Am I being impatient? Marriage and kids?

[1991Amber]

Hi All,
I've got to the point where I don't know what to do...

I've been with my OH for 9 years this month, he knows that I want to get married and have kids and so does he. Yet here I am 9 years and counting with no ring on my finger.

The way his brain works is get ourselves set up before we take the next step in our venture. I.e house and decorated. But we have had a house for 4 years now and we are very close to finishing the decorating, we now trying to pay the mortgage off.

I have had the conversation with him about 6 months ago about how serious I am about marriage and kids to make sure he's on the same page. He says his is...so what are we waiting for?

Am I being impatient? What should I do?

Cheers!

And he wants to pay off their mortgage - how long will that take?!

That's why I then said you could save up through the year for the wedding. Rather than doing what many do and taking out loans, credit cards etc to pay for it. It's smarter doing that. But he can't use that as an excuse anymore. I'm guessing most of the nine years was saving for a deposit for the house.

Still I'd rather have a guy that was financially smart than one that just spends more than he has. That's what I was meaning.

Why can you not propose to him?

I really don't get how couples can be together and not be married or even engaged. It really does not take that long to know whether you want to be with someone for the rest of your life or not.

I would never have waited that long to be married and would not have bought a house or had a child before marriage either.

Luckily DH is a firm believer in marriage and not in living together first. We were married 5 months after meeting and have celebrated our 40th anniversary this year. Not all men are awful

You need to be able to talk about anything and everything. Has he accused you of “nagging” him in the past? It’s a horrible expression.

When you wanted to buy your house, did you say you quite liked the idea then waited for him to find, view, put an offer in and sign the paperwork on it committing you both? Or did you discuss how much you could afford, look into mortgage options, talk about areas to live in, number of rooms, go and see several options, agree offer amounts, make your plans and arrangements together?

I really can’t get my head round the fact you need to ask if after nine years you’re being impatient.

Do you not know people who are married, you know no friends who got engaged and married etc? Is nine years an early stage in relationships in your wider social circle? I can’t think of any other reason you’d think you were being impatient after nine years unless you see it as the norm round you.

He’s not proposing because he doesn’t wish to get married yet. It’s that simple op. Whether he ever wishes to, is something we can’t guess. Right now he’s not asking because he doesn’t want to.

Save as hard as you can - give him a deadline, and use your £ either to leave or to help with the wedding.

He's very money oriented. That's better than being feckless, but not as great as it sounds if he's using the cash - including all yours - to get his own way.

I would enquire fairly quickly what his 'expectations' re supporting you and his children are.

If he's got his eye on you as a good earner who's enabling the life he wants, you're better finding out now.

Why is he making all of the important decisions?

I'm not sure if this thought track will help but he was young when you got together wasn't he and lots of people outgrow their partners so by the time you reach late 20s you are no longer in a relationship you see being the one/one for a first marriage lasting about 20 years and having kids.

Is your relationship passionate, fun, loving, supportive and what others at 27 are telling him they have going on?

I married at 25 after 4 years together so I'm not speaking from personal experience.

Why have you abdicated responsibility for your own life, OP? You have constructed a situation where you believe yourself to be effectively powerless because of some retrograde ideas about nice girls waiting for men to ask, and not ‘nagging’. That’s NINE years of being a passenger in your own life.

As @AnneLovesGilbert said, when you decided to buy a house, did you just say you’d like to, then sit back and look expectant until he’d chosen an area, found a house and committed you to it? Or was it a mutual decision involving consultation? Why is marriage and children any different? Do you apply for promotions at work, or do you simply wordlessly hope they might happen?

He thinks he has you tied in via the house. You have further "invested" through the renovation and he thinks you are unlikely to break it off.

Have a conversation now this weekend and tell him you want to get engaged in the coming months with a view to getting married early next summer/christmas/whatever.

As per supersimkin2's advice start saving aggressively - its either for the wedding fund or your new life fund.

I would not be countanancing a long engagement

The fact he now wants to overpay the morgage is a joke...when will that end fgs....! He is using any excuse he can find.

My fiance (btw we had a clear discussion and were on the same page my engagement wasnt a surprise) thinks you two arent on the same page at all and the fact that he hasnt proposed 4 years after buying the house is a sign. He's looking for excuses...

Some people really struggle to recognise this, OP, but most people in fact do what they want to do. Unless, like you, they’ve absorbed the idea that expressing your own desires clearly and expecting them to be met — whether in this relationship or a future one — is ‘nagging’.

Your boyfriend is doing what he wants. Unfortunately this is the opposite of what you want. Who’s winning here?

I think you are still quite young and there's no rush, although I get your frustration. It took my husband 11years to propose and others in our friend group (uni) were similar (but not all by far!!). Mid/late thirties by the time we had kids. I have never, and still never doubt his commitment to me (other couples also all still together). I still can't understand why the timescale but I do think when you get together young you have your whole life ahead so there isn't the time pressure to crack on that there is as you get older (and sometimes this takes you out the other side). We also both had our own hobbies and interests and had/have pretty busy and filled lives and our relationships supported that rather than needing to move to the 'next phase'.

I can't give you any answers and every relationship is different but certainly in my case it wasn't through any lack of love or commitment to me. We are still very happy and committed 20+years on.

It doesn't cost a lot to get married. The expensive bit is the big wedding, and you don't need to do that.

Family member has been stringing his GF along for roughtly same amount of time, too. He doesn't want to be with her long-term, but it's comfortable at present. I feel for her and tried to gently warn her, but she is not listening.
Your post reminds me of that situation.

Well if you aren’t prepared to speak to him about it again and you don’t want to leave him then you’re out of options aren’t you?

This ^

Clearly, marriage, and children aren't the priority to him that they are to you.
You need to give it some serious thought.
You then need to talk to him again and be clear about what you want, and how important it is to you.
If he can't respect and recognise what is important to you, then is he the man you really want to spen the next 60 years with ?

If he were totally opposed to marriage, then you'd be in a different position, but if it just "isn't important to him right now" then you needt o get him to understand that, and his response will say a lot about it.

I respect the 'saving up for things' rather than getting credit, but it sounds like you aren't in a bad position if you've owned a house together for 4 years already.
So you need to decide if it is the "being married" that is important, or the "having a lovely wedding day" and factor that into your decisions.

It really needn't cost that much to get married, but I do understand you probably want a 'nice' wedding. However, even that needn't cost the ridiculous sums you see bandied about as being the "average" wedding cost.

There was a regular on here a few years ago, can't remember her MN name as I knew her from another site (Confetti/BGH for those of us that were there!) and she said that if he didnt want marriage etc then she would leave. He made the usual "one day" bs, so she left. Bought her own home and moved on.

Funnily enough, he then wanted to marry her and was back on her doorstep, ring in hand. It really is true that you dont know what you've got until its gone.

One reason my ex DH wanted to get married was he knew that if i had a baby with him unmarried, there was NO WAY it would have his surname. I just cannot fathom why anyone would let a man cherry pick the 'traditions' to suit him and not themselves. Ludicrous.

OP in your situation i would give an ultimatum of 6 months, then leave if a date hasn't been set.

You won't always be young and, at the moment, the power dynamic is screwing you over.

GoldenKirst I feel for you, your head is probably spinning a bit from the pasting you’ve had on here! But you’re not the first woman to be led to believe marriage is unimportant or just a bit of paper and you won’t be the last.

I wanted to ask you, you said that things are changing so that unmarried couples have greater rights: what is? Do you have any links or any evidence? Because to my knowledge there really haven’t been any legislative changes in that area. As an unmarried couple you’re seen by the law in the same vein as flatmates. Now you’re pregnant you have no real bargaining chip sadly as he’s got everything he wants from you without any commitment.

But equally, this is your choice. By choosing to have a baby with this man and live together without marriage you’ve chosen that you’re fine with that set up and don’t require marriage. That’s entirely your decision although it puts you in a precarious position. Please don’t ever give up your job or allow your income to reduce, work as much as him and prioritise your career and insist on splitting childcare and nursery costs equally. He’s taking steps to protect his own interests by remaining unmarried, you ought to do the same. As cynical as it sounds, if a man wants to be married to a woman and to give her the protections marriage confer (especially during such a vulnerable period of life as pregnancy and new parenthood) he will. We always agreed we would be married before we had a baby but didn’t have time to waste due to my age and fertility issues so we cracked on trying and got pregnant very quickly, DH proposed at five months pregnant and had me up the aisle at seven months!

I cannot imagine not sharing a surname with my baby boy and I think when your baby arrives you’ll see what I mean. Make sure baby has your name, it’ll save a world of hassle later practically, and if you ever do get married you can change your names to your boyfriend’s.

And OP: what happened to you to make you accept such shitty treatment and be so unsure of yourself? The fact you think NINE YEARS is being impatient is so upsetting to read. The average length of time from meeting to marriage in the U.K. is three years. You’re the opposite of impatient, you sound so unsure and tentative about owning decisions around your own life.

Ultimately, people do what they want to do. He doesn’t want to marry you. You clearly would rather be with him unmarried and without kids than leave. He knows that, this status quo will continue.

Not to mention the fact that surely you only wanna marry a man who really wants to marry you!? Can’t think of anything worse than dragging a reluctant man down the aisle. Don’t you want a relationship with a guy who is so sure about you, so in love with you he can hardly wait to call you his wife and show the world publicly that he has decided to be with you for keeps? You don’t even need to spend much for marriage, ours cost around £400 including the rings, legal ceremony and my dress (£17.99 and it looked stunning). We tried for a baby before being engaged as we didn’t have time to kill planning a wedding due to my age (31) but knew we would be married before a baby arrived. DH had us engaged a few months after we got pregnant and married three months before the birth. I can’t fathom why you’re accepting someone who’s so lukewarm about you.

Not RTFT but I'd plan to move on. 29 is not all that young to be starting a family - 30 yrs ago, you'd be a 'geriatric mother'.

Don't be fobbed off with an engagement ring. Give him an ultimatum, and stick to it. He's got the girlfriend and he's got the house.

Tell him you want to be married by [date] and that you want to start a family. If he doesn't agree, you split up. It is not an ultimatum if you don't stick to it, it's just an empty threat.

As things are, you'll plod along, a few years, still in the same situation.
You can't take fertility for granted. IVF is gruelling and I know a few for whom several attempts failed.

I would guess that he sees you as a girlfriend, not as a life partner, and should you split up, he'll probably tie the knot to someone else within a couple of years.

9 years isn't impatient AT ALL!

I really think you need to have a proper chat with him. Find out what he doesn't like about marriage and kids, because let's face it, if he was ok with it you'd be married with kids by now. 9 years is a long time.

Is it the wedding he doesn't like? Would he elope and do it, just the two of you style? Does he genuinely want kids? If he says yes tell him you're coming off contraception and you'll happily book a registry office for 2 months time? Call his bluff, however if you do do this, or give him an ultimatum you have to follow through.

Tbh, after 9 years, if he wanted the commitment of marriage he'd have asked, same with kids tbh.

he isn't bothered about it or actively doesn't want to. 9 years OP...

You are being mugged off.

Beware that the next step is you, pregnant, and still not married.

Decide what you want, and if he won’t marry you, leave. You can split easily now. But with children and being older... don’t be pushed about like this.

27 and 29 are young and especially for him, you have years left to have a baby and right now isn’t really the ideal time anyway.

If you don’t mind me asking then are you using contraception but not actively trying? I don’t think he is ready for a baby just now but he needs to be honest, but like I say I think you have at least 10 years left which is ages.