So irritating having to constantly remind partner to take on mental load

[Fullyloaded]

E.g. I have to specifically point out things that need to be tidied up before the cleaner comes e.g. I come downstairs having been tidying upstairs to find my daughter's puzzle pieces all over the kitchen floor and partner's bowl on the side instead of in the dishwasher. "But I tidied the kitchen last night!" he says. Great, but the kitchen is now messy again and it needs to be tidy so she can clean. All of the heavy things I asked him to move last night are still on the landing. "But when you came up with my tea this morning you didn't tell me I had to move them straight away!" Yes, but you know the cleaner comes at 8am and she can't clean if they're not put away and she's now here. "You didn't tell me I had to strip the sheets!" We both sleep in that bed, and the cleaner will not be able to put the clean ones on if it's still made up. "Where are the clean sheets...?" OMFG!!!!!!!!!

And then if I ask for him to do multiple things I get told not to nag!!! JUST DO IT WITHOUT ME HAVING TO ASK!

Feeling very frustrated with the injustice of it all. I have talked to him about it, and in fairness he often is pretty good at making changes, but it just feels like an ongoing battle to remind him that if he calls himself a feminist he actually needs to assume an equal share of the mental load.

Tell me about your examples of partners shirking the mental load.

@1MillionDollars nowhere on this thread of responses from almost 100% woman has anyone used any of those phrases. There has been some solidarity, some useful advice and some people pointing out that they're lucky that their partner is better than mine (and I am genuinely happy for them, because there shouldn't be this gap in male/female relationships, but sadly it is extremely common given the dynamic which has endured since historic times.)

@Fullyloaded

Come back one day when people don't agree with what you say. It can get very nasty.

Just because you hear what you want to hear, doesn't make it right.

I’m no skivvy, although it’s taken a while to get my husband up to scratch . We do spend a good hour or two tidying so that the cleaner can clean, he understands the alternatives are to spend even more on a cleaner as otherwise they won’t be able to clean in the allotted time after tidying, or having them just be paid to tidy up our shit, and it clean.
In your situation, I think I would sit down, have a calm discussion and ask is it fair I have ti explain these things to you? Then say I hate it. I hate it passionately not being able to live with you as an equal but having to manage these situations. Tidying is not a complex concept. So from now on, every time I have to, I give myself a management for basic shit point. It’s not fun, and I shouldn’t have to do it. Every ten points I take half a day off or £50 to spend on whatever I want or whatever works for you. That way you understand there is a cost to my time and it’s not fair, and hopefully I can be less furious about it as for the first time it’s being recognised in some way. It’s not like you’ve ever appreciated it. This will mean you have to skip some football /pub sessions as ive earned time out on my own, and may have less money for them and us for takeaways so you will have to step up and cook on those days, as money doesn’t grow on trees.

[quote 1MillionDollars]@Pinkbucket

This place is full of people telling other women how men think and behave, maybe I'm allowed, from a mans perspective, to say how a man thinks a woman thinks.

We are so different it's ridiculously ridiculous. For me that's a big part of the problem.[/quote]
You are more than welcome to say ‘ I think women think …. ‘
It’s quite another thing to say ‘ women think… ‘ and you think …’. And ‘ the ‘OP thinks … ‘ as if you are the authority .
You simply cannot say how I or any other women thinks unless they tell you
You can say what you think even if it’s wrong
Yes we are different , because I understand that not all men or all women think the same and I also understand that I cannot say ‘ you think ….. ‘ to someone and tell them how they think!
It’s incredibly entitled and a big part of the problem many women have with men trying to tell us what we think and feel .

@1MillionDollars

If you don’t understand why that is wrong I honestly think you need to think about it . I don’t think there’s one women on this site or irl who will appreciate you going up to her and telling her ‘ let me tell you how you think ‘ let me tell you how women think ‘

[quote 1MillionDollars]@Fullyloaded

Come back one day when people don't agree with what you say. It can get very nasty.

Just because you hear what you want to hear, doesn't make it right.[/quote]
People are not being nasty to you and that’s a really manipulative statement to make .
You’ve been called out for telling women, how they think !
Why don’t you just admit that was wrong

@timeisnotaline

I’m no skivvy, although it’s taken a while to get my husband up to scratch . We do spend a good hour or two tidying so that the cleaner can clean, he understands the alternatives are to spend even more on a cleaner as otherwise they won’t be able to clean in the allotted time after tidying, or having them just be paid to tidy up our shit, and it clean. In your situation, I think I would sit down, have a calm discussion and ask is it fair I have ti explain these things to you? Then say I hate it. I hate it passionately not being able to live with you as an equal but having to manage these situations. Tidying is not a complex concept. So from now on, every time I have to, I give myself a management for basic shit point. It’s not fun, and I shouldn’t have to do it. Every ten points I take half a day off or £50 to spend on whatever I want or whatever works for you. That way you understand there is a cost to my time and it’s not fair, and hopefully I can be less furious about it as for the first time it’s being recognised in some way. It’s not like you’ve ever appreciated it. This will mean you have to skip some football /pub sessions as ive earned time out on my own, and may have less money for them and us for takeaways so you will have to step up and cook on those days, as money doesn’t grow on trees.

. . . If that works for you fair enough. You're still treating him like a child. If you don't do this, then I am going to do this to show you why you shouldn't do that.

For fuck sake. Just say I'm fucking pissed if that you don't do this, dirt your shut out or we're fucking done you ducking mama's fucking boy man child. I'm not your fucking mother, never will be, if you want a mum then fuck of back home.

@Pinkbucket

Please just bugger off. I don't want to argue. You think this and I think that.

It's my opinion. I might be wrong, I really don't care. You think men are this, I think women are that.

We both have different perspectives. I'm just giving mine, from what I've learnt/seen/experienced.

‘ For fuck sake. Just say I'm fucking pissed if that you don't do this, dirt your shut out or we're fucking done you ducking mama's fucking boy man child. I'm not your fucking mother, never will be, if you want a mum then fuck of back home.’

Actually this , we agree on . I would have no hesitation in telling him left your game, giving him an opportunity to clean up after himself and if he didn’t then asking him to leave it getting a place myself that I could have reasonable tidy . That’s if he refuses to clean up after himself

@Pinkbucket

‘ For fuck sake. Just say I'm fucking pissed if that you don't do this, dirt your shut out or we're fucking done you ducking mama's fucking boy man child. I'm not your fucking mother, never will be, if you want a mum then fuck of back home.’

Actually this , we agree on . I would have no hesitation in telling him left your game, giving him an opportunity to clean up after himself and if he didn’t then asking him to leave it getting a place myself that I could have reasonable tidy . That’s if he refuses to clean up after himself

. . . You see. I'm actually trying to stand up for women here.

I agree with that . What I didn’t agree with was you telling women how they feel

@Pinkbucket

‘ For fuck sake. Just say I'm fucking pissed off that you don't do this, sort your shit out or we're fucking done you fucking mama's fucking boy man child. I'm not your fucking mother, never will be, if you want a mum then fuck of back home.’

Typos Corrected

I'd give the cleaner 2 weeks off (paid, your issue not hers) and leave him to it.

@Pinkbucket

People get upset all the time by what I say. They either think I'm being this or that or I e not explained/come across properly.

I am not telling anybody what to think. I am just saying how I think. I don't know if I'm right or wrong, these are just my thoughts and I go with them and I'm willing to be corrected. Unfortunately I think that this site is very biased, especially when a man comes along.

Well you can flat out refuse to let him use the word nag ever again. It's a nasty misogynistic word used against women.

You can tell him so and to never use it again. A man reminds his wife to, therefore a woman reminds her husband to.

"STOP REMINDING ME!" doesn't have quite the same impact does it ....

@Wotsitsits funnily enough I said that exact thing to him this morning, that it was misogynistic to complain that I was 'nagging' him. He HATES it when I suggest he is being misogynistic, it's a sure fire way to get him to listen. He does actually consider himself a feminist and is very forward thinking in a lot of ways (not that any man should get special praise for doing their share, but just to illustrate that he's not a total bell end and does try to better himself) so it really cuts deep when I say it. I save it for when he's consistently dropping the ball and needs to step up. It's frustrating though that he clearly wants to be a decent man and partner and yet STILL this stuff is so ingrained that it's a constant battle to remind him and call him out on it. It's like that phrase "but I helped you with x y z around the house." No you didn't fucking HELP ME, you just did something around the house that you have 50% responsibility for!

[quote 1MillionDollars]@Pinkbucket

People get upset all the time by what I say. They either think I'm being this or that or I e not explained/come across properly.

I am not telling anybody what to think. I am just saying how I think. I don't know if I'm right or wrong, these are just my thoughts and I go with them and I'm willing to be corrected. Unfortunately I think that this site is very biased, especially when a man comes along.[/quote]
Perhaps if people always get offended at what you say, you perhaps need to look in the mirror rather than blindly criticising and telling others that they are wrong.

This is not about different standards. This is yet again about a man wanting a certain outcome without putting in the real effort or mental load to get there. Sure "NAMALT", but too many bloody well are.

@Wotsitsits if I ever hear nag I say that word only exists because people usually men are so very good at continuously actively shirking something boring because they assume they are too special and important for it and lesser people in their lives will do it for them.

Me - I know you said you are struggling to get your mum a birthday present, so I’ve been out and bought presents and cards.

Him - ‘thanks’

Me, after several reminders that he needs to wrap the presents, as we leave to take his mother out for dinner on her birthday ‘I’ve wrapped your presents. Have you looked in the gift bag and written the cards?’

‘No I thought you’d done that’

‘It’s your mother, not mine.’

Cue weeks of then trying to get him to reimburse me

@1MillionDollars I’m trying to think of solutions that don’t involve leaving, nor the op nagging her partner. She doesn’t seem to want to leave. Obviously if they don’t change then you think this is serious. I have to confess I’d have left my dh many times if I took that approach, while I’m now married to a competent man who shares the parenting load so we can both manage busy full time jobs. He’s done the meal plan and weekly online shop today, run up the street for milk and bread, prepped and taken the dc to swimming lessons and showered them after then made them lunch, stripped beds. However years ago when we had just started having a cleaner I did go out one evening before the cleaners day, came home and nothign had been done. He had been out this night several times and I’d taken care of it. I woke him up at midnight to tidy the house. I’m not suggesting she just tolerate it, but this is a strategy.

Re some of the other comments, men are often less understanding that even with good partners, women’s lives often involve a lot more negotiation and training than men would take on in the same position, and you need to understand you’re coming from a different place. Blame the complete lack of emphasis in society on training men to be competent humans (and in my case my pil)

@1MillionDollars, you certainly took the wrong end of the stick. The book I suggested does not invite women to “surrender” to their men but to stop treating them as kids.

My partner and I saw the book in a charity shop and bought it as a joke (every man who has been in a relationship with me knows far too well I do not take ANY shit). Interestingly, only at reading parts of it I realised why it had become a bestseller so many years ago, it makes sense but after the mess of my divorce settlement I wouldn’t let ANY man manage my finances, once burnt and all that!

@timeisnotaline

I'm not sure where anybody makes assumptions of me, I literally don't know where it comes from. Let's just say this....believe me if you want to or not.

I have spent 12 years at home. I've been with my kids EVERY single motherfucking day. I have set up 3 business's (not million pounds ones) I've done other things too. I've also done 50% of the childcare at every turn apart from breastfeeding,so when I see the hateful comments towards men here I gets little annoyed.

I've fucking done it all and I resent it completely when I am told I am a man and we have it easy. Fuck that fucking shit, that's not fair on the men that do ACTUALLY pull their weight.

My ex did nothing. The only time she did something was when I supported her for 2 years whilst she studied full time snd I took care of everything else.

As mumsnet call it. The reverse.

So I've experienced the reverse.

@1MillionDollars ... hmmm sahd to your wifes adult children...how does that work. Were you unemployed?

[quote 1MillionDollars]@Pinkbucket

People get upset all the time by what I say. They either think I'm being this or that or I e not explained/come across properly.

I am not telling anybody what to think. I am just saying how I think. I don't know if I'm right or wrong, these are just my thoughts and I go with them and I'm willing to be corrected. Unfortunately I think that this site is very biased, especially when a man comes along.[/quote]
Go back and read what you wrote
You actually wrote
Women think this
Then you told Us OP thinks this
Then you told me ‘ you think this …’
How do you know what women think what OP thinks or what I think . Surely your intelligent enough to realise that your experiences with your mother do not give you some special mind reading ability ?
People tend not to like being told how they think . People are their own authorities in themselves and ken have been telling women what they think since the day dot . Don’t do that