But we took you to Stately Homes" October 2019 onwards thread

[toomuchtooold]

It's October 2019, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
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May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
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March 2011
November 2011
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May-August 2019
August-October 2019
Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat or toomuchtooold for details.

Some books:

Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

Hi everyone! I hope that you don’t mind me joining you but I’m really struggling with my relationship with my mother and it looks like many of you are in the same boat and will hopefully be able to offer me some much needed reassurance.

I don’t even know where to start really. As a kid my mother was always really supportive of me and made me believe I could achieve anything I wanted to. But since reaching adulthood, it’s as if she’s come to resent everything I’ve achieved. She never says anything nasty or vindictive. But I cannot remember one single occasion in the past ten years or so where my mother has said one nice or positive thing to me. In that time I’ve emigrated abroad for a great job, got married, been promoted several times, made a lovely home for myself, had three children. But everything has happened without any kind of acknowledgement or even comment. It’s like radio silence on every aspect of my life.

My parents have been separated for a long time and fortunately I only see my mother once a year or so when she comes over to visit. Each time she causes some kind of drama.

When I was organising my wedding my mother complained that I wasn’t involving her enough in any of the planning (true, but only because I’m a perfectionist control freak!). So I invited her over to visit, come and see the venue and do the food tasting to choose the menu with us. When we got there she didn’t say a word and when I eventually asked her what she thought about the lovely place we’d chosen she replied “Well I suppose it depends what you’re looking for”. She then refused to eat most of the food due to various food intolerances she supposedly has. She turned what was supposed to be a lovely day for us really sour.

A few weeks before the wedding she then picked an argument with me, blamed it all on me and then announced she wouldn’t come to the wedding as I had treated her so badly. I knew we would both regret it if she didn’t come, so I had to spend the next week apologising and begging her to come on a daily basis. She came in the end but then, on the days after the wedding, refused to come out with us and other family and friends when invited and then flew home without saying goodbye. After that I didn’t contact her for a couple of months. She then sent me a text to say she was splitting up with her partner and was going to be homeless. I felt guilty and got back in touch. Obviously nothing came of the break-up.

She’s also been over after each of my children were born and each time was a nightmare. She was happy to come over and cuddle my newborn babies, but left me to do all of the cooking, shopping and housework whilst making out she was doing me a favor (which I stupidly believed). Because of her food allergies I had to cook specially for her, then she’d often refuse to eat what I’d made. With my first I had an EMCS and was lugging water from the shops for her as she maintained she would get ill if she drank the tap water.

The final straw came on her last visit earlier this year when my third baby arrived. She came at a really awful time as both of my older children were really sick, then a snow storm hit and I had to shovel us out of the house every day to get to the doctors. She did nothing to try and help with the kids or the household. My mother then caught a cold and took to her room for the last 4-5 days and we didn’t see her at all. Her partner was with her and he holed up in the spare bedroom with her, only coming out once a day to go to the chemist for her. He said that she’d been sick from coughing so much and so he was too worried to leave her alone. I offered to take her to the doctor etc but she declined. We literally did not see her for those days - they would wait until we’d gone to bed and then come down and start rifling through the kitchen for something to eat. On the last day I put them in a taxi to the airport knowing it was probably the last time I would see them.

That was ten months ago. Since then I haven’t called or texted her of my own volition. I haven’t returned any calls (we never spoke often anyway). When she texts I send a brief but polite reply, if any.

I find it so hard though. I think about her many times a day. I wonder if I’m over reacting - perhaps she’s not as bad as I make out? But I know that I get nothing from the relationship. It just drains me rather than providing any kind of warmth or support. It just seems so very wrong to cut from your life the person who brought you into this world. I worry my own children won’t have a good relationship with me. I just feel so very lost.

I’m sorry this is so long, but thank you for reading if you manage to get this far!

Sounds like intense jealousy

Yes, I eventually came to that conclusion. To be jealous of your own child instead of genuinely pleased for them isn't normal though, is it? I think with him it was mixed with the academic snobbery, like I hadn't done well enough in his eyes, plus married a man with no formal qualifications, to deserve any of it. So warped.

I’m sorry to hear you’re not receiving any support from the friends you’ve confided in frazzled. That must be so upsetting especially at this time. I do wonder if it’s partly because, for people with “ normal” parents, this all seems so alien and difficult to comprehend. So they don’t really appreciate the severity of it. Still, it would be nice to be asked how you’re doing. My thoughts are with you - I know how hard it is!

Hi @chloechloe

Oh dear, you’ve committed the cardinal sin of the child of a narcissist - made an independent successful life. She sounds incredibly hard work and I don’t blame you for phasing her out. I wish I could give you advice on the thoughts, she’s like a puzzle you can’t solve I think?
Have you done any reading on narcissists? Maybe understanding her personality traits might explain her behaviour and you might think about her a little less.

I’m sorry you haven’t had the mother you deserved, she’s let you down. Do you have a relationship with your Dad at all?

Oh and the perfectionism might come from trying to please her when you were a child perhaps. Maybe you felt if you were perfect she would give you her approval?

Anyway, 💐for you.

Hi chloechloe

re your comment on your mother:-

" I find it so hard though. I think about her many times a day. I wonder if I’m over reacting - perhaps she’s not as bad as I make out? But I know that I get nothing from the relationship. It just drains me rather than providing any kind of warmth or support. It just seems so very wrong to cut from your life the person who brought you into this world. I worry my own children won’t have a good relationship with me. I just feel so very lost".

Your mother like practically all toxic people, has not apologised nor has accepted any responsibility for her actions.

Why would you want to stay in contact with someone, albeit your mother, where you get nothing from that relationship. This may well be simply your fear, obligation and guilt talking; three of many damaging legacies such inadequate and otherwise toxic parents leave their now adult offspring. She may be your mother in that she gave birth to you but after that?. She is not the kind and empathetic person you perhaps still want her to be and its NOT your fault she is like this. You did not make her that way (her parents likely treated her the same and she decided to repeat that same old). She has of her own free will chose to act in the spoilt and petulant ways she has done so I would leave her (and her enabler of a partner who is probably like her also) to it. There should really be no more replies to any of her text messages; go radio silent on her. No good will come of you and for that matter your children ever seeing her again. And she is bad, if not worse, that what you have made her out to be. You would not have tolerated this from a friend either, your mother is no different.

You are not your mother and your own relationship with your children is very different. For a start you would never treat them as you have been treated. You have two qualities also that your mother sadly lacks; empathy and insight. The fear is often expressed on here that somehow we are going to turn into our toxic parents but its a fear that is groundless and without foundation.

You mention that your parents have long since separated; is your dad still in your life?.

Hi @ChloeChloe, you've found the right place. I know its tough right now, but it sounds to me like you've absolutely made the right decision, in fact the only decision you could for the sake of your own sanity and your family. I would read through as much of this thread and other sources of information on narcissistic parents, which your DM definitely is. I would also then look at your childhood again with a fresh pair of eyes, as she was almost certainly fulfilling her own desire for success through you, and your control freakish perfectionism will stem from her behaviour towards you then (I am the same). I'm 4 months into complete NC with my F and it is incredibly sad that it has to be this way (and I do completely sympathise with it being much worse when its your M) but it is sadness that my F is the way he is; I can't change him, and I can't continue to have any kind of relationship him or risk him damaging my kids by allowing him to have any kind of relationship with them. Have you visited the outofthefog site? FOG stands for Fear, Obligation, Guilt and its all so true, that's what we feel, because its been drilled into us the whole of our lives. You will always feel sad, but you will get out of the FOG, and it still preferable to the anxiety and stress of attempting to have a functioning relationship with them. And by recognising that the way you were parented wasn't normal, I'm pretty sure you'll be an amazing mum to your DCs, you've already taken a big step forward in breaking the chain.

chloechloe
your mother wants to be top dog all the time, she thinks she should be the 'alpha' that's why she's so pissy, she has to make it all about her, grab the lime light every chance she can
what a fecking bitch eh
who needs that shit!

Hello all, I've been reading this thread for a long time and could really do with reaching out.

My childhood was unstable, my dad was physically, psychologically and financially abusive to my mum.

They divorced when I was 3 (I'm 42 now) but mum took him back and they continued to live together. I didn't know they were divorced until my mid 20's.

The relationship with my mum was full of love and she was my world along with my kids and husband (kids 7&4), but ultimately she was ruled by dad.

In June this year mum died very suddenly and unexpectedly within 12 days of going into hospital. I "tolerated" dad to make mums life easier but felt huge anger that she'd died and not dad.

Despite this I supported dad and hoped maybe we could move on from the abuse that I'd lived with.

When we registered mums death the registrar asked her marital status, dad stared married but I said divorced as it's the truth. He was angry and I said I didn't do it to be nasty, it's the law.

Now 5 months later dad told my cousin whom I am very close to that he has another son and his not sure if he will leave me in his will. Mum didn't have a will, she couldn't afford to make one and wasn't expecting to die!

He told my cousin who incidentally is my mums identical twins daughter that I will get a shock when it comes to the will and that he also has another son. He knew she'd not keep a secret like this, he said I was nasty for saying they were not married on mums death certificate.

I think this is his "punishment" as he now has gone silent, I tried to speak to him but he put the phone down.

I believe he is a narcissist, I feel so lost, my two little girls are asking when will they see grandad, they were so close to mum as she looked after them whilst I went to work a few days a week. I gave mum money for this as dad never gave her anything as mum was scared to tell him I paid her in case he stopped giving her the £30/40 a week "housekeeping". Mum worked in a school for 18 years and paid ALL household bills, dad brought the house with inheritance from his mum but they were joint tenants. It was mums house originally as when he left her she got a council house and he brought it as a huge discount.

My brother who lives with dad doesn't care about confrontation but has not mentioned anything to dad. I asked dad if I could have some of mums ashes so I can make a ring and he hasn't contacted me. My brother said mums ashes have been hidden as they were not where they have always been.

Now I'm on the verge of cracking up!
Dad is spending every weekend with mums twin, she spent the last 46 years trying to get mum to leave him and now is entertaining him.

I know she is vulnerable as she's lost her twin, also her husband is very unwell but I feel so utterly alone and desperate.

Thank you for reading if you got this far! I feel better for typing it out although I think i definitely need some therapy as I'm falling apart.

Hello Narcda😊
I'm so sorry that you lost your mum so suddenly it must be so awful for you 💐 she sounds lovely, I'm so sorry you have been bereaved.
Your father is a monster☹️ he really is☹️
listen it's late for me and I'm not at my sharpest but please try and get some therapy to help you process all this it really is a huge amount to deal with
And have a big hug
((( 🤗 )))
Someone more articulate will be along soon

@NarcDad45 I'm so sorry for your loss and what your dad has put you through. Its a lot, I hope you can get some help to process it all. I'm sure someone on here will have some advice.

Oh that is really tough narcdad45 - I'm so sorry that you lost your mum, and that you've had to deal with your dad's appalling behaviour on top of it.

He does sound like a narcissist from your description. Lying to the registrar is batshit, as is the game he's playing to get information to you that will hurt you, all through third parties. He's trying to divide and conquer, and is hoping you'll come running to him begging for scraps.

I think you know yourself that he has nothing positive to offer you or your children, and the best thing to do is ignore him. It is very hard though when the rest of your family are still in contact and feeding back his messages - maybe tell them upfront that you don't want to talk about him. Hopefully they will respect that.

Do keep posting here whenever you feel you need to - everyone here really does 'get it' in a way that people from normal families just aren't able to.

I feel better for typing it out although I think i definitely need some therapy as I'm falling apart.

It's no wonder, with everything you've been through. It's bad enough to lose your mum, but then to not be able to properly grieve because of your dad's behaviour is awful. I'm sure it has brought up a lot of bad memories too, which are also really hard to process. Go easy on yourself, you are really strong to have gotten through this. Definitely go for therapy and look up the Out of the Fog website. It can be hard peeling off the plaster but it's very liberating and validating too.

Thank you @FreshStart01 @Ulterego
Reading the thread is so helpful and definitely need to get therapy, once again it's all about him and I can even grieve mum yet as the pain he is causing.
Sleep well and thanks for taking the time to respond.

@Cherrycee thank you! I will look on the out of the fog website, I've been trying to build myself up with YouTube videos on narcissism but it's all so very hard and no one in real life "gets it"
Thank you again!

I see some parallels to a situation I have Narcda, very difficult ongoing thing in my own life has been made all the more traumatic because my father's (cruel) response was so shocking to me
Even though you go no contact they are still taking up waaay too much headspace 😳🙄😳
Keep posting here, there may be no straightforward answers to these problems...but we will always 'get' you 😊

Hi @narcdad45 I’m so sorry about your mum. Have a look at cruse.org.uk, and get some support dealing with bereavement.
I’d say your dad is punishing you for your close relationship with your mum, which is appalling. Please don’t feel guilty about keeping your kids safe from him, he’s not a good person for them to be around.

I’m guessing the financial aspects of their relationship are causing a lot of anger for him if she died intestate and they weren’t married at her death. Maybe ask on the legal board here for advice, so you know what might happen.

Sorry for your loss 💐

Welcome chloechloe and sorry narcda

I have another interview today. Not in the mood after mum's comments.

Narcdad

My sincerest condolences to you regarding your mother. I would urge you to talk to CRUSE re your bereavement.

I would agree with the other respondents with their description of your father. He is also enlisting "flying monkeys" here (your cousin) to help him do his bidding in contacting you. These people are generally well meaning but easily manipulated relatives. They are not interested in hearing your side of things so their opinion should be roundly ignored.

There is a good government based website on intestacy and I have provided a link www.gov.uk/inherits-someone-dies-without-will.

It is really not possible to have a relationship with someone like your dad. Remember that narcissism is a personality disorder and narcissists' personalities are disordered: they don't make sense! They are not concerned with making sense and they are also impulsive, so you will waste your time trying to understand the details of every little thing they do.

He was not a good parent to you when you were growing up and he will do not too dissimilar harm to your children if he is allowed contact going forward. Keep your children well away from him and use distraction techniques if they ask after him.
You are the parent. You get to make these decisions without apology or excessive justification. You can assure your child that you are making a wise and loving decision for them as well as yourself. I am not going to script what you should say because you are the only one who knows your children, but you must convey that this isn't up for negotiation. This is not a decision that the child gets to make. Yes, children usually love their grandparents. Children are often quite indiscriminate in their love which is why they need parents to guide them. Not every person is safe to have around and this is a good time to teach that important life lesson. The more matter-of-fact you are, the more matter-of-fact your children will be. When we act hysterical, they will usually reflect our hysteria. If you act anxious, they will act anxious. If you appear unsure, they will push. Model the reaction and attitude you want your children to adopt.

If you do have another set of grandparents in the picture then focus on them. It is rare that both sets of grandparents are nasty. Emphasize to your children how much we enjoy being around grandma and grandpa so-and-so (the decent and loving grandparents). Cultivate your children's relationship with the decent, loving grandparents. Teach your children to be grateful for the decent, loving grandparents. Gratitude is a highly effective antidote to loss. Focus them on what they have, not what they don't have. Model that attitude of gratitude.

You will find that the children will eventually stop mentioning the loss of the narcissist grandparent if you are not bringing it up. If you are talking about your narcissistic parent in the hearing of your children then you are inviting them to keep talking about it, too. I can not over-emphasize the need for your explanation to a younger child to be calm, pragmatic, measured and short. Long explanations make you look defensive which will tend to peak the interest of the child and prompt him to push the issue. You can gauge what is appropriate information depending on the age of the child. If the child is older and has experienced or witnessed grandad's nastiness in action then you can say more.

Young children are not known for their long attention spans. This works in your favor. With younger children you have the advantage of distraction. It is easy enough to get the child's mind off onto another track.

@Pukeworthy very best of luck with the interview today, they clearly think you’re talented or they wouldn’t be seeing you, be brilliant!

Remember, the best revenge is a life well-lived.

I wonder if I’m over reacting - perhaps she’s not as bad as I make out?

No, Chloechloe, you are not. You are a normal and decent person trying to find a rational reason for your mother behaving like a spoilt child. The truth is, she expects you to parent her, as well as your children. Mothers like ours grow old but they never grow up. I'm sorry. Try to think of the distance between you as a blessing, because that is what it is, however hard it might seem sometimes. You have a lovely family of your own and you will never treat your children the way your mother treats you. I'd take that as a win.

Narcdad, I'm so sorry. You miss your Mum so much. Do you have anything of hers, anything at all, that you can remember her by? My Dad died two months ago. M cleared out every trace of him within two days. It's like he never existed. It wasn't grief that made her do it - she just couldn't wait to have things all her own way, even though she now refers to him as her "soulmate". I have his service medals but M doesn't know that. He gave them to me very quietly about two years ago, telling me not to say anything. It's all I have. If he hadn't, she'd have sold them online.

Pukeworthy, deep breaths. You can do this. If the last place knew your salary expectations and wanted to interview you, there was more than enough on your CV to make you a serious prospect. You are a serious prospect! Knock 'em dead! Sending you all the calm and confidence and best wishes in the world.

Hi SingingLily

Glad to read you have your late dad's service medals.

Re your comment:-
"M cleared out every trace of him within two days. It's like he never existed. It wasn't grief that made her do it - she just couldn't wait to have things all her own way, even though she now refers to him as her "soulmate".

I can relate to all of the above. My MIL did the self same too even down to the change of tone (this was a man whom she herself could not abide). My H, bless his socks, has nothing from or of his dad apart from one or two mannerisms; not that he was ever much if really anything of a father to him in any event. I once asked him if his dad hugged him as a child; he just looked at me and his silence spoke volumes.

It still never fails to amaze me how such people can and do so rewrite history so readily to meet their own ends.

Pukeworthy

Best of luck for the job interview. I will keep my fingers crossed for you.

Today I received a text hoover, a litany of other people's health problems, I deleted it and I feel a sense of freedom and dettachment, for which I feel grateful 🙏
I would like to share this
m.youtube.com/watch?v=HCVvoL_F5gA
On Children
Kahlil Gibran- 1883-1931
And a woman who held a babe against her bosom said, Speak to us of Children.
And he said:
Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life’s longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow, which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them, but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.
You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite, and He bends you with His might that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let your bending in the archer’s hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies, so He loves also the bow that is stable.

a text hoover
The delete bin is exactly the right place for it, Ulterego. Stay strong.

Thank you, Attila. They mean a lot to me. The upsetting thing in all of this is that although Dad was capable of some pretty awful behaviour himself in his never-ending mission to cocoon M, there were rare moments when he acknowledged the price he was paying and that he was asking us to pay. In his last days, he told me he had only done 51% of his job as a father and bitterly regretted the 49% he should have done but didn't. I think your husband must have had it worse. Safe now, though.

@Pukeworthy Good luck!

@Ulterego Thank you. Not religious but felt very moved by the words of the song, both thinking about how fast my children are growing up and that's the kind of parent I strive to be, and sad that our parents don't seem to get it. Bad attack of insomnia last night, feeling generally over-emotional this morning. Complete lack of sympathy from my 11 year old when I said I'd had no sleep and I found myself worrying that she's a mini-narc in the making which is insane I know, they're all pretty self-centred at that age. Need to get a grip.

Still reading, still so grateful for you all. I hope to be able to join back in properly soon. Ulter, my mum sent me that beautiful poem on the birth of my DD. The irony.

In case it's of use to anyone reading, I had my 7th EMDR today where we looked at me dumping my university boyfriend who I was deeply in love with. I regretted my decision and spent the next 10 years thinking/ being in love with him and not trusting my judgement. I lost all confidence in my ability to make decisions.

This was so overarching and so profound that I didn't think to mention it as a trauma when creating my trauma map. Odd, but sometimes things can just be 'too big'.

I feel profoundly different, at peace but I really want to go to sleep now haha. I also see how my upbringing and lack of love made me act the way I did to that boyfriend.

Somehow it all loops back to mum and the shitty parent she was.