So irritating having to constantly remind partner to take on mental load

[Fullyloaded]

E.g. I have to specifically point out things that need to be tidied up before the cleaner comes e.g. I come downstairs having been tidying upstairs to find my daughter's puzzle pieces all over the kitchen floor and partner's bowl on the side instead of in the dishwasher. "But I tidied the kitchen last night!" he says. Great, but the kitchen is now messy again and it needs to be tidy so she can clean. All of the heavy things I asked him to move last night are still on the landing. "But when you came up with my tea this morning you didn't tell me I had to move them straight away!" Yes, but you know the cleaner comes at 8am and she can't clean if they're not put away and she's now here. "You didn't tell me I had to strip the sheets!" We both sleep in that bed, and the cleaner will not be able to put the clean ones on if it's still made up. "Where are the clean sheets...?" OMFG!!!!!!!!!

And then if I ask for him to do multiple things I get told not to nag!!! JUST DO IT WITHOUT ME HAVING TO ASK!

Feeling very frustrated with the injustice of it all. I have talked to him about it, and in fairness he often is pretty good at making changes, but it just feels like an ongoing battle to remind him that if he calls himself a feminist he actually needs to assume an equal share of the mental load.

Tell me about your examples of partners shirking the mental load.

[quote Fullyloaded]@sunflowerfieldsofgold it's not preachy to ask at all :) and I agree that tidying as we go would be the most effective way, but it's tied up with what some people have been vigorously banging on about this whole thread, mismatched 'standards' and not wanting to be a harpy and being more flexible (those comments actually got right up my nose, because I let so much slide!!!!) I would prefer for things to be tidy all the time, but equally my partner is happy with a certain amount of mess. I don't want to spend my whole time tidying and equally I don't want to spend my whole time asking him to tidy stuff up. So we subsist on a kind of not bombsite but not totally tidy basis which seems to lead to the fewest conflicts (plus he has a cupboard where i can shove his stuff, which annoys him, but my response is 'well don't leave it out' which he can't argue with). The cleaning day has been a great way of getting my tidiness needs met because it's set in stone and we both know what the deal is, but does require a push from us both to get it done. Toddler stuff is tidied away most days, but I'm sure you can appreciate that in 10 mins unsupervised a toddler can create A LOT of mess![/quote]
I had 3 toddlers OP and DH was by far the worst!
Do you have too much stuff?
Everything in its place etc.
Once we had a huge declutter it made it much easier.
What does he leave lying around?
Books-bookshelf, cups/ plates- dishwasher/ sink, clothes -laundry bin.
If thats the case, he is being lazy and its not differing standards at all.

What would you have done if he’d sat you down and told you things had to change? Living with someone is all about compromise. You each have your bottom line, and the compromise is somewhere in the middle.

Listened!
I totally agree with compromise but the DH dont ever seem to want this just to accuse their OH of nagging etc.

Yes an adult conversation.

This is a real insight into how the partner not pulling their weight thinks, isn't it?

It's not that they don't realise they're not pulling their weight. It's that they have convinced themselves that not pulling their weight is actually evidence of their moral and intellectual superiority, because unlike the partner who is stopping them from living in squalor with their labour, they're simply too interesting and creative to bother with chores! Who has time for something as tedious as housework when you can be expanding your mind or socialising.

Of course, the endless tedium of household labour is good enough for the partner actually doing it, eh? They must love it! Or did it ever occur to you that they would also prefer to be seeing friends and reading interesting articles, and would have more time to do those things if you would pull your fucking weight instead of being so bloody selfish?

This is it really.
Especially if you have children. If you are allowing someone else to take on the mental and physical load of life admin and chores you are essentially saying that your time is more important.

@immersivereader

Same here. No idea why stuff doesn't occur to him.

It does occur to him but he thinks it’s your job. He knows that if he leaves it, you will do it.

Slow hand clap for @Soontobe60 for not rtft and missing the point.

Of course, the endless tedium of household labour is good enough for the partner actually doing it, eh? They must love it! Or did it ever occur to you that they would also prefer to be seeing friends and reading interesting articles, and would have more time to do those things if you would pull your fucking weight instead of being so bloody selfish?

This is it really.
Especially if you have children. If you are allowing someone else to take on the mental and physical load of life admin and chores you are essentially saying that your time is more important

Absolutely and the arguments are designed to stop you from ever bothering them again.

"Differing standards" is just being a lazy arse who doesnt want to do any chores.
As adults we have a responsibility to provide our DC with a clean, safe home.

" they must love it"

Interesting as Ive heard many men justify their lack of participation in childcare, laundry and grocery shopping as " my wife likes doing it"

After 7 years of living together I finally snapped this last few months. Everything just became too much.

I have and had been carrying the mental load for everything. Housework, sorting holidays or any days out, appointments, birthdays, anniversaries, have I seen his glasses/keys/phone because he misplaced them for the 100th time, what gifts he could get me because he didn't know so can I think of something...

Only advice I can offer is let him deal with the consequences.

In my case laundry was a big issue. I would put a load in the washing machine before work and all I would ask him is can you hang the clothes when it's done. I would come back and guess what clothes still in the machine or if I had hang them to dry I would ask him if he can fold and put away. Again I would come back from work and no change to said clothes. My solution? I stopped washing anything of his. I bought a seperate basket, put all his clothes in it. He knew of its existence and that it was his basket and his responsibility. Two weeks later he came to me complaining that he couldn't find any of his trousers and have I seen them anywhere. I just stood there smiling. It eventually dawned on him that they were all where he put them in his very own special basket. He pretty quickly learned how to operate the ''so complex'' new washing machine that was "too much" to handle before.

I also stopped knowing where everything is.
'Have you seen my keys'
'Nope'
'But you always know where everything is...'
'Nope'

Now guess what, he seems to have become an expert in finding things!

A few months ago GP put him on permanent medication. I declared from the start I wouldn't be reminding him to take them, order them, book review appointments or anything related to them. He could sort reminders on his phone.

I also stopped reminding him of important dates. As a result he forgot our anniversary this year and why oh why I didn't tell him in advance, I know he struggles with dates afterall! Poor lamb... Tables quickly turned when I pointed out he has a phone with a calendar he could have used to put a reminder on.

After that I have reached a stage where I don't care anymore about anything and he can see it. Ironically that seems to have put the fear in him as I now come home from work and things are tidier and he seems more organised and in control. Unfortunately, I feel detached and too little too late by this point.

I hear you OP.

I love my DH, and actually around the house and "housework" wise he's pretty good. Probably better than me actually.

For me though it's all the other stuff, mostly school/child

Dress up days
Wear insert colour/random item days
Sports day
Christmas/Easter/wednesday theme performance
Needs dropping off at school earlier
Needs picking up from school earlier
Eye appointments
Dental appointments
Needs new underpants/socks/shoes
Birthdays
Christmas
Easter eggs
Bills/utilities/adhoc school payments
Food shopping
Vet appointments
Reordering animal prescriptions

That's a rough list of my current to do list for the year, sure, if I tell DH to do xxx he will probably remember to do it. What annoys me is the having to walk him through it.

School stuff for example, we both get the Parentmail messages but he turned his off as he was getting pissed off with the volume and frequency of them. I agree, its relentless but by him checking out of that task it's obviously me that has to pick it up.

We both work full time. Sometimes I get so overwhelmed trying to think what needs sorting. Already we're late for those eye and dental appts, but i can't find 5 minutes to book them in. I need to take a day off work really. But he doesnt even have these tasks on his radar.

My exdh was like this. About 12 months after we split he drove his van into a gate post and wrote it off, the insurance company told him they'd only pay out a % of the value, due to the fact it didn't have an valid MOT. Oh how I laughed when he had a 'go at me' for not reminding him when the MOT was due for the van!

Have been living with my DH for 8 years, we have had many discussions (and arguments!) about the division of chores etc. Recently we listened to a book called 'Fairplay' on audible together. There is a pack of cards that goes with the book (can print them off the website). Not for everyone but we've found it helpful

Ugh I have a weekly battle with my DH about 'cleaning before the cleaner comes'. Of course my cleaner could load the dishwasher / tidy up etc (although how is she supposed to know where things go?) but I pay her to do the proper cleaning that we can't do whilst we're going along. Absolutely infuriating

In your situation I would suggest you take on the task of tidying and tell him his job is to strip the bed and then leave him to it. Tell the cleaner if the bed isn't stripped not to change it and then he can do the stripping and making himself. If he's got any sense he will soon learn to strip the bed but if he doesn't that's his lookout.
The problem with sharing the mental load is it often means you expecting him to do it exactly as you would and that is setting yourself up for disappointment and him to feel constantly nagged. Sit down together and make a list of tasks you each do and resist the temptation to comment on the way he does (or doesn't) do his but do agree to review the situation in two weeks and if he's not doing his share have an open conversation about why not and how/when/if it's actually going to get done.

@lechatnoir I'm afraid you've totally missed the point. My irritation is with having to tell him what to do full stop. He knows that the house needs to be tidy with everything put away and beds stripped by 8am every other Friday. Why do I then need to spoon-feed him tasks? Also, as I have expressed in pp, I don't give a flying shit HOW he does something, just that he does it without me having delegate it to him.

Some posters tie themselves into knots trying to ague that it’s not the man’s fault for for doing this. Their usual arguments are

1. You are asking in the wrong tone of voice or at the wrong time

1. Your standards are too high

1. You are controlling

1. He can’t see the mess because of his penis

1. It’s your fault because you should get a cleaner to do his half of the housework . Of course your need to recruit, manage, tidy up beforehand and pay for the cleaner for him. Because what you need is another task.

1. It’s your fault because you haven’t explained exactly what each job involves and when it should be done and reminded him.

1. It’s your fault because you have explained exactly what each job involves and when it should be done and reminded him.

1. Household admin takes “ literally 5 mins” and you are being unreasonable and dramatic to even consider it as a task.

No doubt there’s more I’ve forgotten 😬

4. He can’t see the mess because of his penis

@gannett

It's about always being the one that has to remember that things need doing.

As the slatternly half in my relationship the question I'd ask is: do things really need doing?

What happens if I leave a pile of clothes on the bedroom floor for a week? Nothing.

What happens if I leave a plate on the sideboard overnight even though the dishwasher is right there (and is in fact my job)? Nothing.

What happens if I don't hoover the stairs for two weeks? Nothing.

My home office, which DP doesn't get a say in, has chaotic piles of paper, mugs, reference books, three tops on the floor (that I can see) and for some unknown reason a plastic bag containing my hiking boots next to the printer. It's been there for months. I do not care and I like it like this. Equally my token efforts towards neatness in the rest of the house are only because DP is a neat freak, left to my own devices it'd be in much the same state as my office.

Does anything bad happen because my office is a tip? It does not. Does anything bad happen when DP is away and the rest of the house becomes a tip? It does not.

When a chore needs to be done straight away I'll do it (washing up, for instance). If it can be done tomorrow I'll do it tomorrow or even the next day. We both survive.

That is probably the mindset of all of your untidy partners. It's not that they don't bother taking on the mental load, it's that they don't think there's a mental load to take on because there are more important (and enjoyable) things to think about than bloody domestic chores. I would argue full-heartedly that reading the news online is a more worthwhile use of my time than sorting out those piles of papers, because being aware of current affairs is more important than being tidy. Ditto if I'm catching up wth friends or watching a film. Maintaining social relationships and having a cultural life are more important to me than being tidy.

Also, what on earth is the point of having a cleaner if "preparing for the cleaner to come round" turns into a chore of its own?

No, not "nothing". What happens is your DP can't relax in a clean and tidy home, which for clean and tidy people equates to them not being able to relax at all. Sothe only way they can get to relax is to do it all themselves, since the lazy party doesn't do their share. That's what breeds the resentment. That lack of respect for your DP feelings because you don't care if they're able to relax or not. That pile of clothes on the floor or unwashed dishes says "I don't respect you, I don't care how you feel" and that's a problem.

As I head into retirement with my dh, I am thinking that more and more, we should live apart. Maybe next door to each other but not in the same house. That way, each person can be as tidy or messy as they want and one is not a skivvy to the other.

I would find gannett a very difficult person slob to live with.

What do you mean nothing happens? I lose all respect for you because you can’t be bothered to make the home we both share look clean and tidy.

So we had a massive barny yesterday morning and I texted him after to say that the split of chores and mental load needs to be more balanced. I was very uncomfortable yesterday because my bump is really sore, but was sorting dinner when he got home. He was tired too, it was late, but he goes in quite a shirty way - "right then, do you need me to do something? What do you need me to do?" When I ignored him he asked me again and i gestured to the side stacked with plates, full dishwasher, rotting flowers, full brown bin, washing stacked on the table and was like "if you want to do something then pick something and do it, don't ask me!" And then this morning I tidied up a load of bags which he had dumped in the sitting room which were full of stuff he had cleared out of our car as just bought a new one. Irritated he had left them there I shoved them into his cupboard but he took one out and put it in mine, saying that I should look in it because it was my stuff. The contents? A pack of firelighters, a kid's spade and bag strap and bubble mix, a USB charger (which he uses for his cycling computer) and a soft baby toy. Yeah ALL my stuff. I sarcastically told him that yes he was right, the fact that the stuff wasn't for his sole personal use definitely meant it was my responsibility to sort out. URRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH.

Easter eggs.🤣🤣🤣
Who the chuff gets a boo on about Easter eggs.

It's like pets, they're just a bloody nuisance.
People get to together fill their lives with complex arrangements and liabilities, and then this crap crushes the relationship.

Reading some of these threads would make anyone want to live alone
It's torture.

@Hrpuffnstuff1 Easter eggs?? You what?

A fellow poster mentioned easter eggs..😳😂

I would actually phone the cleaner and tell her you have a strange request but when she comes on X day, if there is anything she cannot do such as can't put the bedding on because the bed is not stripped or can't hoover because there are toys on the floor to please NOT tidy things away or strip the beds but leave whatever cannot be done without doing those extra things and tell her that of course she will be paid in full but you really need her to do this

Then when your husband sees the bed wasn't made, bits weren't cleaned and floors weren't hoovered you say yes, that's because the cleaner was unable to do her job since you didn't do what you needed to do

I've told her that is what to do from now on. If there's stuff that shouldn't be there, leave the task undone

@Fullyloaded, I was going to suggest exactly what @IncompleteSenten said above. Maybe when he sees the consequences of his lack of forethought it might actually sink in, and if he dares to ask why you didn't remind him or didn't tidy the place yourself you can remind him what feminism is!

[quote Pinkbucket]@1MillionDollars
The fact that you even think you ca. Get online abd tell a woman
You think
The OP thinks ….
Women think ….
Show your incredible ignorance and tendency to mansplain. You’re not helping women at all . Your trying to act superior and like you know all about women which you don’t[/quote]
It's so nice getting it all explained by a man, if only I'd had a man around to tell me, that the dirty dishes STBXH puts away and being screamed at over the laundry were completely reasonable, because you know, 'differing standards', maybe our marriage wouldn't be on the rocks. I don't recognise many posters, this guy stands out because he does this a lot, but you know man, so our lived experience obviously counts for nothing now.