Panorama, BBC1 now. Domestic violence

[AnyFuckerForAMincePie]

Scary stuff.

I'm afraid it is you, sugarcoated, who is becoming rude and personal. I stick up for and am willing to fight for ALL victims of abuse, regardless of gender. Do you have a problem with that too? And if you wish to challenge the stats I suggest you complain to the Office of Official Statistics, not me. They also say that men are three times less likely than women to report DV.

It is sadly true that women have had to fight for their support network: it is also sadly true that men are now having to fight for theirs. Two wrongs do not make a right.

And what funding does Mankind get? It's a great organisation, but comparing it to Women's Aid is like comparing Tesco to a corner shop.

Refuge places for women in the UK - 7500.
Refuge places for men - 12 (and 8 of these are specifically for gay men)

sorry arth: these are CRIME statistics, not false allegation statistics

They are British Crime Survey statistics - where victims self report, and where the severity of the crime is not taken into account. It is referring to "any form of domestic abuse".

Research has shown that men will overestimate the severity of violence against them, whilst women will underestimate it. So men might take a slap or a scratch of the fingernails as a crime against them. Women will tend to excuse a slap or a push against them. This was shown in the Panorama - the woman was sat there with broken ribs, black eyes and a swollen face (the police officer said he's never seen such bad injuries on someone still alive). The perpetrator was demanding 'who had called the police' and crying about going to prison.

Women live in fear of their lives when they are in violent relationships - 2 women per week are killed by partners/ex-partners and the majority of times it is when they are trying to leave the violent relationship. Women are fearful of men when they are in violent relationships - they are in real physical danger. Men are not. The average man can defend himself easily against most women - that's not to excuse female violence against men - but we have to take into account the physical fear men can wield over women in intimate relationships.

The false allegation statistics clearly show that women have a near monopoly of those!

Wrong again. False allegations of dv are exceedingly low. Keir Starmer found that they are few and far between. and far less than other crimes.

survivor147

Your claim about false allegations of sexual abuse (a common obsession among misogynists and irrelevant to the discussion) is inaccurate.

False allegations of rape and domestic violence are rare, as proved by the 17 month long study by the former DPP Keir Starmer.

www.theguardian.com/society/2013/mar/13/rape-investigations-belief-false-accusations

Snap! Sabrina.

Can we also factor into the BCS stats the number of abusive men who claim that their partner is the abusive. Sorry to be a bore about this, but it's important.

It's that " The average man can defend himself easily against most women" chestnut again....how exactly can men do that?? Any form of physical retaliation or attempts to physically restrain are totally out of the question - abusive women will commonly goad their victim with "come on, hit me, you know you want to" but any man who does that is instantly transformed into the perpetrator. And you can't walk away if she is barring the door. In my experience, most male victims simply lie there and take the violence until she stops. I know many men who have iived in physical - and sexual - fear of their female abusers, despite any gender differences in strength and size. Also, men are 3 times less likely than women to report physical abuse - because they are ASHAMED.

Mankind gets less funding because a) there are fewer male dv victims and b) it's very difficult to get men to take dv seriously against either gender and they are the ones who need to be setting up all male refuges.

Many men sit on the internet and discrupt discussions of male on female violence, but sadly few actually get off their arses and do something to help.

By help I mean help male victims ^

Yes, Twinklestein - three quarters of dv perpetrated by women against men is, in fact, in self defence or retaliation. But their male partners will claim they are the victim.

Violence is wrong: domestic abuse is wrong. Men and women should be working together to bring perpetrators to justice and to educate the next generation so that it stops. That's my agenda, and it is entirely gender-neutral. I'm sorry if anyone is paranoid enough to think that I'm some sort of evil troll perpetrator, and will leave you with these little bits of food for thought. You may at least like the song! Best wishes to all who want to end abuse: may we achieve it one day.

www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/30202735

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-lancashire-30387077

Research also shows that men are more likely to report dv than their female counterparts, they are also more likely to press charges.

Far from being ashamed about it, they are more likely to overestimate the severity of violence against them, whereas women are more likely to underestimate it/excuse it.

It is very unwise to treat dv as 'gender neutral' - it is not. 80-90% of dv convictions are against men - despite what I've typed above. In my eyes, other than rape, it is the greatest implementation of oppression against women in our supposed 'equal' Western society. It is men seeking to dominate and control their partners and children via violence or the threat of violence.

Oh look a thread about domestic violence, which is overwhelmingly perpetrated by men against women, being dominated by discussion about the minority of male victims and female perpetrators.

Now that never happens.

Oh, wait.

And if you think I'm clicking on a BBC Newsbeat piece after their reaction to Keir Starmer's 17 month research study- well. You've got another thought coming.

But - male victims of dv are more highly represented in the media too (surprise surprise).

Being gender neutral about DV is a bit like being neutral on the question of a powerless person and a powerful person having a fight.

It means that in effect, you're on the side of the powerful.

Survivor please tell me where I have been 'rude and personal'

you wrote this: Oh dear sugarcoatedthorns....I don't know what world you're living in, but it certainly isn't the real one. Maybe you should come to one of our group sessions with male victims. Again, this SHOULD NOT BE a gender issue!

Oh dear ?? is this a helpful contribution? or patronising
I don't know what world you are living in, but it certainly isn't the real one. - you don't consider this rude or personal??? mmmm.

its true, and something the police are very familiar with, that men will misreport their victims as the abuser.

I fear everything being said is just being completely ignored and shouted over in order to simply derail the gender issue of abuse.

Its like men don't want to take responsibility, despite the glaringly obvious.
Same as someone before said... just use each opportunity as one to refuse responsibility and try to derail instead?

And a YT video doesn't negate all that I and others have said above, either.

sorry! *some men

I've no idea what your agenda is survivor but if you really want men and women to work together to end all da why are you here making all kinds of false allegations and factually incorrect statements?

I'm on the side of the victim, whatever gender he/she may be. That's the point. I do not seek to minimise, justify, or trivialise the experience of ANY victim, female or male. The powerless person in a relationship is by no means always female, and the powerful person is by no means always male.

Sabrina which YT Vid are you talking about? presuming you mean survivors links? or were you referring to the TT one?

The one in survivor's 22:53 post, sugar.

I'm on the side of the victim, whatever gender he/she may be. That's the point.

Really? Well you just come across as having issues with women.

ah yes, thanks Sabrina

So if all else fails, and you have no sound arguments about why all DA/DV should end, rather than just that against women, then why not just accuse the person suggesting that of being a misogynist.....brilliant!