Would you put up with being called these names?

[ilovesparky]

I have just had DH in my face. Calling me a cunt, bitch and knob. Trying to intimidate me so I had to push him back. All very load so the dcs can hear. I am in tears. He flies off the handle and then thinks it's ok to speak like this . Apparently I fuelled the argument by not backing down. I don't think it's my responsibility. He's called me bitch and tells me to f* off quite regularly. He's very childish and whites instead of having a calm discussion about something. Nothing is his fault.

So, we ve been away and I packed the car up to let DH do a final check of the house for his stuff and to check doors locked etc as I know he gets funny about it. I thought I was being nice.

Meanwhile I packed up the car. This was all the stuff I had put by the door to go directly in the car. He packed his own suitcase and I shut it snd put it in the car. There were a few loose items in the car which I didn't take any notice of before putting cases etc in. DH constantly packs things last minute and loose because he's disorganised. This annoys me so I just left these things in the car.

Before we leave I get questioned about where x and y is. I don't know, I am fed up with being responsible for his stuff. I pack my stuff, the kids stuff and food. As far as I am concerned the rest is his. So we are then late as he has to find things. I shout down to him that they are in the car- I see them as I put the last bags in.

We get home, he's left his slippers. Apparently that's my fault as I packed the car. I packed a couple of his coats which I noticed on the side which were about to be left. But because I didn't pack his slippers snd only packed some stuff it's all my fault. Is this right? I don't think so. He packs his own things. I never said I would pack his.

He has form for this. Always someone else's fault if he looses something, hasn't got the right stuff. My fault. I rushed him, I didn't let him think, I packed some stuff but not the rest. Which isn't true. I don't pack anything for him except doing him a favour packing two coats he was about to leave as I saw them. I am fed up with it.

I am trying to see his side of the argument.

I'm sorry OP. This line means that you are not listening to the advice here.

Nothing will change as long as you prioritise him over your children and yourself. He's an abuser.

Your children see you prioritise this horrible abuser over them. That's just incredibly sad. Please reconsider.

Your 3 examples are if him being irresponsible.

It sounds like he's irresponsible and yoyrd expected to accept that/pander to it/never protest about it .... or you get abused.

There's no winning in this situation.

If you're separated at least you can control the irresponsibility within your realm, and at least you wouldnt wouldn't being abused.

He's not a reasonable, responsible person.
And he's abusive.

*wouldn't be being abused

"They were in bed. They didn't see but probably heard".

How does that make you feel?.
They heard it all and likely lay in bed terrified themselves.

What are you getting out of this relationship with your H now?.

Your children know far more than either of you care to realise; they pick up on all the vibes, both spoken and unspoken, here in how the two of you relate to each other. If you're really only staying now because of them or even worse a lifestyle you want to maintain I would urge you to reconsider your decision sharpish.

What sort of a relationship example did you see growing up; was it similar to what you have now?. We do tend to repeat what we saw back then.

Abuse is not solely physical in nature nor does it happen every day. The nice/nasty cycle of abuse he shows you is a continuous one.

Minimising the effects of all this from him on you and your kids does you all a huge disservice.

I don't think he is an abuser. We bicker a lot and have fiery arguments and his default is to tell me to F off. He's called me a bitch before but never these words. This is not regularly and my dcs aren't scared in their beds. Although my dd did say she heard us arguing. I asked if she heard names and she said no. I don't like them hearing.

Yes, he is immature and irresponsible. Apparently I should have been more sympathetic but because he does the same thing time and time again in leaving things behind and never learns I probably do have more of a told you so approach. I didn't telepathically know he was making a mental checklist apparently. He finds it hard to admit fault ever. Even at work. He says I don't think like most people and my thought process is mixed up. I think he's probably right. I do think differently and have always had difficulty with friendships. This blurs the lines in arguments.

I am not talking to him at the moment which isn't a great marriage. The marriage has had other issues too and now I feel totally back to square one now. It's not a good way to live though with tension when you aren't speaking but right now I don't want to behave like normal to him.

I ve told him I will not put up with it again. I don't think it will escalate. I am lucky that I am financially and emotionally able to split from him and I would be ok. I don't want to though, it doesn't seem enough to split up over.

What is your own definition of abuse if not what you are describing?.

Abuse is about power and control.

Generally speaking, decent men do not tell their wife to F off as some sort of default. And how many times have you already put up with this till now; this is repeated behaviour from him. He does this because he can and feels entitled also to do so. He feels he is doing nothing wrong here re you. This will happen again and sadly you'll probably put up with it too.

You're still very much minimising this and the effects all this has on your children are many and varied. They know their friends parents do not behave like their dad does towards you as their mum.

I'll repeat OP.

Your poor children.

An abusive father.

A mother who is completely in denial.

A mother who is so lucky to be financially independent but chooses to stay.

Your children will grow up and judge you both very harshly.

Your husband for being abusive.

You for staying when you could have left and kept them safe.

IMO you will deserve their harsh judgement if you stay with this awful man.

As a mother, when you choose to have children, your first loyalty, above all others, is to keep them safe.

You are putting this awful abusive man, who by his behaviour, is abusing your children, ahead of your children.

Ring Women's aid if you want a second opinion.

You are very wrong to put this awful man ahead of your children.

I sincerely hope your children are brave enough to talk to people outside their home, so that this may be flagged.

They need protecting.

Just because he isn't abusive everyday that does not mean he isn't an abuser. He regularly verbally abuses you. That's enough. Your kids will know all is not well.

Think very hard about how you value yourself and how you value the happiness of your children. You say you have the financial wherewithal to leave - so do it! You and your DC deserve better than this.

@ilovesparky

I don't think he is an abuser. We bicker a lot and have fiery arguments and his default is to tell me to F off. He's called me a bitch before but never these words. This is not regularly and my dcs aren't scared in their beds. Although my dd did say she heard us arguing. I asked if she heard names and she said no. I don't like them hearing.

Yes, he is immature and irresponsible. Apparently I should have been more sympathetic but because he does the same thing time and time again in leaving things behind and never learns I probably do have more of a told you so approach. I didn't telepathically know he was making a mental checklist apparently. He finds it hard to admit fault ever. Even at work. He says I don't think like most people and my thought process is mixed up. I think he's probably right. I do think differently and have always had difficulty with friendships. This blurs the lines in arguments.

I am not talking to him at the moment which isn't a great marriage. The marriage has had other issues too and now I feel totally back to square one now. It's not a good way to live though with tension when you aren't speaking but right now I don't want to behave like normal to him.

I ve told him I will not put up with it again. I don't think it will escalate. I am lucky that I am financially and emotionally able to split from him and I would be ok. I don't want to though, it doesn't seem enough to split up over.

I think you need to reread this. It makes no sense and you’re making excuse after excuse for him.

He is abusive. The things you have posted here about him? That’s him abusing you. Not ‘fiery arguments’, abuse.

I’m sure this is incredibly hard to hear, and I’m sorry.

@pointythings

Just because he isn't abusive everyday that does not mean he isn't an abuser. He regularly verbally abuses you. That's enough. Your kids will know all is not well.

Think very hard about how you value yourself and how you value the happiness of your children. You say you have the financial wherewithal to leave - so do it! You and your DC deserve better than this.

I have done.

If this becomes regular or happens again I have told him in no uncertain terms I would go. I felt intimidated I was shaken. I am a strong person so would not stay. He knows that.

My definition of abuse- I guess something that isn't a one off and is physical or mental or financially and is over a long period of time.

I am arranging to meet with a friend this week to talk it out.

Haven't RTFT but I knew just from the thread title that my answer would be "no".

Anyone EVER getting in your face and screaming at you - is abusive. Anyone EVER calling you a bunch of vile names is abusive. Anyone EVER trying to convince you that these things are your fault afterwords is abusive.

You are being abused. It doesn't matter that it isn't all the time. It doesn't matter that when it happens you might be angry or shouting too. It's still you being abused.

Your kids have to be told that no one gets to speak to someone like that and stay around. Otherwise they will grow up thinking that this abuse is just a normal argument. And tolerate it (and other abuses) because it is all they know.

Time to put your big girl pants on and draw a line under this whole toxic mess of a relationship.

Is DH at all concerned about the effect the incident on the children ?

@SecretDoor

Is DH at all concerned about the effect the incident on the children ?

No, he brushes it off. He asked Ds if he heard and he said no and dd apparently didn't hear the words so he's unconcerned. I don't even like them hearing our arguments. Unfortunately I am guilty when they were younger of arguing in front of them too though. I don't want them growing up in that environment

@ilovesparky

They aren't in a toxic environment, this isn't everyday and they don't hear it normally.

We ve spoken more and he explained it was a build up over time because he was annoyed at me about a few things that happened on holiday. He says I am controlling and it's the 'sparky' show. All on my terms.

I am trying to see his side of the argument. I try not to be controlling and take his account on board. But the trouble is we do fundamentally disagree on lots of stuff so it's hard work as one of us always has to back down. I guess he feels like it's him. The trouble is I think the things I don't back down on or have cross with him over are justified.
1- he let our ds9 chase after me from the pub we are in to the shop- in an fairy unfamiliar village, which is busy with a narrow road that cars go along. I turned around and fortunately my son was there. But I had not been told he was coming, DH hadn't watched him to me and apparently he hasn't realised I had gone so far.
2- for spending £140 at a farm shop on over priced stuff which lasted us two days. Apparently he makes the money so should spend it how he likes, he doesn't look at prices.
3- getting the dcs to do their homework. Apparently they have too much, he didn't get it at that age and they shouldn't do it.

Apparently it's all my way. I can see his point but then 1 and 3 aren't negotiable to me. What does he want me to do?

Instead of communicating he was feeling like this he swears and calls me these names because I am irrational and couldn't see his point of view over the items he has left behind. He's frustrated over the lack of control he feels in the relationship. I am in charge. I do try and address these feelings, try to take his opinion on board, try to follow his POV. But it's difficult when I fundamentally disagree with so much of it and he does stupid things.

This doesn't excuse the way he spoke to me though

Once is enough. If he's calling you out regular trust me when I tell you, they hear it. You really need to make your plans and walk away from this abusive relationship. Your children deserve more !

What??? That's insane. No way. Totally unacceptable.

I am a child of a marriage like this. My father said those names to me and to my mother. She said on her deathbed she wished she had not stayed with him. You do not want your children to have the upbringing or adolescence or terrible relationship history I have had as a result either. It fucked me up bigtime. Do the right thing and end this marriage.

How often are you having 'fiery' arguments?
I feel so sorry for your children having to live in your home.

How ‘regular’ do you need the abuse to be before you recognise it as abuse? Daily? Weekly? What’s your cutoff point?

He screamed verbal abuse at you, didn’t apologise, and told you it was your fault and he was justified.

He screams at you and calls you names, not caring if your kids hear.

He’s endangered your child’s life, but somehow being upset about that is something that you’ve done wrong.

He sounds like an utterly shit and negligent father who has no respect for you. You’re trying to minimise his actions (which is understandable), but you need to stop.

1. he is verbally abusive towards you
2. he blames you for his loss of temper, making you responsible for his bad behaviour. This a what abusers do.
3. He lets the kids hear the abuse, the law now recognises that as abusive to the kids
4. he doesn't do it every day, so you are lulled into a false sense of security, thinking everything is OK, then he does it again.

You are being emotionally abused by him. You call him childish, but my ds aged 19 know that it is notacceptable to call anyone by those names, has known that for years. This is not childish behaviour, this is abusive behaviour.
Please leave. It will not get any better, it will get worse.

And I should add too that as a result of my upbringing and blurred lines wrt boundaries I married a twat just like this myself and needed a year of counselling and still have problems after I divorced him after 11 years of crap.

They were just words he said but he says he went too far. I don't think he realises how disrespectful it was.

He was trying to intimidate me. I am very strong willed so didn't back down. I wasn't scared and neither have the children ever been.

He feels he has no control in the marriage. That's why his pent up frustrations led to that. Is that a reason? I admit I am probably quite difficult. I don't think I am wired like most- I think I am on the spectrum.

@TooMuchPaper

How often are you having 'fiery' arguments? I feel so sorry for your children having to live in your home.

The fiery arguments defence is one my DW used recently when she threw an object and told me to fuck off out of the house and pretended to call the police to have me removed. She has used it for calling me a cunt and a gutless cretin in the past. For not letting me leave a room in an argument.

I have also minimised my behaviours - swearing, telling her to fuck off, leaving the house, hurling my wedding ring on the ground, leaving her alone late in town. Just a row...

We both came from homes with similar patterns of behaviour and so it seemed like normality to us.

However it isn't. It is abuse. If you allow your children to see this as 'normal' and 'fiery' then maybe the cycle will continue for them? Our children, from our previous marriages, witnessed some of between us. I have to live with the knowledge that some of their problems now are down to me.

Don't be me.

He dismisses it when I said he might escalate next time, he can't control his temper. He said it wouldn't he's not that guy. I do believe he wouldn't do that. But then I guess everyone says that before it happens. If he'd hit me I would be out the door.

I don't know. Somehow this seems like it's no a big enough reason to end the marriage and destroy the dcs lives over a one off. If it was regular I would leave in a flash.