DD and boyfriend -- has anyone ever successfully got past this?

[thepeopleversuswork]

Please be gentle with me on this: I know its a contentious subject and lots of you will say I shouldn't be dating at all, but its causing me a lot of heartache at the moment.

Have been with my boyfriend for two years. We don't live together. I have a 9 year old DD. When I first met him I was very clear that we had to take things very slowly -- she didn't meet him for six months etc and moving in was not on the horizon any time in the short to medium term. For about the next six months he stayed at mine once a week. After about a year I slowly started to increase this so he was staying two nights a week. Then lockdown happened and we didn't see each other for nearly four months. We slowly started seeing one another in the summer.

DD's dad is under an injunction due to previous DV so she can't stay at his: the only time I get time away from her is with sleepovers etc, which obviously isn't allowed at the moment. And this, combined with lockdown, means the only way I can see him at the moment is if he comes to my house.

DD has become marginally more tolerant of my bf over time but basically she would rather he wasn't around. She is adamant that she doesn't want my bf staying at mine. After lockdown ended and when I first started seeing him again I anticipated this and told him he couldn't stay more than one night a week and would need to leave early in the mornings. He's been very accepting of this. He has generally been incredibly patient about everything.

DD is still very unhappy about him being in my life at all. She's had outbursts at him within minutes of his arriving and asked him to leave the house and he's always gone along with this. I've talked to her about it and she basically says she wants him to go away and doesn't want to share me with him. I asked her if she could ever imagine a scenario where he lived with us and she said no.

I've done some soul searching to think if there is anything he has done which could have upset or frightened her and there genuinely has been nothing. I've been incredibly careful about making sure she and I have plenty of quality time together on our own, he's rarely here for long during daylight hours and so forth. She obviously would prefer if I was back with her dad, but we have been separated since she was just four, so it isn't a new scenario.

I'm really agonising over how to deal with this now. When we first got together I anticipated that if I took things slowly and if he was patient with her she would eventually start to come around to him and she is still, two years in, pretty hostile to him. It's so difficult because he's incredibly patient and respectful and she is frankly horrible to him. He's still very kind and accepting of it but I can't help thinking eventually he will run out of patience.

The bottom line is that she comes first and if push comes to shove I would and will drop him for her, absolutely no question. But I feel like if she can't accept someone who is so obviously supportive of her and loves me, she may never accept anyone else. Maybe the reality is I have to make peace with the fact that I won't be able to have a relationship with someone until she has moved out.

I'm just curious to know if anyone else has been through something similar and got past it, how long it took and generally if anyone has any advice?

How long ago did you split with your DD's dad? Did she witness the DV? Or aware of it in any way?

My first instinct is - there doesn't have to be a reason for her to be uncofomfortable with the situation. She just is. She is able to express that to you - which is great that she is able to do that. And you say you will put her feelings first - so she must feel reassured by that.

It sounds like you will need to keep taking it slow for a while longer though.

Griefmonster we split five years ago, but we were in fairly regular contact with him (seeing him twice a week roughly) until the incident which triggered the injunction.

She never witnessed any DV. There were only two incidents of actual violence, it was mainly verbal abuse and she was never in the room when it took place (in fact both the violent incidents took place after we had split when she was out of the home and he came over to my flat), but he's said faintly menacing things to her about me on occasion and has also badmouthed my boyfriend to her.

I understand that she has a right to feel safe and that she doesn't need a reason not to be happy about it and that is my absolute priority. If she's not happy about my bf not being around that's how it will be.

I guess what I'm wondering is whether I can have any expectation she will ever get past it, really.

I've said to my boyfriend throughout that she will come round over time. But I'm increasingly starting to wonder if that will be the case.

Ok I'm going to put my steel pants on for this one.....

Imho you've handled the situation appropriately apart from one aspect and that's putting up with your DD's behaviour for so long.

Her being rude to him within minutes of him being in the house is unacceptable.

You're teaching her that she can use your love for her to manipulate you and bend you to her will. That's not a good life lesson.

You're a mother not a martyr.

You shouldn't be expected to remove someone you presumably have strong feelings for (who by all accounts has been understanding and kind wrt your DD) from your life.

In truth when she's older and more mature I'll bet she looks back on her behaviour with regret.

In you're position I'd be inclined to sit her down and simply say that you're not putting up with her antics any more.

I'm not suggesting he moves in, but I think you need a zero tolerance on her rudeness and her being able to force your boyfriend to leave because she demands it.

I think because you allow her so much control in this regard she's never going to come to terms with you having a boyfriend because of course for her the best in her eyes is to have Mum to herself and all you've taught her is that what she wants goes - so of course she's going to push for all she can get and carry on as she has been doing.

What she doesn't appreciate is that having a happy, well supported, well loved Mum is the thing that's in her best interests.

I understand your concerns. It's such a difficult situation. I have a son of a similar age, and had to navigate some of this when I met my husband. I think you're being very responsible.

Your daughter has every right to feel however she does, and of course you must hear her, and respond appropriately to any concerns.

But you are entitled to live, and love again. You are an adult, and can make the choice to be in a relationship, as long as you are vigilant, and have no cause to think that there is anything unsafe about your choice of partner.

Agree with a pp that you are likely going to need to continue taking slow steps, but also think you need to be loving but firm with your daughter about how you wish to proceed. Ours understandable that sue should want it to remain just the two of you, especially in the context of DV with her father. Her trust and confidence needs to be gently and consistently rebuilt.

What @DeRigueurMortis said. You and BF have both been kind loving and sensitive to her needs, but it is not in your or your DD's interests to allow her to rule the roost.

Wow; so many typos 😂

It's understandable that she is nervous, in the context of previous DV- that's what I meant to say.

But essentially I agree with the posters above. You're not doing anything wrong. And you shouldn't be resigned to being alone until your daughter moves out!

I think @DeRigueurMortis is right and you need to put a stop to the rudeness, but I also think you perhaps need to look at the root cause of this. My guess is that she's got into her head that you have a finite amount of love. She thinks you fell out of love with her dad - perhaps because she came along and you didn't have enough for both of them. So if he comes along, chances are he will take her place as you don't have enough love to love him and her at the same time.
As an adult it's silly, but as a child it's a real fear.
So I'd definitely tackle her rudeness but I'd preface it with lots of reassurance and I'll never stop loving you, love you any less, this will always be your home etc etc.

Thanks everyone. It's so difficult to pick a way through this. I'm terrified of traumatising or hurting her by putting myself first. I am very keenly aware of the fact that her feelings are her feelings and she has every right to them and that she needs to come first.

But I also know in my rational mind that my boyfriend has been unbelievably patient and tolerant and doesn't deserve to be kept on ice indefinitely because of this.

If you have brought your daughter up well, then you will have taught her how to be polite and kind etc etc.. so why does she get away with such rudeness to someone who has don her no wrong ?

She needs to be told she is being rude no matter what she thinks about him and you - it is out of order behaving like this.

As far as nurturing the relationship between them goes, it's baby steps.
You could try telling her that he thinks she is clever/bright/etc.. just to break the ice.

I think it's time for a chat with DD about her behaviour towards other people. It's not OK to treat others like she has. She has won so many times she now thinks she can stamp her fett and get what she wants. It won't change over night. And it's a sensitive subject but change needs to happen. You deserve to be happy. So does your DD. But she doesn't get to rule the roost anymore.

Ask her if she would be happy if you were rude to her friends and denied her from having any... Sadly a life lesson in the world not revolving around her is a must imo.

Lurchermom

I have reassured her endlessly about this: I've told her she will always come first and that I love her more than anyone etc.

I agree with @DeRigueurMortis

While it's good that you aren't prioritising a man over your DD, she shouldn't be allowed to be so rude to him either. I think you need to set some very clear boundaries here.
Staying 1 - 2 nights per week sounds like a very reasonable balance to me.
She's 9, not a baby. You're allowed to have your own life too.

Basically agree with everyone above - she is likely worried and stressed by it, but she cannot be rude to someone like that for no reason, no matter who they are. You need to really come down hard on that.

However I bet there is a lot going on in her little head and she was probably a lot more aware of the dynamic between you and ex than you think. And the ex saying bad things about your bf will probably have made quite a bit worse.

How do you and her talk about your ex nowadays? How does she feel about not seeing him?

And has she ever had any counselling, or would you be able to pay for some?

You don’t deserve to be alone until she moves out, you deserve happiness in your life too

I've told her she will always come first and that I love her more than anyone etc.

Of course that's true and good for her to know, but she also needs to know that the universe doesn't revolve around her. She also needs to know that she is not the only person you love/will love.

She's making you her emotional hostage. This needs to stop, as does her outrageously rude behaviour.

I agree with pp...

You've done everything right! Is her behaviour and issue in general? She shouldn't be getting away with being rude to him. She's old enough to know right from wrong.

Can you afford counselling for her? May be good for her to discuss with an impartial person. Obviously I understand this may not be an option.

Thisisnotnormal69 she has had counselling before and is having some informally at school -- its just started and I don't know really how she's got on with it.

It's very tricky with the ex: he and I have a functionally cordial relationship on a day to day basis. His mental health is quite bad and he will occasionally lash out at me and be verbally abusive (never within her earshot) so I have to be careful. She speaks to him several times a week.

I've talked to her a little about the fact that I no longer want to be with him, he is my good friend but we no longer make each other happy. I have said Daddy is a good man and he loves you very much and he sometimes used to get angry with me and I didn't want to live with him. That's as far as I've gone in explaining the marriage breakdown etc. I am absolutely hardline about not wanting to badmouth him to her but I also want her to understand that I had serious reasons for wanting not to be with him any more. Its a tricky balance tbh. I'm not sure I've got it right.

You can have no expectations of her getting past this unless you take back control. A nine yo child should not be rude to an adult without reason... you’re showing her she can be rude for no reason and on the back of this asking him to leave. Not sure why he has returned tbh. Talk to her. Put in some boundaries. I think it will take time to resolve now, as she is used to getting her own way , and you have encouraged that behaviour. Of course our children come first, but you don’t have to feel guilty forever that you’re not with her dad!

I think inadvertently and understandably to make your DD your priority you ve given her way too much power in this situation. Which is actually quite scary for a child. (No matter how much they seem to suggest otherwise). The most anxious 17 year old I know was an only child who ran every single decision in her home, from where she slept, to when and if her parents went out etc etc.

Firmly stating some boundaries around her behaviour and how guests to your home are treated will serve her much much better in life. You’re a kind and caring mother but also you deserve some happiness too.

I do agree with other PPs... to a point.

But based on your background, with both emotional and physical abuse, I’d be amazed if your DD was not aware of it and that will have left scars. You’ve not really mentioned (I don’t think) whether your DD still sees your ex, whether she’s happy about it etc... There’s a lot to unpick there as she’ll love him, but possibly be frightened of him depending on what she’s heard/seen, maybe missing him and feeling guilty etc...

I’d be very careful not to just write off your DD’s behaviour as rude without looking into what may be causing this quite extreme reaction. Has she had any counselling ? I think this might just give you the key on how to move forward.

What steps have you taken about her rudeness and behaviour towards him? Would you allow her to treat anyone else that way? No. So why him?

You can still give her all the support and love and reassure her, but she needs to learn (and you should be teaching her) that she doeant get to behave that way and get what she wants.

Frankly, she is old enough to understand that you have a boyfriend and her rudeness isnt acceptable. You need to be firmer here.

You have a little madam there. If he has truly been kind towards her, and you are only seeing him mostly when she is asleep and have more time with her alone than with him, then she needs to accept you are allowed a personal life. Rudeness and demands aren't nice.

I agree with pp. You've already done enough to prove you're a kind caring doting mother and you've put your relationship (which you deserve) on hold with a, seemingly kind and patient man to cow tow to your daughter. She's 9 not 4. She doesn't get to rule the roost. The more you molly coddle her the more she'll use it to manipulate you into doing what she wants. God help you in the teenage years if this carries on. You need to drop the guilt and set some boundaries. You won't tolerate rudeness to your company for a start. You're obviously a wise and sensible woman. It's not like your bringing home randomers for her to tolerate every other week. Your partner will eventually run out of patience you know. Just start with some boundaries for your daughter and get some special one to one time in there too just to give it a nice balance

Do you think your ex could have more to do with this then you think? Either in the way that your daughter feels loyalty to her dad and is refusing to allow a bond to grow with your DP because of this, or could your ex actually be saying things to her? When my parents broke up my dad would tell me to act up whenever my mums new boyfriend came round, he would also tell me to make my little brother upset by telling him dad was all alone and crying etc. I think you need to get out of her the reasons why she is so upset and then you need to be firm and let her know that although you're considering her feelings, you are the adult who is in charge

I have reassured her endlessly about this: I've told her she will always come first and that I love her more than anyone etc.

The problem here OP is that even though that's true, she's interpreted that to mean she gets to make big life decisions for you.

That she gets the final say and rules the roost.

Your post reminded me so much of the flip side I see on the step parent forum.

The step parent is expected to put up with appalling behaviour and is never backed up by the parent because the child always "comes first". Eventually the parent is baffled as to how they've raised a child that's self centred, entitled and totally unprepared for life in the sense of having every whim indulged and struggles to survive in a world where that doesn't happen.

Of course she's your number one priority but you've really got to put your foot down here on her behaviour.

You can still take it slow, give her reassurance etc but you absolutely shouldn't pander to rudeness or enabling her to ask your BF to leave the house.

She's got no incentive to come to terms with your relationship because given her too much power so she doesn't have to.