DD and boyfriend -- has anyone ever successfully got past this?

[thepeopleversuswork]

Please be gentle with me on this: I know its a contentious subject and lots of you will say I shouldn't be dating at all, but its causing me a lot of heartache at the moment.

Have been with my boyfriend for two years. We don't live together. I have a 9 year old DD. When I first met him I was very clear that we had to take things very slowly -- she didn't meet him for six months etc and moving in was not on the horizon any time in the short to medium term. For about the next six months he stayed at mine once a week. After about a year I slowly started to increase this so he was staying two nights a week. Then lockdown happened and we didn't see each other for nearly four months. We slowly started seeing one another in the summer.

DD's dad is under an injunction due to previous DV so she can't stay at his: the only time I get time away from her is with sleepovers etc, which obviously isn't allowed at the moment. And this, combined with lockdown, means the only way I can see him at the moment is if he comes to my house.

DD has become marginally more tolerant of my bf over time but basically she would rather he wasn't around. She is adamant that she doesn't want my bf staying at mine. After lockdown ended and when I first started seeing him again I anticipated this and told him he couldn't stay more than one night a week and would need to leave early in the mornings. He's been very accepting of this. He has generally been incredibly patient about everything.

DD is still very unhappy about him being in my life at all. She's had outbursts at him within minutes of his arriving and asked him to leave the house and he's always gone along with this. I've talked to her about it and she basically says she wants him to go away and doesn't want to share me with him. I asked her if she could ever imagine a scenario where he lived with us and she said no.

I've done some soul searching to think if there is anything he has done which could have upset or frightened her and there genuinely has been nothing. I've been incredibly careful about making sure she and I have plenty of quality time together on our own, he's rarely here for long during daylight hours and so forth. She obviously would prefer if I was back with her dad, but we have been separated since she was just four, so it isn't a new scenario.

I'm really agonising over how to deal with this now. When we first got together I anticipated that if I took things slowly and if he was patient with her she would eventually start to come around to him and she is still, two years in, pretty hostile to him. It's so difficult because he's incredibly patient and respectful and she is frankly horrible to him. He's still very kind and accepting of it but I can't help thinking eventually he will run out of patience.

The bottom line is that she comes first and if push comes to shove I would and will drop him for her, absolutely no question. But I feel like if she can't accept someone who is so obviously supportive of her and loves me, she may never accept anyone else. Maybe the reality is I have to make peace with the fact that I won't be able to have a relationship with someone until she has moved out.

I'm just curious to know if anyone else has been through something similar and got past it, how long it took and generally if anyone has any advice?

I’m sure she has good reasons for feeling like she does but as others have said you are giving her too much control. She asks him to leave and he leaves! She needs you to be the strong, in control adult. If she gets upset you can deal with that and hopefully find a way to move forward together rather than her dictating what happens. She’s only 9 and really can’t be given that much responsibility.

@DeRigueurMortis good post. Very wise

Repeating what most have said. Rudeness is not ok and she needs to be told this and proper consequences put in place. This isn’t you putting him ahead of her this is teaching her good manners. She doesn’t have to like him or the situation but she does need to accept it. You have allowed her territorial rights to your entire being and that co-dependency can be as damaging as feeling abandoned (which appears to be what you’re worried about) in terms of her feeling like you are choosing him over her, you need to talk to her about this openly and honestly. Explain that that will never happen but that you need other support and that he is part of that support now. She may resent him and you may need to help her with dealing with these emotions but rudeness and not allowing him in the house is not ok. You are the adult and you need to guide her. She will struggle and so will you and DP but it sounds like it’s worth the struggle as he has shown a great level of understanding and patience.

Children come first when it comes to getting their needs met. They don't always come first when it comes to their wants and neither should they.
You are allowed a social life and a relationship. Your daughter shouldn't get to dictate that you don't, providing she is kept safe and not neglected.

It is possible to blend a family. My niece introduced her new chap to her kids, slowly, and now they’re a happy family of five, the new baby is adored.

It can be done but you need to take back control and certainly rein in the bad manners. Your daughter won’t share you because you enable her behaviour. But there’s no reason why you can’t take your relationship forwards.

She isn't going to change though, however softly softly you go, as she's got exactly what she wanted- she's mean, nasty, and rude and he leaves, result! Mum all to herself, reassurance she's the top priority and the sun around which everyone else revolves. I think everyone is right, this is actually a scary place for a child. She's older now and it's fine to say- I need this, I'm a mum and I'm going to have a boyfriend, just like when you get older, you would like someone too. No rudeness to any guests, not just boyfriends. Reward being polite (she doesn't have to like him or want to hang out heaps). Perhaps in time it might be worth her seeing a counsellor or doing some play/art therapy as at the moment she's only got you to express any emotions too and I know that gets draining, I've been in that situation. You might also benefit just to talk things through and help you reflect.

It sounds like her dad may be saying things to her to make her uncomfortable about your new relationship?

I also think you may be making a mistake by letting her dictate when you boyfriend is allowed to come over - if it has been two years then it is not a new thing. You can continue to put her first without having to sabotage your own life. Remember in 9 years she may be off to University and you may be wishing you hadn't ended that relationship.

I agree that you have let her have too much control. You are understandably wary of upsetting her but she will be quite happy to have you all to herself. She's old enough to be told that he is important to you and you want him to be there for you, but she will never decide to allow it unless you make it clear that is what is going to happen.

Of course she may have concerns that you should listen to and try to resolve, but she can't be allowed to dictate how you live your life and who you see. She needs to know that adults have needs too, and that meeting your needs doesn't mean hers won't be met ( her needs, not her wants).

Agree also with @DeRigueurMortis

It's such a balancing act isn't it...on the one hand you don't want to allow a situation where a new partner comes in and isn't kind to the DC, but equally a situation where DC rule the roost isn't much better.

I wonder whether in trying to keep him out of the way, so he's not there when she's awake etc this has made things worse somehow? Before the current lockdown did you do days out together, or was it really just him visiting at home? I just wonder whether spending more time all together outside the house (when this lockdown eventually finishes) might help if she feels unhappy with him being around.

Also how is she with other visitors at home generally - is she happy for you to have friends around generally? Is it just your DP she has an issue with or anyone she feels is taking your time/ attention from her?

Do you not think you should be more age-appropriately honest about her father?

I've talked to her a little about the fact that I no longer want to be with him, he is my good friend but we no longer make each other happy. I have said Daddy is a good man and he loves you very much and he sometimes used to get angry with me and I didn't want to live with him. That's as far as I've gone in explaining the marriage breakdown etc. I am absolutely hardline about not wanting to badmouth him to her but I also want her to understand that I had serious reasons for wanting not to be with him any more. Its a tricky balance tbh. I'm not sure I've got it right.

He isn't a particularly good man, and you're not good friends. Why are you telling her that? And what is he saying to her about your relationship?

I went through this with DS1, who was 10 when I met my partner. (DS2 is 3 years younger and he was fine).

DS1 hated me having a partner, absolutely hated it. My kids are donor conceived so there was no father on the scene. DS1 had clearly decided that I was meant to devote my every waking second to my kids, even though he was getting more “friends orientated” and actually wanted to spend less time with me anyway. I took it slowly, like you OP. But it was a long hard slog.

4.5 years later and it’s much better - DP comes on holiday with us, and stays over one night per week, and DS2 is very fond of him - but even now DS1 will occasionally making a catty remark about me only caring about DP. It’s ridiculous as I do so much for my kids, and always put them first.
Like you OP, I tormented myself with worries that I was traumatising DS1, that he’d never forgive me, that I was harming him by having a relationship. I considered ending it with DP many times.
But one thing I told myself was that it might actually be beneficial for my kids to see how a relationship should be. DP is kind and respectful and we never argue, and I actually think that’s a good example for my DCs to see. It’s a positive thing for them in many ways.
But at the end of the day I’m a person too, and I have a right to an adult relationship. They will always be my priority, but just as they have friends who they want to spend time with, then so do I.
Just keep working at it OP, it will be OK in time.

Agree exactly with what @DeRigueurMortis said. It is such a difficult situation and you sound like you're trying so hard but I'm sure you wouldn't let your daughter be openly rude to other people, friends/family for example, but she's getting away with treating your boyfriend like this. And I say this as a mother of a 14 year old dd who isn't my partners and has had to navigate all the fun stuff that comes with that.

She may be interpreting "priority" to mean "exclusive priority", not just to come first on your list but be the only thing on your list. As a pp said, her needs to come first, but not all her wants and desires before any of yours.

Also remember that at 9yo your daughter is still at what is normally an incredibly selfish age, but at the same time it's an age when she will start to learn life lessons. She does need to start learning that she can't always get her own way in everything, as life just isn't like that.

I'm sorry but I think you give her too much say in what's going on. She needs to be taught manners too! There's a difference between putting her first and allowing her to rule the roost! You need to toughen up with her!

What @DeRigueurMortis said!

My ds was 7, and was used to having me all to himself, when dh came into our lives. We also took it slowly, but once they met, we tried hard to make it seem like ds was gaining a stepdad rather than losing half of me. DH actively built a relationship with ds, they went on day trips together, ds loved trains so they went to York and Brighton on the train. They went to Wembley to watch football. I appreciate it's harder for you to find things that she has missed out on by not having her father around because maybe daughters do less with fathers, but there must be some things he can do that will help her see the benefits. Can you go on holidays together (not now obviously) that you couldn't previously have done?
DS has just gone to uni and I know that it is a great thing that he doesn't have to worry about me now that he's left home, he's free to spread his wings. So I agree with a previous poster that if you let this continue, she will regret it.

I agree with what others have said but also think you need to focus on your future. Your dd will change a lot in the next few years and it's quite possible your relationship will end due to the current problems, then at 13 she'll turn around and question why you don't date/have a partner. That would be very annoying, and I agree with the PP who said your dd might come to regret her behaviour and attitude, especially if it is given too much influence and ruins your relationship with your DP.

As long as you can be sure she is not at risk from him of course.

Why are you letting your daughter control your life? It's not upto her. I'm sorry but if I met someone and their kid was being a brat towards me I'd split. Get a grip on your life and tell her enough is enough. Or let her rule your life.. your choice

”I've talked to her a little about the fact that I no longer want to be with him, he is my good friend but we no longer make each other happy. I have said Daddy is a good man and he loves you very much and he sometimes used to get angry with me and I didn't want to live with him. That's as far as I've gone in explaining the marriage breakdown etc. I am absolutely hardline about not wanting to badmouth him to her but I also want her to understand that I had serious reasons for wanting not to be with him any more. Its a tricky balance tbh. I'm not sure I’ve got it right”

This is such a tricky situation, OP, and I’m sure you have handled it well, but I’m wondering if she understands fully that her mum and dad don’t love each other any more are never, ever going to get back together. Maybe she thinks there is still some hope, and believes BF is an obstacle to the reconciliation she wants (and that any child in her position would want), therefore her hostility to him might make him go away.

She has far too much control. You need better boundaries. And you can’t allow bad manners.

If your relationship fails because of her unacceptable behaviour, she will look back in five or ten years’ time and feel terribly guilty. No one wins.

Whilst you are doing everything right, she is listening to her father, and this will make her less tolerant of your boyfriend. You need to make her understand that your boyfriend is also a good man, and she has to get to know him properly.

In response to some of you yes her father has bad-mouthed my boyfriend to her -- when I first introduced him to her (about six/seven months in) she stole his mobile phone charger and I got it it out of her later that her dad had specifically instructed her to do this. I was furious with her and I made her apologise to him.

DD's dad also phoned social services and told them that my boyfriend had sought to go into my DD's bedroom. This was completely false -- at that point he'd never even been in my flat at the same time as her and certainly not into her bedroom. Social services dropped it and it was treated as a malicious complaint.

There have since been other more trivial incidents. My ex has now accepted that I have a boyfriend but he is constantly seeking to imply in minor ways that he is a bad influence and that I am a bad mother.

Dealing with my ex is frankly a complete nightmare. I've chosen maybe this was a mistake to have him in our lives at a distance, as opposed to completely cutting him off. Partly because I can't afford a second injunction and partly because she was distraught when she wasn't allowed to see him. He's no longer a danger to me and I'd rather maintain a superficially cordial relationship with him at a distance.

he price of having him "on side" is that he gets to carp at the margins and occasionally make snide comments to her. Its shit and for me its a minor irritant but I'm aware it is possibly confusing for her. But I'm not going to push him out of her life again. It is what it is.

Maybe think about how you would be if your boyfriend was just a friend? I wouldn’t have a friend (female or male) crash the night at my house if my child was strongly opposed to it because it’s their safe space too, but if my friend came round for a cup of tea/meal and my child said they wanted them to leave the reaction would be “excuse me? No”
I get that it feels more of a big deal because he is a long term partner, and I think it’s good that you have been so sensitive to her concerns, but I would make it clear she doesn’t get to decide who is allowed in the house or not (within reason). So long as you aren’t doing overt PDAs in her presence etc, you are allowed friends over just like she is

No wonder she is like this OP ! How can you possibly move forward when she is being positively encouraged to cause misery by your ex ?

I think it's you who is the problem here, and your poor boyfriend is a bloody saint !