Can a man have a temper without it being 'abuse'?

[Polaris]

Can a man have a bad temper without his temper being abusive?

My DH has one. I suppose it is abusive because it's only ever aimed at me. But, he's not manipulative or controlling, so it's just a temper then, isn't it?

But surely it is manipulative and controlling because you presumably modify your behaviour so as not to set him off?

Sorry to post and run but I've got to go out.

yes, of course. same as a woman can.

how do you react to his temper??

what is his temper anyway?? shouting,throwing....what?

It doesn't matter what you call it

If you are happy to be your husband's emotional punching bag, then fair play to you

I have a temper, but I'm not abusive. In that I mean that I don't swear, shout, threaten, hit or intimidate other people when enraged. My anger isn't directed in a destructive/abusive way. I might say why I'm annoyed with a person, but I then take myself off to calm down/hit pillows. Everyone has a temper, don't they? It becomes abusive when it's used as a weapon, IMO.

He is being abusive because he is only ever directing his anger towards you.

What chicken said.

What Thingumy said. It's one of the easiest ways to decide if a man is being abusive rather than just having lousy self-control: does he shout at his workmates or random strangers? Start fights over who's looking at him funny? Break and throw objects in the workplace? Or is it only the woman he's supposed to love who gets the slaps, the punches, the name-calling and the intimidation?
Because if he can avoid tantrumming at work or in the street, then he is choosing to mistreat his partner, because he thinks it's all right to do so, because she's only a 'woman' and what's more she belongs to him so he can smash her or throw her away with no comebacks.
While a man who loses his temper with everyone makes a lousy partner in many ways (tantrumming people are a PITA no matter what, he's an adult not a toddler) it's easier to see that it's him with the problem, but a domestically abusive man often manages to convince his victim that it's her fault she gets punched or shouted at or sexually assaulted, because, after all, he doesn't do it to anyone else, and if she were a 'better wife' he wouldn't do it to her.

Polaris - you seem to be trying to convince yourself that your DH has a bad temper but is not abusive. I think it depends on how the bad temper manifests itself - is he shouting/screaming at you, calling you insulting names, stomping around etc etc. I think CHedgehog has a good point - what is your reaction - does it scare you - do you modify your behaviour to try to prevent these temper outbursts.

These behaviours can be emotionally abusive and it would be hard to argue that that is not the case.

What part do you play - do you shout back or just say nothing and hope it will blow out. What triggers these outbursts. Is he regretful after and apologetic. Does this happen around you kids (if you have any)..

We can all behave irrationally and badly at times to a greater or lesser extent. I think if adults (usually men) have bad tempers it means that they have never learned to regulate their emotions in childhood.

Can you and your H talk about these outbursts. How long have you been together and has this always been the case. Many people (men and women) choose their victim (not a conscious decision) but if you like they know who they can get away with it, IFYSWIM.

What kind of personality does he have when not having temper outbursts.

It is extremely important to be aware of the fact that A only behaves like he/she does because B lets him/her do it. A can't change B's behaviour but they can change theirs, and this will change the dynamic, not necessarily for the good but it will give the one with the temper something to think about. A row is like a play - it has a script and each partner plays their part (againnot consciously but it does happen) so think about your reaction and change it, and he will be a bit mystified because you aren't sticking to the script.

Maybe post again with more details?

Maybe post again with more detail?

Thanks for posting.

DH (of 8 yrs) shouts, throws things, humiliates me in front of family and friends. He can easily control his temper with others. He can be quite rude and off hand, though, with a select few of my friends and family.

He sulks (but deines he's sulking), blames me for everything - no matter how ludicrous (we laugh about it when it's not a problem). He can get drunk from time to time, loose his memory and act like a lout in front of our young children. I also receive snide looks, have been called names occassionally, am on the end of 'gaslighting' treatment (just learnt that today!). I don't ever arrange visits for us both with my friends because I'm not confident of his cconduct - he doesn't like any of them anyway. Family get together's on my side are a nightmare.

He denies that there is a problem - even though his dislike for my F&F is written all over his face (no reason for it - they are all lovely).

I'd say he's like the above maybe 20% of the time to some level.

The rest of the time he is jovial, quite laid back, popular. He will talk about his behaviour with me and accept responsibility though is surprised when I tell him I'm frightened of him because of it.

Example situation: We were in a restaurant with our friends the other evening, with our children (and our friends'
DCs - a joint family outing). The waitress did something to piss him off. Then, about half and hour later - when the other male of the group was away from the table (he's DH's friend from school) - I said something that he took as criticism. He stood up and barked at me until I wished the ground would swallow me up. Everyone in the restaurant could hear. My friend and my DD (old enough to understand to a point) both went red and looked down at the floor. It was really humiliating.

When he is angry or being a bully I NEVER do anything to provoke him further. I just shut my mouth, let things calm down and then try and talk about it later, and he tries to listen but usually doesn't see.

He quite often cries if I tell him I've had enough and I want to separate and just won't have it at all. I hate that. It should be me crying.

His behaviour can be very frihtening, but usually - thankfully - quite short lived and quickly forgotten. Once the temper is over, things settle and he can sometimes feel guilty and try and put thing right by being nice (which just annoys me now).

When we got home after the restaurant thing I told him to get help or get out. He's been overtly nice to me ever since and has promised to go and see someone.

I find it hard to read his moods. I think maybe I'm a bit sensitive as he'll look like he's simmering about something, but will claim he's fine.

I don't dare talk about anything that gets me down otherwise HE gets upset.

I suppose things are okay when I'm a nice, happy wife. If I'm not for any reason there is trouble - usually him asking me in an intimiading and not at all concerned way 'are you OKAY honey??'. I'm not allowed to be human. Maybe that's all part of him controlling me.

I'm so used to it I have thought - until recently - it's all my fault for having a strong personality. Just typing this makes me feel ashamed for how stupid I've been.

We went to councelling five years ago about the same problem but it hasn't really worked as you can tell.

I'm so confused.

Don't be confused. It's not you it's him.

OP...please google "Cycle of Abuse"

he is now in the "nice" part of the cycle, it will turn again as you very well know

I can't link it as am not on usual pc

I wouldn't remain with a man like this

he humiliates you ? what a fucker, you should not stand for that

if you have dc, they will be learning some very damaging lessons about what constitutes a relationship

He's a shit. Get rid. Couple-counselling won't work on an abusive man.
From what you have posted, this man hates women and doesn't think they are human. That's an attitude that's impossible to change.

Thanks AnyF. TBH, the DCs are probably not really taking it in that much. The behaviour is mostly quite subtle and any real tantrums - mostly - take place mainly when they are in bed asleep. Although as they get older, I can see it might become more or a problem.

yes, the Dc's are taking it in

don't fool yourself that they don't see what is happening

I expect you say this bloke is a "good dad" too

well, I'm so confused I haven't a clue what's real and what's not.

Oh, well that is being a nasty bastard. If he can behave himself with other people, he doesn't just have a fiery temper.

you are confused,yes,course you are. look at his behaviours.....imagine him speaking to others like this....his boss,parents,police officer,shop assistant......how would you feel if you were stood next to him while he was shouting/humiliating these people?

think you'd be less confused then,and would see very,very clearly who you are married to.

a bully

polaris the DCs were at the restaurant right? they saw, they heard. they probably already modify their behaviour.

you think they asleep - but are they?

for a year after i left my similar exP and we lived n a nice safe new flat, the DC would ask me before they did anything remotely "risky" ie would risk an outburst from exP -
"can we do painting?2

"can i go outside even tho it is a bit muddy?"

"can i dig in the soil for worms?" etc - yes always good to ask but they were asking because these were things that would set him off getting untidy, getting muddy etcetc. just an example. they now allowed to play and "be" children without fear of repurcussions.

give him a timeline to go see someone -in the meantime you go see someone or at least call womens aid and talk things through - consider your options, practicalities etc

I have accepted he is a bully - but is that abuse? I don't know, none of us are perfect. I don't want to make lots of people miserable and leave my DCs without a dad just because he's a sulky pants.

I mean, I'm sure men used to be like this all the time 100 years ago. I don't know why I say that, I just think women have put up with more than this throughout the ages.

Please don't dismiss me for this view. I reckon it does sound stupid. I just need to know I'm not a bad person who has fallen out of love with her DH and wants an excuse to leave (which is what I've thought for ages). I'm beginning to realise that I don't love him BECAUSE of his behaviour and that I can't be blamed for the way I feel.

I think they probably can yes, but it doesn't sound as if yours can.

He is a bully.

And, yes. It is abusive.

You are modifying your behaviour to placate him.

Your children will learn to do the same.

Is that what you want for them? How you want to live, your children to live?

Is bullying you abuse? Yes. Absolutely. Whether you put up with it is your choice, of course. And justifying his behaviour by assuming all men were arseholes 100 years ago won't help you now.

Like I said at the beginning of this thread

It doesn't matter what it is it's how it makes you feel

If you want to leave your relationship, you have more than enough reason

is that what you wanted to hear ?

Or did you want someone to say "all men are like that, and no relationship is perfect"

well, all men are not like that and your relationship is so far from perfect it is off the scale, IMO

I suppose we all have to modify our behaviour to some extend though, otherwise we'd all be going around fighting in the street.

I just don't know where the boundaries are.

He is abusive, yes, but I suppose only moderately. The disruption caused by a divorce - and the poverty we would be in - would, certainly, affect the DCs more than putting up with a mildly abusive father. Or am I way of the mark?

My DM is not helping either. She knows what he's like and has been at the wrong end of his behaviour herself (in fact they hate each other), but she is encouraging me to put up with it for the DCs sake. She had a VERY abusive father too. I can't help but think that this is because she's worried about what her friends would say if we broke up.