AIBU to think that I must just naturally attract abusers? [Edited by MNHQ]

[nananoon]

I'm in my late 20s, single with one child.

Partner number 1: lovely for a year, then spent 3 years angry, abusive, violent towards me. Punched the wall next to my head, screamed at me, slept with my friend (I caught them in bed together) all whilst I was the most attentive, kind girlfriend.

Partner number 2: visited escorts repeatedly behind my back, used drugs on nights out and would come home demanding sex, had an addiction to pornography, used to masturbate in bed next to me every morning.

Partner 3: turns out was using steroids, slept with his clients behind my back, all unknown to me.

Partner 4: angry, aggressive, has temper problems, emotionally abusive.

You might think that I must have something wrong with me, but I'm a very normal, very kind compassionate person. I'm not thick, I have 3 university degrees and have a professional job. I'm a good mother, I adore my family, I volunteer with the homeless. I'm generally a nice kind person. None of that is a boast, I just want people to see I'm not an arsehole that deserves these kind of men.

They all seem lovely to start, but then end up abusing me or mistreating me. So AIBU to think that as well as these men having something wrong with them, that I must have something wrong with me too? A sign on my forehead maybe? I'm a single mum to a 6th month old, I'm absolutely desperate to know what it's like to be in a loving relationship...

People are hugely ignorant cole. Part of the many reasons why DV is still so prevalent.

This thread is like bingo for every myth about abusers, abuse and their victims.

This is being shared on a thread about DV online;

''Especially wanted to opine when someone mentioned that
abusers can go up to 18 months without showing their true colours. I used to supervise all the DV programs at one of my former agencies, and one of those programs was a batterers‘ intervention program. One night after the group the facilitator (who was my boss, temporarily filling in) called me and said he thought I might be interested in the night's topic. He started of by asking the group if, when they got together with a new partner. they started abusing her right away. or if they waited a while. The vote was unanimous: Oh no. if you start being abusive right away, she'll leave you. You have to get a hook in first, cut off her avenues of escape. get her locked down tight enough that she cant get away first, before you can start. So then he asked them what was the optimum amount of time to wait. That is when the discussion ensured... everyone had a different opinion. So he gave them a task, to come to a unanimous consensus: what is the optimum amount of time to wait after starting to date a new partner before you can start abusing them‘?
And, coldly, calculatingly. they spent the rest of the session debating the issue. weighing the pros and cons. to come up with their final answer: "if you really want to do it right," "if you really want to lock her down so she cant getaway. ' one to two years. Took my breath away. People say abusers "cant control themselves,"they are "out of control,"they are drunk and ‘don't know what they're doing." Bullshit. They know EXACTLY what they are doing. to the point where those guys could methodically weigh the pros and cons and come up with a calculated strategy that carefully closed of all avenues of escape to their partners BEFORE they started their behaviour... because they KNOW that their partners would leave them unless the stakes were too high first.
Changed forever how I think of abusers....''

I think 2 things every woman can do for herself are;

1. Take the Freedom Programme, and
2. Read The Gift of Fear, learn the red flags for abuse, and leave at the first indication. Never give a potential abuser the benefit of the doubt.

the-eye.eu/public/Books/Radical%20Feminist%20Literature/Gavin%20de%20Becker/The%20Gift%20of%20Fear%20%28123%29/The%20Gift%20of%20Fear%20-%20Gavin%20de%20Becker.pdf

I think you could be right. Confident types don't tend to attract bullies, do they? Quiet people who give the impression that they're pushovers sadly do. Whatever a nasty person's methods they don't want to have to try too hard so a quiet unconfident character is like a magnet to them.

I've always been quiet and have attracted bullies since childhood, luckily almost always at work rather than in my personal life. However, assertiveness is an art which can be learned and I urge you to do so as it will be of great benefit to you. I've got better as I've aged and I hope you do too, only faster in your case.

One of the ways loving parents can accidentally programme their children to tolerate abuse is by bringing them up to be polite, respectful, obedient, considerate- all good qualities, but you have to allow the child to put themselves first.

I was a foster carer, we put ourselves out for other people, prioritise other people's needs.
I realised DS2 was suppressing his own needs and feelings to his own detriment, and had to work with him to give him permission to misbehave and be unreasonable.

Are you a perfectionist and a people pleaser? I think that can leave us vulnerable.

Let your love for DS set your shark cage bars. Don't let anyone near him who is disrespectful, has opinions you don't like, that you hope will change over time.

Are you chasing that excitement?

Yes I find being abused incredibly exciting.

Are you attracted to men with an edge?

Clearly a violent and abusive one!

I'm sorry, but no one can bring you down unless you let them.

I guess I must accept responsibility then.

My last 2 relationships ended incredibly badly. The last one couldn't have ended worse really and I'm still dealing with the fallout (as I will be for many years). I am in counselling, doing the freedom Programme, read every book going but that was true before I met the most recent one, too. I now see that my problem was that all the "work" I had done was theoretical, I wasn't putting it into practice. And that this is the advice people often come out with (and have given me again this time) about just not dating. I think that advice is wrong, actually. Very well meaning but wrong. If I never date because I am scared another abuser will find me (which they inevitably will even if I'm not looking) then I will not be practising my new sign spotting and listening to my gut skills. I'll be living as a potential victim, not being active in changing the narrative.
So yes, have a break from dating, do the freedom Programme and of course look after your son and make sure your putting him first (don't introduce anyone new too soon etc.)
But also, observe men, observe relationships, read about them as well, and look for signs etc. Learn to listen to yourself and be intuitive. And, don't just never date. But see it not as a serious endeavour but as practise. Get a babysitter every 2 or 3 weeks, go out, chat, flirt, go on dates, and get first hand experience at spotting abusers before you consider dating properly. Hiding from these men doesn't help, they find us anyway and we are weaker for it because we are out of practise at spotting the signs.

I had the same question as Eliza and the phrase "I'm not an arsehole that deserves these kind of men." doesn't make the idea that no one deserves to be abused in a relationship "very clear". My parents were in a reciprocally abusive relationship and still neither deserved the abuse they received from the other no matter what else was going on in their lives, they just also didn't deserve any partner while doing that. It is difficult to balance listing a bunch of criteria as proof with being firm that abuse isn't ever okay in a relationship, I think it makes it easier to feel that no matter our accomplishments we might not be 'worth it' with a viewpoint that there are reasons why we shouldn't when the only reason we need is that no one should be treated that way.

I agree with previous posters that many abusers target particular traits. I saw it with my father - great job, an important member of the church, looked like a great family man having custody of all his kids...and an abusive addict who was a horrible master of fleecing women and their families of money. He always picked the same kind of women - ones who were very nice but liked things just so and more than a little impressed with the facade he put up while also having easy to pull heartstrings for a sob story, from naice religious families (particularly from the same evangelical church most of my father's family works in - easier to impress being the son of a preacher). He knew all their buttons and the amount they defended his ridiculous behaviour seemed to make it even harder to show them the red banners in front of them.

I don't think those women really naturally attracted abusers or that they were attracted to edge or whatever, but that the environment both enabled the abusers like my father and made it hard for victims to not blame themselves or think to get out of it until things had hit beyond rock bottom. Most of them prized themselves as being good partners and didn't seem to understand why he didn't improve, it always took something big to figure out he didn't want to as he was getting all he wanted and kept looking good whatever they did. I think the community has to take part of the blame that so many end up in these situations.

I don't think some people have actually read my posts.

I'm confident. Have high self esteem. I speak publicly. I would happily put a man in his place at work if I needed to (a woman also). I am only this way in relationships.

People are hugely ignorant cole. Part of the many reasons why DV is still so prevalent.

I'm actually very shocked by this thread.

@FuzzyShadowChatter I apologise for wording it that way. I obviously didn't think about what I was writing. I didn't mean that people deserve to be abused. I meant that I'm not an arsehole and I hadn't done anything specific that may have made my exes see red or treat me this way. 'Deserves' was obviously the wrong word and I do not think anybody deserves any kind of abuse.

I hope that is clear now. I have just come out of a continuous stream of abusive relationships that have happened over 10 years. I'm finally seeing this pattern of behaviour on my part and I'm not in a very good head space. I'm not thinking clearly and don't wish to offend anyone.

The Shark cage analogy is very good! Thank you for the links.

Many abusers see confident women as a challenge to be conquered for extra points. They aren't people who go into a relationship and end up being abusive. The control is the end game for them.

Threads like this are a grim reminder of why so many men get away with it. People make excuses for them and blame their victim.

Do the Freedom Programme nanamoon.

Some very helpful people on this thread but I'm sad to say it's made me feel a lot worse reading some of the posts on here. Think I had better call it a day.

It's almost like I'm trying to convince everyone that I'm in a wonderful loving relationship in order for them to not judge me.

This^ and other comment you have made about being an embarrassment to your family/being a single mum with nothing/life the pits says volumes about how you view yourself and your self esteem op.

Most importantly you really really want to be with someone lovely so are willing to overlook red flags/ abusive behavior once it starts.

In my late teens l had a truly lovely friend, who sounds a bit like you, kind, generous and fun and perfectly intelligent, BUT she was desperate to be loved and always ended up being horribly treated by men...
.when we were out socially, her starting point was 'how can l get him to like me' pretty much to any man.
mine was, 'do l really like him, and will he make a great effort for me.!
Needless to say she had loads of brief relationships (but was treated appallingly)
I had very few ( but was treated very well)
Still abuse can happen to anyone, after my 20s in a couple of great relationships, at 30ish l met someone who after being incredibly loving and kind, for a year, suddenly and inexplicably hit me out of the blue, no argument, nothing.
I left him then and there, (we didn't live toghether).
He broke into my flat a week later and held me there for a terrifying night, l thought he was going to kill me such was his rage.
At dawn l managed to trick him and escaped, called the police,gave a statement, demanded to know what action they were going to take against him.(none for the first offense sadly)
That day l let my work know so security could keep him away, told all my friends, our joint friends, my parents, HIS parents, his sister (who admitted he had done similar before)
My mum even called his parents to make them face what their son had done. We called him out on his behavior to the world essentially.
He stalked me for several months despite everything.
l called the police everytime he arrived, and threatened to destroy him professionally, should he not leave me alone. eventually l moved and changed career so he could no longer find me.

So l do understand abusers are very clever and subtle, but unlike my friend, my attitude is zero tolerance to any nasty behavior, because l value myself more than that,
why?...to me only a good kind relationship is better than being alone.
I rarely think about my abusive bf, but if l do l still feel incredible rage at him, how dare he hit me ?
Women have to set firm boundaries and be prepared to value themselves over a man......only a good kind man who loves and protects you is worth a second glance op.
You are very young, live life, do interesting things. build your courage and self esteem, set your standards high and never let them slip.
Let the next man in your life prove himself worth it and worth YOU.

Please read the book in the link I posted, it will help you spot the time wasters earlier in the process.

Is there a reason you don’t just stay single for a while?
I think it’s telling that you see yourself as a failure because you’re single. Especially as you’re a mum. So many others would see it as a blessing, perspective really is everything.
Why don’t you just focus on DC and your career for the moment? Or change your thinking from “why do I attract these men” to “why do I feel like I need a man?”

I have a friend who jumps from one abusive relationship to another and it boils down to the fact she just can’t be single and they seem to see this in her so she tolerates more than anyone I know.

I haven’t been abused but I have spotted signs (jealousy, showing signs of rage during a disagreement etc) and cut things short immediately as a result.

And all the women my father targetted were publically confident women with great jobs and were well-known for their work in the community, but they also wanted to have relationships that were and looked good. I think it can be harder if everything is going well for an area that is so personal to not go well. It's easy to feel it's a personal failing that you can fix if you just keep at it and no one knows until you do rather than think it might be him and he might be doing this to you on purpose because this is how he wants it when you've done nothing to deserve it.

One of the ways loving parents can accidentally programme their children to tolerate abuse is by bringing them up to be polite, respectful, obedient, considerate- all good qualities, but you have to allow the child to put themselves first.
Not saying that this is you OP - but it's certainly me.
My DM was quite strict and did exactly the above. I was never allowed to disagree, talk back etc and for years I had problems with authority, and then in relationships because I didn't know how to stick up for myself.
In real life - also confident, good at public speaking etc. (looking back - always the 'good girl')
Op - I don't really have any advice. You have to look forward to how you would see the red flags in your next relationship. And please don't be too eager to start one until you are happy to be on your own.

Op, you yourself said you stayed so long as you wished to show people you were in a loving relationship, it does you no favours to pretend you bear no responsibility at all.

@Bluntness100 just bloody well STOP, please.

I bear absolutely no responsibility at all for being abused.

Even good relationships aren't always easy.

@supersop60 🤦🏽‍♀️

Either low self esteem and confidence levels on your part, they can definitely sniff that out. Also maybe some trauma in your past has lead you to believe you aren’t worth more than this sort of treatment. I know people use ‘daddy issues’ in a derogatory manner but that can definitely cause women to choose undesirable men too.

It has nothing to do with intellect.