Husband keeps money to himself

[ForeverHopeful21]

My husband has a very good job. I a self employed, I don't earn much but I love what I do and work hard, and it allows me to work part time to care for our toddler. I am also pregnant.

We have been together for 14 years and always had separate bank accounts.

Over time he has paid for more and more bills, and as our house / mortgage has grown and he has earned more he was required to cover this. For this I am grateful. I buy everything for our toddler and always have, most food shopping and I have never asked him for anything for me personally.

Now (and especially as I haven't been able to work since March / corona virus and nursery closed) he hasn't given me any money. I received 35% of my normal pay from the government which isn't much and I used this on my few bills and our daughter. I have nothing in my bank account.

I paid for some food shopping on a credit card last week as we had little food in the house. This annoyed him, and I said how am I supposed to buy anything with no money?! His only response was, I'll have to send you the money to pay off the credit card.

If I tell him how difficult it is having no income, his response is, maybe you should do a different job. As if its as easy as that?! Especially when my hours are convenient for childcare. And I've actually studied and worked really hard to build my business up from nothing.

He has a very expensive golf membership, has just joined a swanky gym, has £50 haircuts and regularly has parcels arriving at the house for new shoes etc. But he insists we don't have much money. Its true we don't have tons, but this is because we are in the process of building a house. He also goes on a few holidays abroad every years with friends. And I go nowhere.

From the outside I think people think I'm so lucky because of the new house build and we live in a lovely area and I only work part time. But I can't even afford deodorant and live on beans on toast whilst he buys himself lunch at work everyday.

I really don't think its a control thing. I think he just thinks that I should do more and earn more. He is lucky that from leaving uni he stepped in to a great job and loves what he does. I always get the impression he thinks I'm lazy - even though I do 90% of everything at home, have my own business, and childcare. He often talks about me doing different jobs and what could earn us more. I think he's disappointed in me.

I've been used to living this way for a long time. I went back to work when my daughter was 7 months old as I was so sick of having no money. But since lockdown and not being able to work and receiving so little from the government (£300 a month for 3 months and £0 for the last 2 months) I just don't know what to do?!

@Bluntness100
OP is pregnant and looking after a toddler which is work if she was to work full time who would look after toddler and new baby?
Last time I checked most women take 6 months to a year off after having a baby and are either paid maternity allowance or supported by thier partner. I'm wondering why you seem anti woman.

Cat

If someone else was writing this , what would your response be to that person?.

How can you be helped here into leaving your abuser?

I'm gonna give a completely different perspective here OP. I'm prepared to get flamed. Although I must say I do not like your husbands attitude at all and that would be my issue.

If I've read this correctly he is paying everything including nursery fees so you can work your part time job?

Why not use those hours hes paying for to get a normal 9-5 part time? When covid has settled of course.

Let's flip the tables here. Imagine working full time and paying for everything whilst your husband works a job that some may refer to as a 'hobby job' and doesnt earn them enough money. Your even willing to pay for childcare for them to work a better paid job but they refuse. You would feel a bit put out by that.
I'm sure he would like the opportunity to do as he pleases whilst someone else pays for childcare and bills for him to do so.

If someone (anyone) doesn't earn enough to pay their bills then they have to get a better paid job or increase their hours. That's the way of the world for most people unfortunately.

Imagine if he quit his job to work 3 days on minimum wage. Even though you couldn't afford to do that and pay bills. Yet he refused to work any more hours and his answer was to be put it on a credit card rather than change jobs or increase hours even with childcare paid for by you.

Going freelance and being able to earn enough to work for yourself is a luxury that not everyone can afford.

That being said.. his attitude is terrible. You need to sit down with all bills and earnings laod out infront of you both and come to a mutual agreement.

I can see the resentment that may be held on both sides here.

I just think I was stupid enough to give up my job - it’s my fault. As an adult you shouldn’t expect someone to support you financially. I mean I didn’t make a unilateral decision, he wanted me to stay at home after dc 2 as well and in fact I was really unwell for two years after having her so I’d have found it hard to work. But other people do so it was my own fault that I didn’t. Most people manage to work and have dc even if they have a chronic condition. It’s only because I’m pathetic that I can’t.

I am sure some men take up golf so they can have endless hours /days, away from family responsibilities and weekend away with ‘the lads’. Personally I’ve yet to meet one who wasn’t a msyogonistic arse and mean as shit. OP, this is utterly unacceptable. If you have house equity, you take that equity and rent somewhere decent for you all. The chances are he won’t want 50/50 - will inhibit his hobbies and weekends. If he is a high earner but there are little tangible assets and you have young kids he may well have to pay you maintenance as well as for the children, if there is little to actually ‘split’ . One way or the other you would get cash coming in from him or benefits or maybe a mix of the two, plus any earned income when you can resume . You may well not feel ‘worse off’ . The other option is you have a frank non aggressive face to face chat and state that whilst you have large caring responsibilities the current set up isn’t working. All income needs to go into a joint pot, all bills paid from it , a certain amount left for domestic emergencies/family holidays etc and the remainder shared out equally as personal money — if he doesn’t go for that, back to plan 1– and don’t let him have50/50 if you can get away with that

Catthroughthewindow

I would look at getting the experience through smaller shops not the big chain stores etc

Dd and Ds are both self employed (as am I. Just starting out again when Covid hit so haven’t got very far). None of us would be able to get a formal job. Dd has 4 GCSEs at grade C, Ds has 2 and I also have no qualifications.
Plus I don’t think I have worked for a wage since the 80s

When dc were younger a lot of women at the school gates either worked F/t or p/t and some ran their own business.

For most they made the same as if they worked f/t in a minimum wage job without the expense of having to pay out for childcare and clothes and transport etc.
One of them did so well that her dh gave up his job to work in the business.

There is agency work.
Pre Covid I would have suggested hospitality. Serving at one off events like weddings or things like the Ideal Home exhibition etc. That you could pick and choose the work to fit in for days/evenings when you were free.
Now I think you need to be a bit creative and google around.

Don’t for get there are more ways to earn money than going to a place of work and doing a job and getting paid at the end of the month.
I would look at Matched Betting (spend a lot of time getting your head around it and understanding what it is about) and maybe (I have only skimmed) the earn £10 per day thread but look around at what you can do now and build on that even if it means you earn a little from many places.

@Worriedaboutcovid19
Op is pregnant who will look after newborn whilst she's working?
Having children and looking after them is a job

Most people manage to work and have dc even if they have a chronic condition. It’s only because I’m pathetic that I can’t.

You are not pathetic, you are human. Please be kind to yourself

@Temp123999 well I'm assuming if OPs husband is paying childcare for their first born he will do the same for their next if it means she can work a better paid job?

Surely her plans were to continue being self employed anyway after the baby is born. Only difference is she'll be working for someone else rather than herself?

Left my ExH after finally realising the financial abuse. I was PT after DC and my little bit of wages paid for some shopping and things for DC. I had to borrow to buy milk and nappies, to pay a utilities bill so we didnt get cut off, to cover some parking fines for him before they took it to court. Went without food on lots of occasions to make sure DC had enough.

He always had enough to go to the pub and drink with his mates and get a takeaway on the way home (after I hadnt had anything but toast for a few days), but always said we had no money. We even had no heating or hot water for 4 months because he didnt pay the Bill!

After I left I discovered his wages where actually more than he told me and after working out what our bills had been he had managed to spend/hide about 20k a year from me all whilst saying we had no money.

So glad I'm away from him now and with an amazing and supportive DP who is happy for us to share all our money. It's made me see how low my self worth was in my marriage. Hate thinking back to how my parents bailed us out so many times when they didnt really have the money and all the while ExH had the money.

You are not hopeless or pathetic. This "man" has done a right number on you, hasn't he? Have you confided any of this to anyone in real life op?

@Worriedaboutcovid19 most women don’t put newborns into nurseries as the want to bond or breastfeed

This IS financial abuse and it IS a control issue

That said, given your business doesn’t seem to be weathering the coronavirus storm I would argue it’s not particularly viable and you need to consider either diversifying or another job - if for no other reason than you’re not dependent on this tight twat!

At the very least the children’s costs are BOTH of yours as they’re your JOINT children - that inc childcare! He couldn’t work if he had to cover childcare.

Frankly if I were you it’d be ducks in a row (inc gathering evidence of ALL his finances as you’re married) and planning to leave ASAP.

Sod that for a laugh!

I’ve been single to all intents and purposes (just not a nun 😂) for 17 years and while things have been tight at times at least I knew where I stood and I wasn’t subsidising another adults luxury lifestyle - which is what YOU are doing.

Get angry! You should be! I’m angry for you!

I definitely wouldn’t rely on getting maintenance from this dick though - the minimum at best

As ever @Attilathemeerkats replies are spot on!

Be interesting if you were to work out what your finances would be like if you did leave - I’m betting you’d be better off despite the apparent riches in new house etc and I bet you’d be able to breathe better too!

When you tot up how much he spends household wise and how much you spend the total in proportion to what you each earn? He clearly has MUCH more available for personal spending than you do which isn’t right or fair

Going holiday without you and with you not also having holidays is ALSO outrageously unfair

I guess I didn't notice this much before my daughter was born as I was working 5 days a week and didn't need him to support me. But over the past 2.5 years this has changed, except he doesn't seem to want to share

because abuse often ramps up when the woman is pregnant/just had a child. He knows you’re more tied to him now emotionally at least.

NO decent man would have his wife going without basic personal care like deodorant and haircuts!

When I was with my ex we had just the one joint account and agreed a budget which meant we both had same amount for personal spending. Sometimes I earned more sometimes he did, sometimes I wasn’t earning at all (he was army so each move it’d be at least a few weeks until I had a new job, then I was a sahm for a while too). This was never considered by him to be anything but the right thing to do. I wouldn’t recommend this in case of a split as he did empty the account then so I wouldn’t have JUST a joint account again, but I also would NEVER tolerate your setup.

Yet another post where the OP is clearly in a difficult, unhappy situation but is pregnant again ...........

yes it’s both heartbreaking and incredibly frustrating!

Plus it means that not only the op is subjected to the abuse but the children indirectly.

I’m from an abusive marriage, that very much inc financial abuse and while we “never went without” we DID miss out on a lot of things and experiences we shouldn’t have because dad had such a tight grip of the purse strings. Mum certainly went without - haircuts, clothes, shoes, personal care items...

Was the husband as on board about a second baby as the OP?

that’s a shitty comment!! He is responsible for his own fertility!

Would you both be willing to talk to a counsellor about it too?

op having therapy would be good, couples counselling is NOT recommended where there’s abuse and like a pp I highly doubt it’s ONLY financial - I strongly suspect a lot of coercive control from how op is talking

Also show the selfish self centred, self focused, uncaring arrogant, condescending arse this thread. Print out a copy and present it to him. definitely not! This could lead to op being in physical danger

Seriously op, check how you'd be financially single and carefully broach the subject of a more equitable arrangement (though I think it will be unsuccessful) but basically I think you're better off in almost every way being single!

If I may ask, why aren’t you working full time? I understand he is paying the nursery fees so maybe his point of view is: my wife decided to go part time even though I am happy to pay for childcare, she then complains she has less money than me who works full time.
Not saying you are BU though - I work part time by choice myself.

For goodness sake. Do some folks not actually know what financial abuse is?

Financial abuse is controlling someone’s money or preventing them working to acquire money, it’s stealing their money and using it for yourself or forcing someone to be unable to earn.

Financial abuse is not not giving your partner spending money and paying for the roof over their head and the clothes on their back, and expecting them to work, earn and contribute.

What is it with mumsnet. If a man doesn’t share his wage it’s financial abuse. If a man wants a woman to share her wage he’s a cock lodger and she should kick him out

This man maybe many things including selfish but this is not financial abuse.

It's almost as though there's a spectrum of financial abuse, imagine that. We don't know the circumstances as to why OP works part time, but regardless, unless he has had a conversation with OP and supported her doing more hours, or finding a new job aside from snide remarks, of course it's fucking weird that he is buying what he wants whilst OP is eating baked beans and buying food on a credit card. If he doesn't want to have so much financial responsibility, it seems there are better ways to try and sort that out, rather than withhold money.

@Catthroughthewindow

Please contact Womens Aid.

They will hopefully give you some much needed advice and support.

Both the OP and yourself are living in terribly abusive relationships.

I feel so sorry for you both and your poor children.

Such men are terrorists in the home.

[quote Temp123999]**@Worriedaboutcovid19 most women don’t put newborns into nurseries as the want to bond or breastfeed[/quote]
@Temp123999 she can still take her maternity leave as planned. But long term she will have to find a part time job as she can't afford to be self employed right now.

Most women take maternity leave and go back work. OP should still do that or whatever it is she now has she has planned.

But if she has a discussion with her husband and says she will go back to steady employment after her 9 months maternity then he may be willing to compromise and pay her a lot more spending money knowing that there is an end in sight.

@Bluntness100 completely agree. I dont think many people would be happy if their partners decided to go self employed 3 days a week, earn not enough money to support the family or themselves and refuse to change jobs or increase hours, despite them paying for childcare so they can work. Then have them complain your not giving them enough cash for spends even though you've given them the opportunity to earn more.

Its not financial abuse.

Financial abuse is a form of domestic violence. Financial abuse is an aspect of ‘coercive control’ – a pattern of controlling, threatening and degrading behaviour that restricts a victims’ freedom.

It’s important to understand that financial abuse seldom happens in isolation: in most cases perpetrators use other abusive behaviours to threaten and reinforce the financial abuse.

Financial abuse involves a perpetrator using or misusing money which limits and controls their partner’s current and future actions and their freedom of choice. It can include using credit cards without permission, putting contractual obligations in their partner’s name, and gambling with family assets.

Financial abuse can leave women with no money for basic essentials such as food and clothing. It can leave them without access to their own bank accounts, with no access to any independent income and with debts that have been built up by abusive partners set against their names. Even when a survivor has left the home, financial control can still be exerted by the abuser with regard to child maintenance.

Domestic violence involves a pattern of behaviour that one person uses to control, undermine and obtain power over another person. Domestic abuse can include physical, sexual, psychological/emotional and financial abuse. More simply, financial abuse is a current or former partner controlling someone’s ability to acquire, use or maintain financial resources by preventing victims from earning or accessing their own money.

Examples Include:-
Stealing money from a partner
Damaging possessions which then have to be replaced
Insisting benefits are in their name
Putting debts in a partner’s name
Stopping a partner from going to work
This abuse can also continue post-separation.

Financial abuse against women is more likely to start at key life stage events compared to men, for example, when moving in with a partner, getting married or having a baby.

Financial abuse in relationships against women also lasts for a longer period of time compared to men.

Women are also more likely to experience financial abuse in multiple relationships and post separation.

Women experiencing financial abuse in relationships were more likely to be heterosexual and living as married, with the highest prevalence of financial abuse occurring amongst full-time working women and women working part-time.

The manipulation of money and other economic resources is one of the most prominent forms of coercive control, depriving women of the material means needed for independence, resistance and escape.

It’s a barrier to leaving: Lack of access to economic resources is a reason why many women feel that they have no choice but to stay with an abuser.
Increased risk for the survivor: Economic barriers to leaving can result in women staying with abusive men for longer and experiencing greater danger, injuries and even homicide as a result.
A barrier to an independent life: Economic abuse doesn’t rely on physical proximity, so can continue after separation. Women are often left in debt and the lack of financial security impacts on their ability to rebuild their lives after leaving.

I had money on golf being mentioned. These men need to come with a health warning.

@Bluntness100
Lots of women with two children under five work part time or not at all the amount of money for two nursey places is often equivalent to or more than the amount the woman earns so she's working for nothing doesn't see her children and then the cooking cleaning shopping etc doesn't get done

All money goes into one account. Bills are paid, a budget set for food and housekeeping, then things like kids clothes, dental bills - things that essential. Then and only then do you both look at whats remaining each month and allocate spending money to each person, or decide to save it, or make a big purchase like furniture etc.

The higher earner does not get a bigger share. This is because its a marriage with children, not a flat share.

@Worriedaboutcovid19 - cash for spends?! OP wants cash for groceries for the family not a new handbag FFS.

The couple decided to have children so they must both support them. If OP needs to work more hours as her DH cannot contribute from his salary then that's fair, but in this case he wants her to work more so that he can keep his cash to himself for treats. So the children are her luxury are they?!

OP, have you discussed the finances management as a family before? What was the plan for your maternity leave?

I don't know, if this was the other way around, with the wife being the high earner, paying for mortgage, nursery fees, all the big household bills for many years whilst her husband chose to have short hours in a self employed capacity that didn't pay very well...I have a feeling mumsnet majority might be shouting cocklodger!

However, there are obviously further things to consider - the extent of nursery hours, the amount of work done around the home by both, life admin etc, and of course there being a baby on the way meaning that you would hope a family would work as a team to support the best experience for the baby and family as a whole, which for many would ideally mean at at least one parent not working for a fair period.

But I guess there is a chance he is thinking to himself 'I have spent years supporting my wife to indulge her low paying, self employed work, whilst I do a job that covers the vast majority of our expenses. I can cover all the nursery fees for us both to have full time employment whilst she gets herself established. I wish the pressure was off me to cover most of the bills on my own and that she was in a career that also paid well'.