Please remind me that they don't change...

[Toomuchwine89]

I'm currently in refuge, been here for four months now (no physical violence).

Ex has flipped between love bombing, emailing via solicitor to ask me to reconcile (there's a non molestation order in place), filing for divorce, asking to stop the divorce, dropping the step kids like hot shit, saying he wants to see the step kids, applying to court to see his bio children, saying he doesn't want to go through court, applying for a prohibited steps order to stop us moving anywhere, but not letting us back to the family home while I'm stuck in refuge with six children.

Anyway yesterday was the first court hearing for the child arrangement order. It was over video link. He looked broken (but I don't feel THAT sorry for him). He was given indirect contact for now (he can drop letters and presents off to my solicitor, and I'll get charged every time ffs).

I didn't know until just before the hearing that he'd emailed the court a few days ago, basically a letter to me. Firstly he apologised for everything, accepted how terrible he'd treated us all and said he wanted to rebuild his relationship with all six kids. Then he wrote a paragraph directly to me... Basically saying how he will always love me and truly believes we can work on our marriage, especially as he's had counselling. He even said during the court hearing that he's not clear what the future will hold for me and him!

I left because of emotional, sexual and verbal abuse - with the latter mostly towards the children.

I so nearly emailed him last night, but didn't. If he replied then I could technically have had him arrested for breaking the non molestation order and I don't want to be that person.

I'm right to stay away, aren't I? Or could he have changed? We were together six years. He was bad all the way through tbf.

SO much headspace. As I do every time he finds a way to indirectly get to me. This is why I needed the non molestation order. He'd have possibly convinced me to back to him otherwise.

I'm annoyed because I told the children the first letters would be arriving on Friday! I didn't think for a second that they wouldn't be.

And yes to the punishment aspect. He always used to say to me "I wanted a baby with you because it ties us for life" and "If we ever broke up, I'd try to get you back".

And yet I STILL feel bad for him, still have so much empathy, still partly blame myself. Ughhh

Yes, keep a note of it.

Anything like that keep a note off because it shows it’s not about the children. It’s about his control.

Okay, I've written it all down. Will be interesting to see if he does drop them off. It's our youngest child's birthday today which is why he made such a fuss about it. Twat.

Keep a note as well of the fact your solicitor had to tell him to remove the gift for you and that he asked if you’d be collecting personally.

a good solicitor will keep it all, but it’s worth keeping notes of where he tries to use the children on top for any potential future access attempts down the line after everything is initially sorted.

The 3 year old isn't as jumpy and on edge anymore.

I havent read any further, this is more than enough to never consider going back

Yep I've written that down. Worse than the child arrangement order is the prohibited steps order he's applied for to stop me moving. I'm not staying in a fucking refuge! Just hope the judge can see it's about control

But she'll still have to have contact with him? It makes no sense

Are you having counselling through the refuge OP? I don't know if that is available but I think the support that it could give - that you have nothing to feel bad about when it comes to him - could be really helpful. Also going back to your abusive childhood and looking at the life long effect that that has had on you. If not then maybe the freedom project would be a really good option.

Please do not ever let him see the children alone. If he is a narcissist as you understandably suspect then they will just be pawns to him - ESPCIALLY the children that are not biologically his. He has no interest in them but he will use them to try to get you back - not because he loves you, narcissists don't have that capability - but because he can't cope with your rejection and he wants control back over you. And if you went back, well after a couple of perfect days oh how you would be pay for your perceived transgressions.

Narcissists are absolute masters of manipulation. They have no empathy and no remorse. They cannot be fixed, even counselling has the opposite effect. They will lie to and manipulate the counsellor and only learn how to be a more convincing liar and manipulator through what the counsellor tells them.

Stay strong OP, and if you can't stay strong for yourself then stay strong for your kids so they are not brought up to see abuse as normal the way that you have.

And don't ever underestimate how dangerous this man is.

The judge will see what he’s doing with trying to make you unable to leave the refuge.

He’s hoping you’ll get sick of the refuge and go “home”. It’s a very clear tactic to prevent you ending up with a space that it yours as once you are there you’ll be harder to pull back.

Hopefully you’ll have a judge that’s well versed on the script men like this use.

Why would you regret it if he meets someone else and starts love bombing them! Please don't say you'd be be thinking "it should have been meeee!" You should feel sorry for any future partner.

You need to be talking to SS and your solicitor about the abuse the children have seen and have been through - a child is not jumpy and on edge like that for no reason.

He needs to only ever see the children in a contact centre if he has to see them at all - he probably won't bother more than once or twice because he won't be able to use or manipulate them there (but if they are adoring of him he might see them for supply). If he isn't consistent then that should go against him and hopefully at some point soon he'll just stop showing up and be out of their lives for good.

This in the long run will only be a good thing no matter how much they think they love him or how upsetting it is at the time. He is currently only setting them up for a life time of abusive relationships - the way you were by your parents.

I would feel very sorry for them.

It's more everyone around him thinking she's great and I must have been the problem and how lucky he is

Love, you're in a refuge. No one's going to be thinking that you're the problem.

And other people thinking she's great is a product of your overthinking.

I'm doing the Freedom project and have contacted a private counsellor.

He's definitely a narcissist. My 30th birthday coincided with one of the kids' sports days once and he could NOT understand why I still wanted to go to the sports day despite it being my birthday. I said that my daughter would be gutted if I missed it and he said she was selfish...

But. He's going to get unsupervised isn't he? God knows how he'll afford the solicitor, but they'll fight for it and it'll progress onto that at some point. But yeh. He is definitely only using the older ones to get me back. If that doesn't work, I expect he'll drop them again.

I also told him he was dangerous once (right before I left). His lack of empathy and emotional intelligence was just so unhinged. It unnerved me so much.

I think he wants me back because he cannot bear the thought of me being with someone else.

Oh great. He's just emailed the solicitor to say he's taking cards, presents and photos to the office in the next 10 minutes. And she wants me to collect them ASAP. Her office is an hour away, it's my baby's birthday and I was really hoping he'd fuck up. I don't want his fucking photos.

Oh there are websites similar to Mumsnet but for shit dads... And apparently women fake abuse and go into refuge to gain the upper hand and keep control/prevent contact. It has tips for how to "win". It's awful.

Ffs, I'm sat outside the leisure centre, supposed to be taking the babies swimming, but I just want to break down.

I'd love him to disappear. He won't. He's had the snip so can't trap another woman with children and start the process again. He also told me more than once that he's so glad we had girls because "they will be there for him and look after him when he's older". They're just endless supply for him.

Well, if nothing else, you have to admire the swift reaction of your solicitor here. Most would wait until he'd actually showed up, and none would oblige you to show up on demand to collect his stuff. Literally no law firm I've ever worked for would have their client, especially one in your position, dancing to an opposing party's tune like that. Find a better lawyer nearer to where you are. The refuge will be able to recommend a local one, surely?

I don't like this solicitor at all, and they don't do legal aid. I've found a local solicitor who does do legal aid and seems AWESOME. Just praying I get accepted for legal aid.

Whatever he's doing, it's worked well. I took the babies swimming but I felt so sad. Kept thinking I need to get them out the pool early and then miss the lunch we'd planned so I can rush and get these things he's dropped off.

But fuck it. I'm not changing my plans. I've got so much to do today. And the kids finish early for Easter. And so does the solicitor. She was originally going to charge me for RECEIVING THE LETTERS. Now she's agreed not to, but I have to pick them up ASAP apparently

Don’t do that!

Do not go near that office remotely at a time when he’s been there in case he’s still hanging around!

Double check with her, using that point if necessary, because if she doesn’t realise that that’s dangerous for you that’s a problem!

You can blame him for what he actually done

But you can't blame him for the drama of the way you are thinking of it and you going back, that is on you

I can't beleive you need to be told not too

Ah I didn't think of that! Plus the location of the office (purely by chance) is his "home", i.e. Where he's originally from. He knows the place like the back of his hand, and has friends and family there. So he could easily hang around if he felt like it.

I did mention this to my refuge support worker. She said "If he wanted to do something he'd have had you on the school run". Okay?

Erm... I'm not going back?

If he went for you on the school run it would be easily shown that it was deliberate.

”accidentally” bumping into you in an area he knows well, or someone he knows accidentally bumping into you, has more chance of his “I didn’t expect to see her, or was a coincidence” excuse being believed.

Is there no-one else who could collect for you?

I mean the non molestation order stops him going near the school but yeh. I agree.

No one that can go for me. I've said I'll go on Monday. Dreading it so much. Just reading his words, seeing his pics, knowing he's still around is going to be stressful