DS super opportunity, super early start. Would you go the night before?

[Teenson]

Son, 16, got a chance for a week away doing some very cool but demanding stuff, sort of a maths academy .
We’ll have to leave the house at 6 on Monday for a lot of train journeys to get there at 8.45.
i thought if we got there the night before and stayed in a premier inn, son would be awake and refreshed the next day. DH can’t come as planned as he now has to be in work. He is not keen for DS and I to to go to a hotel without him, thinks it’s ok for us to go in the morning. He says DS leaving the house at 6 isn’t that much earlier than leaving at his usual 7.45 for school. I’m anxious about trains, being late and DS getting there tired and flustered. I’d like to leave the afternoon before and have a relaxed evening and early night, I don’t know if I’m being silly, wwyd ?

I agree your DH sounds completely controlling and manipulative. But also, perhaps as a result of living like this, you do sound quite immature and not at all like a grown woman with kids and responsibilities. You’ve said “my friend says the train won’t be busy” and other things just make you sound quite child-like. Especially coupled with the indecision it does sound like you’re looking to your DH to tell you what to do because you can’t make a decision for yourself. I’m sorry if that sounds harsh it’s just how it comes across. And I don’t know if you are in an emotionally abusive situation like some posters have implied, so if that is the case then I don’t mean to sound like I’m victim-blaming. But you sound like you have very little confidence and self esteem and maybe that’s something you can work on. If your DH is not supportive of you then maybe you should reconsider the relationship. But either way, you need to get a bit more headstrong and more confident and stand up for yourself!

@Teenson How often have you been away without your husband? How often has your husband been away without you even if work related?
Have you ever booked your self some annual leave and mooched around London maybe to a theatre show or something?

See if I was in a couple and this is possibly a reason I won't be... If I knew we were financially good with the money I wouldn't have even asked him I would have booked the train tickets and hotel and said " oh, Fred and I are going to spend the day in X city on Sunday, stay over at X Premier Inn and then drop him off at the Y event on Monday, you've got the place to yourself for the night". I might even book myself a second night for some R and R

At 16, my mother would have given me a lift to the station and waved me off.

This. Exactly this.

If there were doubts before of your husband being controlling, manipulative or even knowingly abusive, your last update removes any doubt.
OP, think of your son. Your initial instincts were very right. How has he got you thinking you are lazy.
Ketchupgate - berate you, confuse you, break you down
Help with work stuff - his 'niceness' after being nasty then confuses you, makes you uncertain, you doubt yourself even more
Locked up in his office - he is unavailable for further discussion and for you to see how he goes on to behave to strengthen your resolve to go the night before to a hotel, he also gives the impression he is working hard, he is important etc.

He is not a nice person. He is not considering his son at all.

I am so sorry, OP.

It reads as if it is fine for your DH to spend money, but not for you. So he can buy takeaway, new phone, car, but god forbid you want a night in a hotel to make life easier.

OP didn't ask.

I’d like to leave the afternoon before and have a relaxed evening and early night

Do that then. Don't listen to anyone else.

To me, it sounds like your DH is not very good with money, but he is worried about money - is he in debt? Sounds very typical of a burying his head in the sand kind of attitude.

Since you are working less, I wonder if it would help to offer to take charge of the family finances. Would you feel confident in doing that? Using some tool like the free MSE budget planner: https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/banking/budget-planning/

Or a paid service like YNAB, but having access to all his account info so you can keep an eye on things. That is helpful because you can then quantify things like not necessarily needing a £500 phone and if he wants to get a takeaway you can look at the takeaway budget for the month and check whether it's affordable.

I think my DH can be a bit like this (though he wouldn't comment on ketchup use and he wouldn't talk me out of going to a hotel) - he feels like he earns enough that we "should" be able to do nice things and sometimes when he's in that mood he'll spend as though he has magic pockets. Then other times, he gets worried about money and starts talking about ways to reduce costs and drastic lifestyle changes, then he barely ever actually makes lasting changes to reduce costs, BTW! We would constantly seem to see-saw between "Oh we're doing really well!" to being right at the bottom of the overdraft and "We'll have to make up for it next month" then increasing the overdraft when there was an emergency. Not good.

But since I took over managing our finances, we don't have these wild swings all the time and our bank balances have been getting slowly and steadily better. We are not in overdraft. We've been able to handle financial emergencies without it being a disaster and I probably could get a hotel in the situation you suggest.

I once wondered why DH is so bad at managing money at home when he manages budgets at work, but I think his role with budgets is totally different at work - he basically says he doesn't allocate budgets, but he does spend budgets and argue for more budget etc His whole family have a similar attitude towards money and lurch between riches and ruin whereas my family is more cautious and tend to try to avoid debt.

It is controlling the way your DH is acting, and that is not healthy in a relationship. Only you will know if that is part of a wider pattern (in which case you might find that you get on much better with him out of the picture completely) or whether it's specific to money and may be something that would be helped by more transparency and objectivity on the subject.

Great post @BertieBotts

Everyone does things differently.
I enjoy spending time 1 to 1 with my child, even when she was older, so we would have enjoyed the journey and hotel stay together,

She went away to do a university taster session for a week. I took her and collected her. She was 17 and could have gone by train I guess, but why do I need her to do that?

Fwiw every single other young person going on that week was taken by a parent from what we could gather, so it can't be that odd,

@jennifersa

On the occasion we have used Premier Inn or Travelodge a family room has been 50-60/night & that's places like Cardiff, Cambridge. I'm sure a Sunday night would be a reasonable price.

This.

What’s going on??

Coercive control. Please read up on it.

Id do what you want.

However 6am isn't that much of an early start.

I'm taking it as he's not coming you'll be alone in hotel room together the rest of the week?

Which makes his argument all the more daft!

He’s 16 I’m not seeing the issue with him leaving home at 6

your going to end up projecting your anxiety and issues on him and make him as bad as you

He’s now helped me do something that may help with my career, which was very nice and much appreciated . I think I’m being over sensitive.

He's not nice if he is only nice to you when he feels like it.

He really does sound controlling.

Don't be so fucking horrible.

Can't see anything wrong with Op except she's in a relationship with a controller who's making her feel chronically unsure of herself.
You're probably more like him than her.

this sounds like he’s keeping you on eggshells op- that he doesn’t actually like you but does like the control he has over you, and he manages it by occasionally being nice, so you feel there’s no way you can say he’s not supportive of your career, but what does he do on a regular basis to be supportive? He gives you a kicking for a bit of extra ketchup, so you never actually know where you’re at. He’s ok with things like a night in a hotel, as long as he gets to go. If he doesn’t get to benefit, then you don’t deserve it. It was only allowed because he deserves it. Does this sound familiar to you?

Er no, if DH did that I’d say “good idea DH, no point rushing, hope you guys have fun, make sure you find somewhere nice for dinner”.

I’m sorry OP but your husband is a giant twat. I don’t bring in a penny and Dh would never expect me to make my life (and especially not Dd’s life) a bit less convenient or pleasant so he could buy takeouts. It is reasonable to expect everyone in a family to mind the budget but sounds like it’s mainly you minding the budget. He begrudges you.

Also yeah he should help you out sometimes, it’s what families do, I always pitch in if DH needs help with something (I’ve proofread A LOT of powerpoint presentations), he always helps me too.

@Teenson - DH who made the morning journey sound simple. Then said, ‘it’s up to you, I don’t want you to think I’m stopping you’.

This is classic. Can't you see it? He listed all the reasons why your plan won't work and why his is much better, 🙄 says it's 'up to you' then manufactures a huge argument about something pointless (ketchup) to make you worried, flustered, nervous and to make you doubt yourself.

He is manipulating you. He is coercively controlling. He is very bad for you.

Your job - he wants to be in control of that. Says it's not enough, fine want you to take it.

Complains when you 'waste' ketchup yet has money for a £500 phone for you (I'd check if he has added tracking software to it) or takeaway.

I wonder if he really has to work so many hours, or whether e he's doing it to make you feel guilty.

Please think really hard about your relationship. You clearly know that things aren't right because you are posting on here. Think about other things that have happened in the past.

When did you last feel relaxed and at ease, not walking on eggshells?

This!

@Castle0 a snarky grammar lesson when the OP is worried and upset? Nasty.

Ketchupgate doesn't happen in relationships without abuse. Yes it seems such a little thing so you disregard it, but it is just the most obvious example of the deeper pervasive behaviour in your relationship. The fact its a little shows how messed up this is because why the fuck would your OH care about ketchup and he doesn't, but he got you on edge and off kilter and then went in with the manipulation and all the I really don't mind. its up to you, but I really don't see why you need to do this thing. Where you end up is you not only do what you want, but you're beating yourself up and feeling guilty for ever wanting anything else and feeling like you're the unreasonable one.

This isn't how healthy relationships work. I hope one day you can see that before he's completely destroyed your self confidence and self esteem and your sense of worth as a person. I've been there and my biggest regret is that my kids were exposed to it for too long. but my second biggest regret is that I didn't leave before he made me feel completely worthless and completely useless.