Stag and boundaries

[Blueberrysky1]

A few days ago my husband had an invite to his mates stag do, he's been out with his mate before, so not an issue, but his reaction made me suspicious. He said he'd been added to a group for X's day and night stag. He kept looking at me saying that he can't say no, that he'll have to go. And there's no way I can say no, we've been friends for a long time. He was trying to be hesitant in accepting it, but making out he had no choice, which made me suspicious.

I've mentioned in the past that strip clubs/strippers is a massive no, and would be crossing the line for me.

So today, I asked if any info of where they were going for the stag had been posted on the group. He said no, so I made a passing comment 'what if it's to strip club or they have a stripper booked'? He replied 'so what if they have, I'll have to go'. I made it clear, that they were a big no for me and would be the end if our relationship. He replied 'great X will be getting married and I'll be getting devorced.

I honestly would respect my partners boundaries, and not want to hurt or upset him. I know he would not want me going to see strippers and I don't think I could get over it, if he did.

Perhaps they aren't going to a strip club etc, but his reaction hasn't really been reassuring.

Would others accept their partner going to a strip club, if they knew it's crossing the line and a big No No?

In my experience often behaving like that is to avoid a huge domestic, rather than they want to do more. I’m not really sure of that logic in this context.

Everyone has a different idea of what cheating means to them.

To me its my partner doing something for his own sexual gratification that he knows I am not happy with.
Or doing something behind my back with someone that he knows I'm not happy with.

I consider visiting a strip club as cheating. I consider watching porn as cheating. I consider a drunken kiss on a night out as cheating.

Some people may not think those things are, but thats down to them.
My DP is aware of what I class as cheating - because life has taught me that apparently we have to fucking well spell it out for men, and he chooses to be with me knowing this.If he then changes his mind - fine. But it would mean we are no longer compatible and I wouldn't want to be in a relationship with him anymore. I wouldn't respect him anymore, so what would be the point.

Some women are fine with strip clubs. Some are not. Some would end a relationship over it. I 100% without a shadow of a doubt am someone who WOULD end a realtionship over it.

And its not about insecurity or jealousy or any of that tripe that 'cool' women or men trot out. Its because I have standards and morals I have decided for myself and the sex industry is horrific for women. That is my view. It makes no difference who disagrees or agrees with it. That is simply my opinion and anyone is free to have their own opinion on it. Yes, I'm aware not all women are trafficked etc, but the men do not know which ones are. But are willing to take the risk to get their sexual gratification from it and watch them anyway. Citing 'well she probably isn't traffcked, shes doing it through choice, so I'll watch anyway'. THAT is why I couldn't be with a man who visits strip clubs or watches porn. Simply because of their indifference as to whether the person they are watching and getting excited by is being exploited. There are currently between 700,000 and 900,000 victims of sex trafficking in the US alone (unsure of the figures in the uk, but its not a 'small' problem)

I am very secure and I am not jealous of other women in the slightest, and no, naked bodies do not offend me. What offends me would be a man who would visit a strip club at the expense of his wifes feelings just to get his little bit of sexual excitement watching a woman he cares nothing about and isn't the least bit bothered he may or may not be watching someone who has been exploited, coerced, or worse. As long as he gets his rocks off though, hey.

@Frasers You may well be right. I still think it's just likely to make it more upsetting for the OP. It seems like her husband isn't that bothered about what she thinks and would rather try not to even bother talking it through properly (which would involve an argument) and would prefer to just quietly go off and do something that he had previously agreed not to do.

I can understand his motivations and desires, of course. I'm just disappointed that quite a few men prioritise going to a strip club above their partner's feelings. (I'm not trying to man-bash in general. I am a man. I'm just saddened by some things I hear from other men in these situations.)

I do get what you’re saying, but I’m not sure I agree, I would apply this to anything, if I was going to do something with my friends on the hen, something completely legal and my husband started telling me he’d divorce me and trying to force me not to go, I’d go. Absolutely id go.

personally I’d not be evasive about it though, but I can see why some are. I’d not see this as prioritising strip club over his wife’s feelings, but more not letting a spouse control , threaten, dictate, and blackmail you.

So my husband came home from work yesterday and said he'd bumped into his mate, they don't know where they are going for the stag, it was originally Amsterdam. He's told his mate what I've said. Then he (my husband) said I've got problems in my head, I'm paranoid blar blar blar. So I spend my second night on the sofa. I can't talk to him, he'll just shout and says I've got problems. His behavior his such a turn off, I don't think I know him anymore.

@Blueberrysky1 He said you had problems in your head? That's a disgusting thing for him to say. There are plenty of women who feel the way you do, and quite a few men who would be fine to agree not to go to a strip club (I'm one of them, and I know others.) Deciding that he wants to go despite your feelings is not great, but trying to gaslight you is even worse. Could there be more going on here? Is he dissatisfied with life in general or something, and feeling in the mood to pick a fight with his wife as part of that?

@Frasers I wouldn't want someone to control or threaten me either. But it sounds like OP had already explained that this was a red line for her, and it seemed like he had agreed to it. If he wasn't willing to agree to those terms then he should have made that clear back then. If he wants to change the terms of their relationship now then he should at least have the decency to have a proper conversation with her about it rather than trying to brush her off or gaslight her (in my opinion.)

I realise that I'm very keen on honesty and talking things through in relationships. I know that some other people have relationships where maybe they don't tell each other some things or there are grey areas. If both people are OK with that then fair enough.

Yes he had's been down about work. He's quite short fused lately, funding anything too much.

I actually think this is your hill to die on. It’s about so much more than him wanting some paid for Fanny in his face and you being unhappy about that.

@Blueberrysky1 It sounds to me like he might be thinking "I'm feeling pretty fed up with life. Maybe watching some strippers is just the kind of pick-me-up I need. Oh shit, my wife won't like it. Fuck it, she's not doing enough to make me happy - I'm just going to do it anyway, and hopefully she'll shut up about it after a while if I just avoid much discussion."

It sounds like a mini mid-life crisis, or part of a mid-life crisis. If he won't discuss it then that sounds very difficult for you. How soon is the trip? If it's some distance away then maybe he'll be more willing to talk calmly in a few days (or maybe not.)

I wonder if the groom to be is having similar conversations with his bride. He may not know the full plans yet for discussion but his derogatory comment to the op would concern me more, not him wanting to join a bunch of blokes on a mid life weekend.

I wonder if you've had previous disagreements like this where perhaps you've "gotten over it" or backed down after a while, and maybe he thinks you'll do that again. Or maybe he thinks you wouldn't really choose to divorce over this at this point in your life or relationship. Or maybe he imagines that he could then be a newly single guy free to chase younger women.

He says none of his mates parters have issues with them using the sex industry. It's just me, and my problems with my head. Then he puts a post up on social media saying pissing people off is like a piece of cake, I like cake!. He's acting like stroppy teenager. Why couldn't he just have a honest and grown up conversation, so we could have come to some mutual ground.

Sounds very childish of him and not wanting to miss out . Maybe clarify which bit their partners don't mind, I'm sure they'll have their own rules in place. They've probably said, go to the club but don't pay for anything...which is fair.
Quite sad that a bunch of 50 year olds get excited by this,

That stupid juvenile behaviour would clamp my flaps shut without all the other bullshit of him caring more about either his right to enjoy sex workers or his inability to stand up to peer pressure (ego!)

He's told his mate what I've said. Then he (my husband) said I've got problems in my head, I'm paranoid blar blar blar.

You know this is gaslighting, right?

@Blueberrysky1 Some men put pressure on their friends over these kinds of things. "What, you're going to let your woman stop you from doing the stag do properly? Who wears the trousers in your house mate? You're so whipped! I feel sorry for you." This might be where some of his anger is coming from. Do you know whether he tends to be someone who wants to follow the crowd and fit in, or someone who is comfortable standing up for his own beliefs even when others don't agree?

I think it's heading that way. Strip clubs and lap dancing clubs were more socially acceptable 20-30 years ago than they are today, largely because there's more awareness of exploitation.

MN threads are very self-selecting for though, and I think attending one on a friend's stay do would only be a divorce-worthy for a small proportion of women.

Not that it should change your viewpoint, but he's probably right. I don't think most women hold a rigid, red line, "instruct the solicitors" position on their husbands attending a stag do where part of it involves entering a strip club. Most people have a somewhat elastic application of morality that allows a degree of acceptance of behaviour they're not 100% comfortable with.

OP I think at this point it's clear he has absolutely no respect for you. Can you stay in a relationship with a man who is so selfish?

@CeeCeeBloom
Did you not read the post you've quoted me on???
I've clearly stated each couple has their own boundaries and work on it together . You come across angry

@CeeCeeBloom
I clearly state 'in my opinion'.

@CeeCeeBloom
Plus I said nothing about jealousy, I'm not shallow thank you.
Please refrain from your insults, I reported your post which called me dense.

Have a nice day

You want me to refrain from the insults, maybe refrain from the condescending posts about what is and isn't cheating. You want to be a "cool girl" that's fine, the rest of us have standards.