Who is in the wrong? Fight in front of DC

[SmashedPots]

I'm going to describe this as factually as possible and want honest opinions

DC (3) still has tantrums. Every morning it's hard to get him ready. He was playing with playdoh and he was half dressed. Before he put his jumper on he said "more playdoh mummy". I had got some out and it was on the side. He did already have some in his hands.

DH comes downstairs to take DC to school. DH says "no more playdoh. We are going now"

Tantrum starts. It's a bad one. DC shouting a lot "more playdoh etc etc"

I say under my breath to DH "he could have just had that playdoh you know. I did get it out for him"

DH shouts "fuck you. Fuck off undermining me like always"

DC stops tantrum as soon as DH shouts at me and starts shouting at DH "stop fighting"

I say "calm down DH. Stop shouting in front of DC"

He keeps shouting

I say "you're less in control of your emotions that DS"

DH grabs the pot of play-doh (which he had put on a high shelf" and throws it really hard at the floor right in front of DS.

I tell DH to get out.

DH shouts "you fucking made this happen. Undermining me as fucking usual. This is your fault."

I haven't raised my voice once but DH tells me I've got that "look on my face"

My poor baby boy.

It lasted 5 mins in total. They have now left and I have to get ready for work with the baby.

Was I undermining? Is this abusive? I can't think straight these days.

Then he needs to get his arse out of bed and help!!

The minimising of abusive behaviour on this thread is unbelievable.

It really is.

@beAsensible1 maybe the DH should get his lazy arse out of bed and help with the morning routine instead of letting his wife deal with it every morning

I am shocked by the minimising and wondering what the hell is happening.

It is NEVER okay to scream and shout and swear and throw things with young children and babies standing there. What a terrifying place to be as a small child. Op needs support, today.

Playdoh been out that close to when he has to leave for school is ridiculous, indulgent and almost seems like an avoidance strategy for the inevitable tantrum. You did undermine your DH a bit & I get the frustration.

Get a morning routine together that takes into account tantrums etc. so getting to school is less traumatic for everyone.

Your husband sounds remarkably like my BIL. SIL used to be up any time from 4:30am onwards with their kids, but have them all sorted and ready for school for when BIL rolled out of bed to drive them to school (they slept in separate beds so only SIL would be woken by the kids)
Their oldest DS has diagnosed ASD and uses his iPad and noise cancelling headphones to help him calm down, and if BIL decided he had been "naughty" would confiscate his iPad and argue/swear at SIL if she got involved.

She is currently trying to divorce him but he cannot let his control over the and the children go - he constantly calls her, asking to get back together, to forgive him & his behaviour (physical abuse towards her and the children, as well as mental - and I have heard recordings of it)

Please don't put yourself in a position where you are having to placate your husband at the expense of the welfare of your child

You say your DS is on the ASD pathway. ASD is almost always an inherited condition, and I would guess that your husband is on the spectrum, too. You know from your ds how ASD can lead to tantrums and the feeling of being undermined/oppressed if, what seems logical and black and white to the person with ASD, is questioned or negated by someone else. There is little capacity to 'feel' that there are more than 1 options in a certain situation by people with ASD. You also say you try to pacify your ds with ASD - one day he might be grown up and have a tantrum like your dh. Will it then be abuse or a disability? It's difficult, but I would scan your dh behaviour for other clues and think together about what causes these strong emotions and behaviour management.

The morning routine should involve the DH getting up at a decent time and helping out, not leaving it all to the OP then coming down at the very last minute and yelling at everyone to hurry up.

Playdoh been out that close to when he has to leave for school is ridiculous, indulgent and almost seems like an avoidance strategy for the inevitable tantrum.

Not when the health visitor has recommended it.

It’s life, it happened, yes your DH reaction wasn’t ideal but when you’re dealing with tantrums day in day out, plus a baby, everyone gets tired, stressed and these situations spiral from a pot of playdoh. We are experiencing 4 year old tantrums and I too would have the playdoh out, any time of day, just for the peace!
He’s apologised, be kind to each other and move on. It was a bad start but you have the rest of the day to make up for it.

@WaveyHair did you miss the bit where this has been advised for sensory reasons to help keep DS (who had possible ASD)calm. If a child needs medication for health reasons is that being indulgent too

I agree with you OP. Nothing more frustrating than a half arsed parent rock starring in at the last minute and expecting everything at their schedule.

His temper sounds horrible, and cruel. Your little boy is not much more than a baby, and a sensitive one at that. Your instincts sound spot on.

If you think this was out of character for your husband and as such it is salvageable, wait till he gets home and have a calm chat, see if the remorse is genuine.

OP, you were managing your child to get dressed and using play-doh as a resource that helps him do the task. Your husband interrupts and undermines your parenting by abruptly introducing a new rule that contradicts the way you were working with your son. You were engaging in collaboration with your son and your husband enters and demands you both respond to his dictatorial style. He then punishes you and your child with a terrifying display of violence. Please call Women's Aid to talk through this situation. These situation usually escalate.

You both had a part to play here and neither was "innocent".

Your husband should not have lost his cool like that. Shouting, swearing and throwing things are totally unacceptable.

You seem to see yourself as not contributing because you "kept your cool". Your child might not have noticed the muttering under your breath, but your husband certainly would have. That would have been infuriating to anyone.

Playdoh in the morning before leaving the house is nuts, so he was right about that. So do you regularly undermine him? Was he right about that too?

She clearly is.

The child was dressed other than his jumper. OP was using the play-doh as a distraction technique to help get him dressed. She'd already been up almost 2 hours with the 3yo and the baby, while her husband lay in bed. He then comes down, upsets the 3yo and starts being abusive to his wife.

How exactly does that not show quite blatantly that the OP is by far the better parent? She doesn't even have to try to sell herself.

If anything, he was undermining you. Coming down and overruling what you were doing.

Playdoh in the morning before leaving the house is nuts, so he was right about that

Do people keep missing the part where it was recommended by a HV to keep the probably ASD 3 year old calm and regulated?
My ASD 3 year old plays with play doh every morning. It really helps.

Having said all that other people have made excellent points about the morning routine and your husband's involvement and support in that. Didn't see the bit about using the playdoh as a tool either. I slightly retract some of what I said.

@knittingaddict play dough helps the child regulate. Which bit of the DH’s behaviour helps that process, letting OP do pretty much the whole morning routine (which also includes a baby and getting herself ready for work), appearing suddenly 5 minutes before they need to leave and telling DS he needs to be ready now

Yes I did miss that.

And why is Playdoh in the morning nuts when she has 2 hours to kill? Would watching TV be better?

This changes things, he needs to take some of the load in the morning, you do 5.45 to 6.45 and he then takes over? He can then stop the play dough earlier if he wants?

Which is the better parent, the one who gets up with DC and plays with and gets them ready for school/nursery or the parent who gets up 5 minutes before they need to leave?

His behaviour was totally unacceptable.

If anyone was undermining the other, he undermined you! You were getting DS ready, had allowed pay-doh to keep him calm. You'd been up with your son for 2 hours.

DH came in and thought it was okay to instantly take over the parenting. He undermined/overruled your parenting decision to have the play-doh out, with no discussion or care for why or what you'd decided and agreed with DS.

You said something to him at a level that DS couldn't hear and his reaction was to swear, shout, and throw hard objects around near your son. The throwing was a violent act. He then blamed you, with no awareness at all that he'd been the one to undermine your parenting in the first place.

Utterly inexcusable behaviour. If it's not a one off and out of character, but reflects a pattern from him then he's abusive.

I hate this shit. He was undermining YOU because you'd already given him the Playdoh. Yes it is abusive. Fucking men.