the answer is no, then I think you need to treat yourself a little better also.

Maybe against the grain, but personal I think thats a relief.

aside from where the victim decides to not pursue, where there is no evidence I firmly believe there should be by disclosure.

i don’t know through first hand experience but a friend of mine had a vindictive now ex file a police report.

he got dragged through it for nearly 6 months of silence before no action was taken despite having cctv proof she was lying. She stole his phone (visible in find my iPhone at her house with screen shots) and smashed possessions. She was eventually told by police to never contact him again but did for months after they broke up finally.

many times he was warned to avoid this lady by friends, and believe it or not, even her ex husband tracked him down to warn him as he had the same experience.

so, it doesn’t mean he’s not a wrong un, but I don’t think this discloser actually gives you a shred of insight unfortunately.

It gives a ‘list’ of warning signs.

The police officer told OP that now she (OP) knows what signs to look out for.

That's tantamount to saying "we know what's wrong with this man, these are the likely signs he will display to you, you need to remain alert at all times."

So should OP carry on seeing him, and simply remind herself every now and again that if she catches him with a camera or taking an interest in her laptop that these might be signs that there's something wrong with him?

And should she have a 1:1 conversation with him about why filming people and snooping through private data is inappropriate?

And should she ignore any feelings of fear or discomfort if his reaction is cold, or angry or makes her feel guilty for even having raised the issue?

And will she then try to avoid raising any concerns in the future?

Even if (when) one day she realises that her daughter is being targeted?

Please, OP, walk away, find a counsellor, explore what it is about this man that tempts you to give the relationship a go as long as you keep a look out for abusive behaviour.
And why taking this risk, even if you feel it is an informed risk, is OK with you -where is your daughter in your list of priorities?
Protect her, protect yourself and cut all ties with him.

@maria2bela1
can you answer this this other way around?
What was the nature of filming friends? Was it in an indecent way? Or was it something else?
What is the nature of ‘something else’ that you think is acceptable?

Deleting documents off a pc, again worrying but you need a bit more context.
What documents would you think it was ok someone went in to your computer without permission and deleted without your permission?

I think what some people who are saying “see how it goes” don’t realise is that by the time it gets bad, you’re already stuck and trapped. You love him. You feel committed. And he is so remorseful and so full of promises and apologies that you feel cruel to stick to your boundaries.

At the moment OP can walk away (though she’s tempted to stay- already there is a sense of commitment and attachment). Six months, a year, two years down the line it will be much much harder to leave when he starts stalking her or putting her in fear, and she’s walking on eggshells around him.

That was the attitude the officer interviewing my ex took. He was arrested for locking me in his house and assaulting me. I called 999 while I was trying to get out. When I got outside I ran and hung up, because I knew too well how rubbish the police are with these things.

For the next week they kept ringing me asking me what happened. I told them but said I didn't want to take it any further. They eventually turned up at my door so I finally agreed to give a statement. They appeared to take it seriously, arrested him and told me they would be in touch with an update.

The following day I got a call from the interviewing officer. He said 'He's been crying all throughout the interview. He's a state to be honest, really suffering. He sounds really sorry. We're letting him go but I've told him not to contact you again'.

Guess what happened? I got a torrent of abuse from the ex for 'falsifying' a statement and he stalked me for months.

The reason I didn't want to go to the police with it in the first place was because years previously I was raped in my sleep and, despite having a text from the perpetrator where he basically admitted as much, they NFA'd it. They only NFA'd it after they'd dragged me through eight months of utterly pointless 'investigation' including downloading everything from my phone, 'just in case you told a friend it was consensual', mind you.

Many here, like @BeavisMcTavish, seem to be misunderstanding the application of Clare's Law.
Quote:

The 'right to know'
This means that if police checks show that your current or ex-partner has a record of violent or abusive behaviour, and they believe you may be at risk, they may decide to proactively share that information with you.

No disclosure will be made if there have been complaints without evidence. No disclosure will be made unless the police believe you are at risk.

Exactly
I really do get how the OP is feeling. I started my relationship in the starry eyed belief I was special, other girls lied/ wound him up/ blah blah

By the time I got to the Clare's law stage I was so entrapped by coercive abuse, gaslighting and control I had lost sight of what was real, and constantly blamed myself

The Clare's law was the wake-up I needed. The day I said I was leaving he dragged me down the stairs by my hair, through a huge tv at me, threatened to hunt me and my children down and kill us

The police only disclose if they believe you are at risk, and they are therefore acting to prevent illegality

I did all this after previously leaving a 23 year abusive marriage, I am so should have known better.

If it 100% excludes any claims that were unfounded or not progressed because it was uncertain then for sure, I would be running for the hills I’m afraid.

that said, I’m then unclear why the police can’t give any clarity.

I’m so fucking sorry this happened to you. It’s awful how these men can just cry in their police interviews and get all the sympathy in the world. We are made out to be monsters just for trying to protect ourselves from our abusers. It’s a whole level of injustice I don’t think people can understand until they experience. Solidarity, forever ❤️

Thanks. I think any lack of clarity is coming from the OP, regrettably. She was shown a list of allegations, which wouldn't have been disclosed if they weren't deemed important. The police have to make a decision that the risk to the enquirer outweighs the subject's right to privacy. They obviously wouldn't do that if they weren't sure they could defend this decision.

OP seems to have construed 'lack of clarity' from the fact that the officer she spoke to wouldn't tell her to end the relationship. The police can't do that!

This is from the Statutory Guidance (p.21)

It's not worth it, OP. You don't need to wait for proof of abuse before you break up with him. Do you really want to be watching and waiting and constantly wondering "Is this bad enough?". Why not just sidestep all that worry? You can walk away before the harm is done.

Likewise. It's utterly shameful. Crimes like this perpetrated against almost any other demographic and particularly any other protected characteristic would have the book thrown at them. Men have always and will always act against women with impunity. It's almost as though our lives are of lesser worth.

I can't tell you how angry and sad this makes me. @kitteninabasket, you deserved so much better and I'm sorry that the system failed you.

Solidarity from me, too. 🌹

Bloody hell, this is well put.

Hey Pet

When I was single I used Clares Law for a guy - similar situation and called back. I had ended the short relationship by that point.

Several years later and I had forgotten all about him I heard a chilling story about him that validated all my concerns. Knew immediately who some one was talking about.

Abusive men (and people) have learned the ways to treat people to their advantage for a long time before you meet them, their skills at communicating can be very slick. So it is not your fault and it is why you feel confused and still are seeking validation. Your instinct is screaming at you to run, but on the face of it (his covered up abusive character) is making you doubt yourself.

I contacted Clares Law because I had an instinct that turned out to be correct, you would not have contaced them if you did not have a strong instinct something was up with him.

there is a great book called the gift of fear which you should read about instincts.

Just end it with him - say the usual its not you its me, sorry, make up any banal excuse. Make sure the police have a note of your address if he turns up dont answer / dont answer phone - call straight to police. He will soon get bored as he moves onto his next woman / victim.

Agreed

All, I'm sorry not to have updated the last few days. Two reasons for that: firstly that I've just been feeling a little overwhelmed but I have been reading all of your messages (often more than once) but secondly because I decided I wasn't at any immediate risk and saw him again.

I haven't known quite how to articulate how that date went. It was both lovely and not, the latter I think might have been because I felt so uneasy. I think that's usual having been to the PS and also had so many women warn me off. I was watchful, I suppose.

We ended up in bed. I had wanted to wait longer as wasn't really ready for that. He checked that I consented and whether I wanted him to stop and I said it was ok, but I definitely ended up in a vulnerable situation that I had started the evening resolute not to be in.

When it was time for me to go home, he didn't want me to go. And for about twenty minutes I'd estimate he didn't let me go. Not in a nasty way, but he was using his body to prevent me from getting up and kept saying that he wanted me to stay. I felt scared but tried not to show it. Was I scared because of everything that had preceded that date? I can't honestly work it out. It was all playfully done and once upon a time I feel like I would have been a bit flirty / playful in such a scenario. That scenario being that we'd had a lovely evening and of course no one really wants a lovely evening to end do they.

I wasn't very firm about needing to leave and then after about a twenty minutes I was firm. Once I was firm he did then let me up so I could go and was lovely to me at the end of the evening. I want to be clear that at no point was there any aggression or anything. Just a playful use of his strength that meant I couldn't leave when I wanted to. But otherwise absolutely lovely and charming all evening. Couldn't have done enough for me.

So I can only conclude really that previous posters who have said I may have a self esteem problem have hit the nail on the head. So that sucks.

I'm sat here deliberating whether to press post as I've been feeling uneasy and tearful ever since and I'm now a bit worried about a pile on because I've ignored previous advice and ended up in that position. But this thread is supremely helpful and I think will be helpful to others too in the future so for the sake of that, I'm going to press post and hope that replies are drafted kindly.