Can a man have a temper without it being 'abuse'?

[Polaris]

Can a man have a bad temper without his temper being abusive?

My DH has one. I suppose it is abusive because it's only ever aimed at me. But, he's not manipulative or controlling, so it's just a temper then, isn't it?

I find it truly shocking you would let your children live in these circumstances just for the sake of (imagined) other peoples opinions.

It is difficult to leave someone, but at least with time you will have a chance to be happy again. If you stay with him it will only get worse, and you will ruin your children.

I've been where you are Polaris with my H; even done the hugely embarassing outburst in a restaurant.

My H is no longer around because he died.

My DD aged twelve has issues which are as a direct result of her fathers behaviour. DS aged four has escaped the worst. Yes, your DCs are taking it all in.

I found mumsnet after H died, I wish I'd seen it before, there are a lot of wise and supportive people on here.

Your DH is a bully. As a rule bullies are cowards.

My life is pleasant now, with no fear of the next load of verbal abuse my H saw fit to dish out.

Thanks, Chickens I do really need to hear it. Oh god I'm so frightened. Everyone is so set on not rocking the boat that they just want to believe things are all okay.

I'm so surprised my DM is not telling me to go. I've told her and she just said 'I hope you're not telling me you're leaving him' in a threatening voice. She says he's not all that bad because he at least works hard and you can tell he loves us - especially me - underneath it all. And that there are good things about hime - that he's good looking (so what!) and presentable. I mean WTF! That's no reason to stay. It's done nothing to help my confusion. In fact it's made it worse.

She had a dreadful upbringing with her DF and she is TOTALLY fucked up I can tell you.

So anyway, with my DM telling me to stay with him I can't work out what's right or wrong.

Well then her opinion is not to be trusted then is it? Logically, she is unable to give you decent advice.

It is scary. But aren't you scared anyway?

Your mother doesnt live with him

"She had a dreadful upbringing with her DF and she is TOTALLY fucked up I can tell you."

is this what you want for your children?

trust your instinct Polaris, don't be scared, lay down boundries and tell the lot of them to 'fuck off'.

Show them you are not to be taken for a fool any longer, no doubt their actions won't be what you expect.

My childhood was like chickens and AFs too. My mother was bullying and abusive (and alternately 'loving') to both my father and her dcs (there are five of us) and my father was physically violent ('thrashing' us etc) to us dcs.

As a result I am shit at dealing with authority figures, got myself into terrible abusive relationships, have had stacks of counselling etc.

Have little contact with my parents or any of my siblings now.

I used to argue that it was just their 'generation' - the way they dealt with children back in those old days (as you are trying to rationalise to some degree.)

But this is wrong wrong wrong. Many of my contemporaries have parents the same age as mine (in their 80s) but they were NOT thrashed or shouted and sworn at/constantly criticised as children.

In doing as they did to us my parents just continued the cycle of abuse they themselves were treated to as children.

Still doesnt excuse it in my book. Not one iota.

I have a son and I cannot imagine thrashing him for one nano second.

You are setting your children up for a lifetime of misery and confusion and probably crap relationships and a whole load of therapy when they're older, if you stay with this man.

ive never understood the pov where women say 'i'm splitting up the family'

of course by his actions - HE is splitting up the family.

or 'my children shouldnt do without a father' type of responses - well your marriage and his fatherhood are seperate - and if he is indeed any kind of a decent father - the fact that you have seperated shouldn't factor into his ability to continue to be a good father.

--

i know what i'm talking about, ive had my fair share of dysfunction in my relationship, at one time it took 5 years of treading on eggshells, just nowt wanting dh to erupt - but unlike you, it took me THAT long to realise that i was being a fucking mug, that my life, my actions, wehre i went and when and with whom all revolved around what dh might say - i was adament i was (i am) a strong person, i was adament i wasn't asking permission - but it wasn't like i was coming home and sayin "plase sir..cc.cc.c.ccan i ppppplease go out with mmmmy friends" it was nothing like that at all, but in effect ALL ALL of my decision making processes factored in how dh would react. at that time ( over 4 years ago now) i remember changing names and coming on mumsnet and posting about how i didn't feel like i had any self worth left'

from what time i made the tea, to telling the kids to be quiet and not to disturb daddy...a the fucking time. and a rubbish dad he was at that time too.

but it took me ages to get to a point where i stopped making the really lame excuses that you are (sorry!) but you are - you wi hold onto a splinter of anything that remains becuase youloved what they ONCE were, or the ideal ou portrayed yourself to be.

Ignore your mother. Her opinion isn't valid if she comes from a dysfunctional background herself. This is your chance to break the cycle and give your DC a positive role model. You can be happy on your own, and you can in time meet someone else who doesn't think you're his 'thing' to be treated in whichever way he sees fit.

Custardo is right, HE is splitting the family due to HIS behaviour.

My DH isn't as bad as her father by a long way. He does love us, he's just got conduct issues. I can't work out what the best of a bad situation is regarding the DCs.

I mean, what if I get together with someone else? He might turn out to be a complete prick too. What will the DCs think then?

I know it's draconian, but I sometimes think it is just best to put up and shutup.

I'm not arguing that you're right. I just think we're in this unfortunate situation and we'll be lucky to improve it as leaving might end up far worse. Look at the stats about children from broken homes. They're blamed for EVERYTHING. Basically I'm damned if I do, and damned if I don't.

Oh well. Stay then.

Polaris , your wasting your time posting about your dh if your not going to do anything about it.
Are you that downtrodden and crushed confidence ?

Your enableing him.

or you could be happy

or theres an inbetween where you sit down with this mean and tell him that the reatinship in its current form isn't working. As a human being you refuse to be humiliated humiliated in public OR private.

and that there are two choices - he souces angar management, pays for it attends it and makes a committment to change, and you both go to relate.

now you mmight come back and tell me you can't afford it - and i ask you what price you put on trying to put things right.

if after that has failed - or he doesn't want to
or he doesn't make the effort to make the appointments - at that point, you've done all you can and you should leave.

why dhould anyone be treated like shit

put it this way - why didn't your dh shout at the stranger that was the waitress that pissed him off?

why ?

why is it ok for him to behave in a socially accepted manner with a compete strager - yet treat you ...supposedly the one he loves..like shit? its bizzare isn't it ?

To be honest, all I ever do is analyse stuff. It's only recently that I've realised this is a symptom of depression. I'm looking for reasons - within myself. The answer is probably staring at me in the face and I just couldn't see it.

I'm fed up with thinking I'm to blame, that the reason why I'm looking at other men is because I've got no loyalty or commitment abilities. I've convinced myself I'm bored of my relationship and it's my fault for being flighty. I'm insecure and don't want to see my friends because of their happy marriages. I thought I was a nasty jealous resentful person. I now think I might have good reason to feel the way I do after such a prologued shit marriage.

Which is why I needed to know for sure if he is abusive. I called Respect and the man there said it sounded as if I had a problem.

hides thread. Cannot read your lame excuses anymore

Yeah, sorry, I can't keep listening to you making excuses. Several of us have told you how it is affecting your DC. If you wilfully ignore us, then they will judge him and you for allowing this to continue. There is nothing 'ok' about listening to your father rant and rave at your mother, and her just taking it. Because if she won't stand up for herself, she sure as hell won't stand up for you when it counts.

"he's just got conduct issues". No he hasn't. If he had conduct issues he would treat everyone as badly as he treats you. He's an abuser.

"I mean, what if I get together with someone else? He might turn out to be a complete prick too."

He might. Or he might be the lovely man you deserve. Or you might feel it's best not to have any man for a while, until you're feeling more confident in yourself.

Sounds to me like you are more worried about being on your own with no man than about the welfare of your dcs.

You think you might be led into 'temptation' if you stay - ie if it gets worse with your DH you will want to slip into another relationship

You say you will be blamed by your family/friends etc - what even the friends he humiliated you in front of making them go red and look at the floor??

You say things like 'better the devil you know'
and 'the next bloke could be a disatser to0o'

Goodness me, can you really honestly not exist for a minute with out a man? Even a shit one?

Please don't give me the 'just stay then' treatment. I needed guidance from you to get to the bottom of whether he was abusing me or not and why I'm only just asking these questions seriously.

I don't want practical advice, just opinions from outside parties about their views on where the lines are drawn.

Thanks for listening.

How would you feel if like me you found yourself in a hospital and knew he was going to die? This abusive, difficult man who is supposed to be your partner in life.

If you think about it and think like I did in that situation; 'I'm going to be FREE, FREE...' then you should get out.

Every day I live since H died I cannot believe my luck. How fucking sad is that but its a fact.

People who know me comment on how well I look these days and I am not afraid to say why, I don't care what they think because I'm free of it

I only wish I'd got up the strength to leave him years ago.

Why don't you give Woman's aid a call and ask for advice?

They will give you guidance.

My marriage was similar to this.

I left him and took the children to a private rent.

I now have two kids who sleep better, we don't walk on eggshells for fear of his mood and my son (11) is far more confident.

So confident he has told me he doesn't want to stay over with his father.

I'm so proud of him. He has blossomed since we left.