Finally confronting his verbal abuse

[onelastchance]

Brief history: sh and i together 9 years, i ds (4). Very volatile relatioship. Both witnessed emotional abuse from our parents. I recognised a few yeara ago i could be abusive and changed my behaviour. Dh is still emotionally abusive( and be lovely, kind, thoughtful, supportive too) but i can't take any more of the bad bits. i've told him this and have witten down the behaviours i find unacceptable along with a list of the positive things in our relationship. I'e made it clear i'll end things if these abusive behaviours continue and have said i'll support hm if he wants outside help and have also ordered a book about emotional abuse for us both to read.

The abusive behaviours he can display are; threatening stonewalling, intimidationg, dismissing, trivialising gaslighting, not taking responsibility for his behaviour.

The positive ones are thoughtful, considerate, responsible, loyal, kind.

We haven't discussed to list yet (he's done one for me too, but the only negative he could come up with were untidyiness and reminding him to do things when h'e busy). We've agreed to have time to think about the list first and discuss in a few days time. Hoe this isn't a waste of time....

This is not a healthy relationship for any of you to be in, including your ds. You need to stick by what you've said, and if he doesn't change then you need to go.

Give councelling a try, but it will only work if you will both be honest in your sessions.

I wish you luck and you get the outcome you want

Hmm. I think he might well tell you to shove your list- it comes across as a bit odd to me. I'm not quite sure what I mean or how to word this, but it sounds like you have 'diagnosed' him from a book and are now lecturing him about it, which wouldn't make most people feel like engaging with the actual issues. Do you see what I mean?

W've tried counselling before, but it didn't work.
I gave him te list and he's not told me "to shove" it. I told him i'd written it and was it ok to give it to him. Up to him what he does with it now. I don't feel i've diagnosed him, it was actually by reading on mumsnet and doing more reading that i realised what his behaviour was - and it's not my fault. I wanted it all written down so he can clearly see what the issues are - he has a tendancy to forget, and bury issues. I felt this was harder to do if clearly written down

Ok- I hope it works for you both. It sounds very tiring and difficult for you to keep hold of this relationship though- do you have a cut off point in your mind of when enough is enough? Because if actual therapy made no difference, I'm wondering how you could ever go about 'fixing' this. Just don't exhaust yourself flogging a dead horse.

Thanks Bitoffun, I hope it works too. Yes it is tiring but there are alot of good aspects of his behaviour too an the bad doesn't happen as often as it used to. I just don't want to give u before trying everything possible....

It's bee a bit wierd tonight with neither of us mentioning the list agian, as agreed. Kind of feel i don't really know what to say.. Dreading him ranting or being horrible to me on Thurs eve (when we're supposed to be talking about it)....

I am sure that to get to this point you have been through every other harrowing stage of being a victim of EA. The list is rather clinical but with a true abuser it is the only way. As you prob know, the only hope of ending EA is where the perpetrator takes total and unconditional responsibility.

Of course if he rants and is horrible to you on Thurs eve the only available action is to leave. And you WILL know you have done everything you can to save your marriage.

Well done, trust your instincts.

Thanks mumonthenet The scary thing is i don't want to give up on the good parts of being together and worry about how life will be if we split up.

Am very nervous about how he'll be on thurs - he says he really wants us to stay together but actions speak louder than words and if he does start ranting and being nasty and refusing to take any responsibility on thurs, i guess i have my answer

Well looks like i have my answer earlier on i asked him if he minded me asking something about the list before thurs - he said it was ok. Asked if he'd read it all, he said yes and asked if he understood al the terminology, he said yes. So i said taht's good, wasn't sure if you'd know what gaslighting and stonewalling meant - he said he didn't ! I was upset he hadn't completely told the truth, he said he' understood all mu examples.

He;s promised to od some dancing with ds before this and then he tol ds he wouldn't because mummy had made him not feel like it Ds cried aand cried

H said it's my fault for talkign about it b4 for thurs, but i did ask and he agreed...

In my ignorance I also don't know what gaslighting is?

*Buttonmoon gaslighting is a form of intimidation or psychological abuse where false information is presented to the victim, making them doubt their own memory and perception

Poor you and poor ds. Does he often do this kind of thing to ds?

I'm sorry, but I couldn't feel any love for him if he treated ds is this way.

No it's not happened very often - maybe 3or 4 times (in 4 years) It makes me so sad, bad enough me and him arguing without punishing ds too

And to think he made the little lad cry - just to make a point and punish you further because that's what he was doing don't you think?

Do you not believe your child would be happier out of this environment? Sorry, but I do.

Thank you for explaining! Sounds like a problem to me (as in overall not just the gaslighting). If he's not prepared to sort it then it's over IMO. I know from experience - we're currently resident in Last Chance Saloon.

he's just been blaiming me for it all now and saying he bahaves in those ways because i make him angry and i'm negative.

All i want to do atm is make up feel peaceful and get a good night's sleep

He said a few miutea ago he didn't dance with ds because he felt too miserable to

'He said a few miutea ago he didn't dance with ds because he felt too miserable to'...

He's being self-indulgent and childish.

If he will allow you to make-up, feel peaceful and get some sleep, I absolutely don't blame you for wanting that for yourself.

Yes, you might get on his nerves, we all have to deal with annoying partners sometimes but you don't 'make him' behave in such an appalling way, especially towards ds.

Do you love him?

Blimey, onelast, you're impressive! I can exactly imagine the state of mind you had to be in, to instigate this relationship review and to do it with such precision. Did you choose your method so he couldn't persuade you you were wrong / mistaken / overemotional / oversensitive?

You seem to be living with an overgrown toddler, whose own feelings are all that matters to him, and who's quick to blame 'Mummy' (you) if he doesn't feel good. He's so emotionally juvenile that he's ready to try manipulating your son to emotionally blackmail you (and take sides); also, like a toddler, he'll lie blatantly if he thinks it will serve him. Problem is, he's not a toddler! You already have a child and children grow out of their phases. Your DH, unfortunately, is the grown-up man who is supposed to support and sustain you. Something went wrong ...

I'm very sorry that you're going through this - for me, becoming cut-and-dried about it was the only way I could survive; it was a form of retreat, if you like. I hear you saying he's usually OK, and is only 'bad' once in a while - but, frankly, I don't believe it. I think it more likely there is a constant trickle of low-level control & gaslighting going on, so you're permanently on edge. In your good times, do you still feel a bit 'on your best behaviour' and/or second-guessing what he'll want?

I've probably written enough here (sorry for length!) I do admire your common sense in addressing this in an undeniable fashion. I hope you won't be overly swayed by the DELUSION of the good times - a cute toddler is a joy to be around, but when he's a grown-up and your life partner??

Thanks Grace. I choe to write it down to make it clearer and to have a record of it.

Most of the time he is ok, and if i never challenged him everything would be ok, not great but ok

Had a really bad night, had to use wine and nightnurse to get some sleep. H knows i used nightnurse to sleepwhen things are like this. I've rum out and he threatened not to buy me any more because i wasn't being polite to him. No i probably didn't ask very politely but just the sight of him after yesterday is horrible.

I'm having to reoly on him atm as i have a broken ankle and can't do much. I know from other threads this sort of injury can put a strain on rlationships but all these issues happend long, long before any injury.

Just can't stop crying atm, am at a loss for what to do

Gad, onelast, He really doesn't get it does he?

What he did re the dancing with your DS is classic emotional abuse...his bad behaviour is YOUR fault. And now he's punishing your ds as well.

I think you need to plan to leave soon, if only temporarily. I don't think your Thursday talk is going to resolve anything. Your DH has a very long way to go before he

a) understands what emotional abuse is
and b) is able to take on board the fact that he is totally responsible for his behaviour.

Of course you are tired and sad, you just want your home and your relationship to be your haven. I really hope that one day it can be.

And remember, those good times you have?...You can have them still - with friends, family, alone, with him, without him, whatever -
you will laugh again,
have friends over,
go on holiday,
sleep well,
create memories,
make plans,
all that stuff... HE is not your ONLY option.

OP...you know that second "list" of his "good points" you made ?

It doesn't cancel out the first list, no way-no-how...

x posted onelast.

So sorry you had a bad night.

How awful to have to rely on him.

Can you go out anywhere today?

Thanks for all your replies I know i'm not perfect and some times i'm sure i can be annoying.

he's just been acting like nothing has happened most of the morning, asking if i want a drink, food, etc. He's gone to work now.

I can't go out yet on my own unfort, ankle not yet strong enough . A friend is coming over later with her little ones. - will be nice for ds to have a play

He said he thought it was ok not to dance with ds because of how he was feeling. Wven if he'd apologised to ds and said he couldn't dance atm it would have been just about ok (i know dancing is the last thing you feel like doing when angry/upset)but just to to him no and leave him cry is horrible

I'm so scared about how things will be if we split up. I gave up work when i had ds and love being a sahm and so want to be able to take and collect ds from school (he starts reception in sept)